Why NBA teams shouldn't invest big in centers

[Monster]

This is something I have thought about for a while and I think its an interesting discussion point. We have the example of Pek a productive center that is injured a lot because well he is big a center and past the age of 25-27 when basically all centers start missing games. Pek will likely miss more than that average but the point is once you hit that age the number are against you.

But centers are important on both sides of the court (even more on defense) are teams just supposed to get by with cheap signings and Lower first round picks? Maybe that's my argument. When Cousins gets his next contract and starts missing games...where will his value be around the league? I'm saying that and I am a big fan of his talent and he is the most talented center in the league.

High draft pick? Do you take a center top 5 or top 3 knowing it will take a couple years to develop him and then there is maybe only a couple more years before that guy starts missing 15+ games every year? If he is BPA and you have no center it's a no brainer but I think this is something to think about. Thoughts?

[Hicks123 [enjin:6700838]]

Yeah, it's a good point and hard to argue. Centers certainly seem to miss a lot more games over the course of a career. That being said, a great one like Howard, Gasol, etc certainly make those teams a LOT better when they play.

And in the specific case of the Wolves, I think we know that we desperately need an anchor at either the PF or Center spot to help with interior defense. We just can't be very good unless we drastically improve this area.

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

Good thoughts Monster. Centers can take a long time to develop (believe me, anyone that thinks Towns is going to walk in the door next year and suddenly change our defense will be terribly disappointed) AND they have a notorious history with injuries.

What's interesting though is how many really good defensive Centers have been drafted with later picks:

DeAndre Jordan - 35th (One of the guys we could have had in that draft, to Lip's disappointment!)
Hibbert - 17th
Gobert - 27th (another guy we could have had! He's turned Utah into the NBA's #1 defense lately)
Marc Gasol - 45th
Whiteside - 33rd
Nurkic - 16th

At these levels, they become lower-risk picks because you aren't paying them a ton of money and you can bring them on a bit more slowly. It's different than how much is at stake when you invest a top 5 pick in that position.

Dieng was supposed to be our version of a relatively low-cost, defensive Center, but it turns out he simply can't compete on that side of the floor. I don't completely blame Flip for this. Louisville played a zone and Dieng didn't get tested trying to play one on one post defense against 250 lbs opponents in college. It was hard to anticipate the difficulties he'd have defensively in the NBA. But it also goes to show that being tall/lengthy does not necessarily translate to protecting the paint.

[Monster]

Good thoughts Monster. Centers can take a long time to develop (believe me, anyone that thinks Towns is going to walk in the door next year and suddenly change our defense will be terribly disappointed) AND they have a notorious history with injuries.

What's interesting though is how many really good defensive Centers have been drafted with later picks:

DeAndre Jordan - 35th (One of the guys we could have had in that draft, to Lip's disappointment!)
Hibbert - 17th
Gobert - 27th (another guy we could have had! He's turned Utah into the NBA's #1 defense lately)
Marc Gasol - 45th
Whiteside - 33rd
Nurkic - 16th

At these levels, they become lower-risk picks because you aren't paying them a ton of money and you can bring them on a bit more slowly. It's different than how much is at stake when you invest a top 5 pick in that position.

Dieng was supposed to be our version of a relatively low-cost, defensive Center, but it turns out he simply can't compete on that side of the floor. I don't completely blame Flip for this. Louisville played a zone and Dieng didn't get tested trying to play one on one post defense against 250 lbs opponents in college. It was hard to anticipate the difficulties he'd have defensively in the NBA. But it also goes to show that being tall/lengthy does not necessarily translate to protecting the paint.

Q you outlined the options of drafting C lower very well. I'd add that why not sign some cheap vet centers like dalembert. Right now the C position is very deep compared to years ago (furthers Q's premise of best talent the league has ever seen) and you can get functional guys cheap. Look at a guy like Koufus who is a pretty solid guy and is pretty cheap. A few years ago he would have been in demand as a starter. That's a guy we should have kept. Also can we quit with the Deandre Jordan OR Pek conversations? We could have had them both. Just looking again that was a heck of a 2nd round Asik went #38 which continues to illustrate my point.

[Papalrep]

Ok, lets say we pick 2nd. Towns or Okafor is gone. Do we take the other one, or take Mudiay or Russell ahead of the big?

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

Ok, lets say we pick 2nd. Towns or Okafor is gone. Do we take the other one, or take Mudiay or Russell ahead of the big?

You take the best player on your draft board. That'll vary from poster to poster, but the pick for me would be whichever one of Towns/Okafor is available.

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

Good thoughts Monster. Centers can take a long time to develop (believe me, anyone that thinks Towns is going to walk in the door next year and suddenly change our defense will be terribly disappointed) AND they have a notorious history with injuries.

What's interesting though is how many really good defensive Centers have been drafted with later picks:

DeAndre Jordan - 35th (One of the guys we could have had in that draft, to Lip's disappointment!)
Hibbert - 17th
Gobert - 27th (another guy we could have had! He's turned Utah into the NBA's #1 defense lately)
Marc Gasol - 45th
Whiteside - 33rd
Nurkic - 16th

At these levels, they become lower-risk picks because you aren't paying them a ton of money and you can bring them on a bit more slowly. It's different than how much is at stake when you invest a top 5 pick in that position.

Dieng was supposed to be our version of a relatively low-cost, defensive Center, but it turns out he simply can't compete on that side of the floor. I don't completely blame Flip for this. Louisville played a zone and Dieng didn't get tested trying to play one on one post defense against 250 lbs opponents in college. It was hard to anticipate the difficulties he'd have defensively in the NBA. But it also goes to show that being tall/lengthy does not necessarily translate to protecting the paint.

Q you outlined the options of drafting C lower very well. I'd add that why not sign some cheap vet centers like dalembert. Right now the C position is very deep compared to years ago (furthers Q's premise of best talent the league has ever seen) and you can get functional guys cheap. Look at a guy like Koufus who is a pretty solid guy and is pretty cheap. A few years ago he would have been in demand as a starter. That's a guy we should have kept. Also can we quit with the Deandre Jordan OR Pek conversations? We could have had them both. Just looking again that was a heck of a 2nd round Asik went #38 which continues to illustrate my point.

Monster, The Center position has really had an infusion of strong talent over the last 5 years or so. There are a LOT of decent Centers out there. I totally forgot about Asik, yet another 2nd round bargain. Mozgov seems to be thriving in Cleveland. You mentioned Koufos too. Damn, wouldn't he be nice to have on our roster right now!?

What's funny is that the true shooting guard role is probably the shallowest position in the NBA. It's just hard to find one that can do everything you'd ideally want them to do these days: Shoot, score, run the offense on occasion, defend their position, etc. I still think Manu Ginobilli is the closest thing to the ideal non-Jordan/Kobe version of an NBA shooting guard. This is why D'Angelo Russell intrigues me a lot. He can do a lot of things both on and off the ball.

[Papalrep]

Monster-- Look at a guy like Koufus who is a pretty solid guy and is pretty cheap. A few years ago he would have been in demand as a starter. That's a guy we should have kept.

I remember Jim Pete saying that Koufos and Love did not get along, so Koufos had to go. Damn you Love! I actually remember the draft where DeAndre Jordan was still on the board. Oh Well. Lets not get into missed opportunities by this club or we will be here all night.