Brooklyn_Wolves wrote:As for the offense I just think we got a bunch of guys who can flop their way to FT line and knock them down. Take away our free throws and we'd look miserable.
Take away Lebron's free throws and he's not one of the best players of all time. Drawing fouls at a high rate is a skill, not luck or happenstance. There's a reason some guys can consistently draw fouls while most of the league can't. That's supposed to be a benefit of having such an athletic core. They're hard to defend straight up when they go to the basket as it is so if they throw in a wrinkle or two to catch the defender off guard it's pretty easy to draw a foul. In Wiggins' case he draws fouls at such a high rate because he literally can hang in the air for about a second longer than the rest of the league so as long as he protects the ball he's going to get fouled. Ricky is a crafty ball handler so it's hard to play him too tight because he can make dribbles that open him up to the lane if you gamble on a steal and then he's good a drawing contact with his man on his hip when he drives the lane. These are skills our guys use to draw fouls and it's a reason it's not a fluke how many fouls we draw every game.
yes, that my point, we have players that know how to draw contact or flop. I doubt it's Sam's offense that causes the effect. It's the players themselves.
I guess I just didn't understand the choosing of the word flop then. It downplays it like they are just lucky to get calls when they are flopping around out there when in fact most of them aren't flopping their way to fouls most notably Wiggins. He could probably get double the calls he's getting now and it would make sense with how he attacks the basket. Martin and occasionally Ricky are the only one's who flop and they don't get that call very often. And yes the players drawing fouls isn't Sam's offense. That's just how good our players are at getting to the basket and drawing the foul.
To be fair, Memphis and the Wolves announcing crew thought Wiggins got away with a couple of flops late...
Evened out from earlier...? But 2x the calls? I'm not sold that wiggins deserves to lead the L in free throws by a wide margin.
A foul should be called as a foul, not "well this guy's been to the line too much already to call it". He has a unique ability of hanging in the air for as long as he does that not many have so why shouldn't he lead the league in FTA's if he uses it right? Harden draws a boatload of fouls with the way he attacks the basket. Should the refs just stop calling fouls where guy's hack down on his arms and miss just because he's good at protecting the ball and making guy's catch his arms? Wiggins was getting 10+ FTA's per game to close out last year so how do you explain the drop to 7.3 overall this year when he's attacking just as much? I think he draws enough contact to make him a top 3 FTA guy, not the top 8 he is now. Over time it makes a big difference if he got just 2 more calls a game. Harden has taken 117 more free throws than the next closest guy who is Cousins who draws so many that he's played 8 less games than the third place guy (Derozan) and still has taken 20 more FT's than him. So maybe double was a poor way to put it, but Wiggins could definitely be getting more calls with the way he attacks the basket.
Brooklyn_Wolves wrote:As for the offense I just think we got a bunch of guys who can flop their way to FT line and knock them down. Take away our free throws and we'd look miserable.
Take away Lebron's free throws and he's not one of the best players of all time. Drawing fouls at a high rate is a skill, not luck or happenstance. There's a reason some guys can consistently draw fouls while most of the league can't. That's supposed to be a benefit of having such an athletic core. They're hard to defend straight up when they go to the basket as it is so if they throw in a wrinkle or two to catch the defender off guard it's pretty easy to draw a foul. In Wiggins' case he draws fouls at such a high rate because he literally can hang in the air for about a second longer than the rest of the league so as long as he protects the ball he's going to get fouled. Ricky is a crafty ball handler so it's hard to play him too tight because he can make dribbles that open him up to the lane if you gamble on a steal and then he's good a drawing contact with his man on his hip when he drives the lane. These are skills our guys use to draw fouls and it's a reason it's not a fluke how many fouls we draw every game.
yes, that my point, we have players that know how to draw contact or flop. I doubt it's Sam's offense that causes the effect. It's the players themselves.
I guess I just didn't understand the choosing of the word flop then. It downplays it like they are just lucky to get calls when they are flopping around out there when in fact most of them aren't flopping their way to fouls most notably Wiggins. He could probably get double the calls he's getting now and it would make sense with how he attacks the basket. Martin and occasionally Ricky are the only one's who flop and they don't get that call very often. And yes the players drawing fouls isn't Sam's offense. That's just how good our players are at getting to the basket and drawing the foul.
To be fair, Memphis and the Wolves announcing crew thought Wiggins got away with a couple of flops late...
Evened out from earlier...? But 2x the calls? I'm not sold that wiggins deserves to lead the L in free throws by a wide margin.
A foul should be called as a foul, not "well this guy's been to the line too much already to call it". He has a unique ability of hanging in the air for as long as he does that not many have so why shouldn't he lead the league in FTA's if he uses it right? Harden draws a boatload of fouls with the way he attacks the basket. Should the refs just stop calling fouls where guy's hack down on his arms and miss just because he's good at protecting the ball and making guy's catch his arms? Wiggins was getting 10+ FTA's per game to close out last year so how do you explain the drop to 7.3 overall this year when he's attacking just as much? I think he draws enough contact to make him a top 3 FTA guy, not the top 8 he is now. Over time it makes a big difference if he got just 2 more calls a game. Harden has taken 117 more free throws than the next closest guy who is Cousins who draws so many that he's played 8 less games than the third place guy (Derozan) and still has taken 20 more FT's than him. So maybe double was a poor way to put it, but Wiggins could definitely be getting more calls with the way he attacks the basket.
I never said not to call the foul.
I just didnt think Wiggins is deserving of 14.6 fta per game... I see your last comment...I think we agree.
Duke13 wrote:I'm a new poster, long time reader. I hate coming on here bashing Rubio but it's so frustrating to watch game after game. Your primary ball handler can't be that bad on offense, not able to beat his guy off the dribble or just unable to score in any way. Chris Dunn may not be the best player in this draft but I'd take him as a fit on this team over anyone. For those who haven't watched him, I encourage you to do so. He's a beast, truly makes guys better and provides a threat at the same time. Results mean absolutely nothing in the grand scheme of things in my opinion. As long as Zack, Wig and KAT get minutes and build confidence let roll. Wig showed of some passing and creating tonight. Zack needs to get better in the PnR and force the action with his dribble to make the defend react or commit, he lacks the confidence or patience to probe with his dribble. That will come, we can only hope the coaching staff is working on this. Zack's shot is a thing of beauty tho.
Welcome to the board. Is anyone worried about Dunn's FT%?
One thing I really like about Wiggins is that he doesn't use any chicanery to draw fouls. No rip-through moves; no arm bars; no putting his shoulder into a guy and then feigning that the other guy initiated contact.
While perhaps he'll eventually deploy some of these little tricks of the trade, I like that he is a "purist" when it comes to drawing fouls.
