Sundog wrote: ↑Sat Nov 18, 2023 8:57 pm
Cmon Q … enjoy the start to the season. There will be plenty of time to worry about things like that later on.
Believe it or not, I can have two feelings at the same time without them being in conflict with each other: A) I'm loving the winning and enjoying the team; and B) I don't believe they will be good enough to go deep in the playoffs this year.
Now do you have a counter-argument or pushback to the substance of my argument?
Q I guess I would argue that Rudy has never played with the talent he has on this team. Who’s the best player ever played with before joining the wolves? A young 21 year old Donovan Mitchell who’s a turnstile on defense?
I would argue they gave the NBA Champs there best series without McDaniels last year where Murrary Killed us.
Where a deeper team now that’s just missing a back up point guard which we should be able to get for 2nd round picks at the deadline.
My thing always with Rudy is he doesn’t need to be franchise that’s Ant and Kat job. We just need him to play his role at High level which even with his weaknesses he’s done that so far in begging of this season. If Ant doesn’t develops into that playoff killer and Kat plays like he has in past postseason all of this doesn’t matter anyway.
Well, you're right about Ant and KAT needing to step up in the playoffs or it won't matter.
But yes, I think we can matchup pretty well with some teams in the playoffs. Denver is one of them. But I think we lose a series against Phoenix IF they are healthy, which is a big question mark. Heck, I think Phoenix could be a Finals favorite if they stay healthy. Elite shooting trumps almost everything else and they have three guys that can absolutely catch fire. You just can't defend that.
I think the Kings are another team that could be a really tough matchup for us. They can put Sabonis out there with a bunch of shooting and quickness with Fox.
Carlos Danger wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 9:57 am
Well, this is a bold thread considering we are off to one of the best starts in Wolve's history - ha! But obviously everyone has a right to their own opinions. I do not share in the "Lip was right" mindset. I do understand the logic of that mindset. It's not a horrible take by any means. But Tim Connelly has a heck of a basketball resume. And he gets paid a shit ton of money to advise on these things. No offense to Q and/or Lip, but I'm going side with TC unless this thing blows up.
Last year was tough. Rudy wasn't as good with us as he had been in Utah. We floundered around .500 all last year and never looked "right". It was understandable to think we screwed up getting Rudy. But TC doubled down by picking up Conley and basically running everyone else back. So far, nobody should be complaining about the results.
How will this play out in the playoffs? Good question. None of us can possibly know for sure. There are going to be injuries between and then. We will likely shuffle a player or two on the roster between now and then. And I'm sure a lot will depend on what the actual match ups end up being. All I can say is I'm enjoying checking scores and seeing my team with more points than the other team.
As far as debating the trade itself and what we gave up, I think that will always be a separate argument. Probably most of us agreed at the time we gave up too much. But I see Kessler is off to a slow start this year (zero VORP). Keyonte George is negative VORP. Both guys are young and probably will improve. But, right now, I feel better about the cost myself - as long as we continue to improve with deeper runs into the playoffs.
Good thoughts Carlos. To be clear, the purpose of my thread isn't to re-litigate the Gobert trade, as I do see upside to it even if we don't contend for a title while he's on his current contract. Like I said, he gives this team a high floor with his defense and it means Ant and Jaden get to play winning basketball while still young in their careers. That's really important.
But I think Lip was right in his fundamental arguments about why he didn't like the trade when it comes to Gobert the player. He gives us a high floor, but also lowers the ceiling in my opinion.
And yeah, it is nice to see Kessler struggling a bit. Being a starter vs. a bench Center is a big difference!
One thing I won't rule out that sort of splits the baby on this is resigning Gobert to a longer, cheaper yearly contract that allows him to still be a big part of the team, but throttles back his role over time where he becomes more of a token starting Center that often sits during crunch time and at the end of halves. His stature, ego, and current contract doesn't allow for that, but may be he accepts this sort of role on his next contract.
Believe it or not, I can have two feelings at the same time without them being in conflict with each other: A) I'm loving the winning and enjoying the team; and B) I don't believe they will be good enough to go deep in the playoffs this year.
Now do you have a counter-argument or pushback to the substance of my argument?
Q I guess I would argue that Rudy has never played with the talent he has on this team. Who’s the best player ever played with before joining the wolves? A young 21 year old Donovan Mitchell who’s a turnstile on defense?
I would argue they gave the NBA Champs there best series without McDaniels last year where Murrary Killed us.
Where a deeper team now that’s just missing a back up point guard which we should be able to get for 2nd round picks at the deadline.
My thing always with Rudy is he doesn’t need to be franchise that’s Ant and Kat job. We just need him to play his role at High level which even with his weaknesses he’s done that so far in begging of this season. If Ant doesn’t develops into that playoff killer and Kat plays like he has in past postseason all of this doesn’t matter anyway.
Well, you're right about Ant and KAT needing to step up in the playoffs or it won't matter.
But yes, I think we can matchup pretty well with some teams in the playoffs. Denver is one of them. But I think we lose a series against Phoenix IF they are healthy, which is a big question mark. Heck, I think Phoenix could be a Finals favorite if they stay healthy. Elite shooting trumps almost everything else and they have three guys that can absolutely catch fire. You just can't defend that.
I think the Kings are another team that could be a really tough matchup for us. They can put Sabonis out there with a bunch of shooting and quickness with Fox.
Yeah, Phoenix is going to be really tough if healthy...elite shooting team. But does anybody really think they will ever be healthy? Beal's back problems sound like they are going to bother him for a long time, and Durant is 35 with a history of missing many games. We'll have to see. I agree we match up well against Denver, but I also think we match up well with the Kings. We were 3-1 against them last season, and should have won the 4th (they beat us in OT despite Sabonis having fouled out), and I think we have improved over last year more than them. Golden State can be an elite shooting team, but we're 2-0 against then this year, and their announcing team laments their lack of size against us.
Bottom line? I think there's no team in the West that we can't beat in a 7-game series. Boston is a another matter and I'm curious to see how we do against Philly and the Bucks, but I like our chances in the West at least.
Carlos Danger wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 9:57 am
Well, this is a bold thread considering we are off to one of the best starts in Wolve's history - ha! But obviously everyone has a right to their own opinions. I do not share in the "Lip was right" mindset. I do understand the logic of that mindset. It's not a horrible take by any means. But Tim Connelly has a heck of a basketball resume. And he gets paid a shit ton of money to advise on these things. No offense to Q and/or Lip, but I'm going side with TC unless this thing blows up.
Last year was tough. Rudy wasn't as good with us as he had been in Utah. We floundered around .500 all last year and never looked "right". It was understandable to think we screwed up getting Rudy. But TC doubled down by picking up Conley and basically running everyone else back. So far, nobody should be complaining about the results.
How will this play out in the playoffs? Good question. None of us can possibly know for sure. There are going to be injuries between and then. We will likely shuffle a player or two on the roster between now and then. And I'm sure a lot will depend on what the actual match ups end up being. All I can say is I'm enjoying checking scores and seeing my team with more points than the other team.
As far as debating the trade itself and what we gave up, I think that will always be a separate argument. Probably most of us agreed at the time we gave up too much. But I see Kessler is off to a slow start this year (zero VORP). Keyonte George is negative VORP. Both guys are young and probably will improve. But, right now, I feel better about the cost myself - as long as we continue to improve with deeper runs into the playoffs.
Carlos - You should embrace the Lip was right mindset on everything.
Carlos Danger wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 9:57 am
Well, this is a bold thread considering we are off to one of the best starts in Wolve's history - ha! But obviously everyone has a right to their own opinions. I do not share in the "Lip was right" mindset. I do understand the logic of that mindset. It's not a horrible take by any means. But Tim Connelly has a heck of a basketball resume. And he gets paid a shit ton of money to advise on these things. No offense to Q and/or Lip, but I'm going side with TC unless this thing blows up.
Last year was tough. Rudy wasn't as good with us as he had been in Utah. We floundered around .500 all last year and never looked "right". It was understandable to think we screwed up getting Rudy. But TC doubled down by picking up Conley and basically running everyone else back. So far, nobody should be complaining about the results.
How will this play out in the playoffs? Good question. None of us can possibly know for sure. There are going to be injuries between and then. We will likely shuffle a player or two on the roster between now and then. And I'm sure a lot will depend on what the actual match ups end up being. All I can say is I'm enjoying checking scores and seeing my team with more points than the other team.
As far as debating the trade itself and what we gave up, I think that will always be a separate argument. Probably most of us agreed at the time we gave up too much. But I see Kessler is off to a slow start this year (zero VORP). Keyonte George is negative VORP. Both guys are young and probably will improve. But, right now, I feel better about the cost myself - as long as we continue to improve with deeper runs into the playoffs.
Carlos - You should embrace the Lip was right mindset on everything.
Ha! I wake up every morning and turn on my computer hoping to see a new FNG was Right thread...I think I'll have more luck betting on an FNG was Wrong thread
Carlos Danger wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 9:57 am
Well, this is a bold thread considering we are off to one of the best starts in Wolve's history - ha! But obviously everyone has a right to their own opinions. I do not share in the "Lip was right" mindset. I do understand the logic of that mindset. It's not a horrible take by any means. But Tim Connelly has a heck of a basketball resume. And he gets paid a shit ton of money to advise on these things. No offense to Q and/or Lip, but I'm going side with TC unless this thing blows up.
Last year was tough. Rudy wasn't as good with us as he had been in Utah. We floundered around .500 all last year and never looked "right". It was understandable to think we screwed up getting Rudy. But TC doubled down by picking up Conley and basically running everyone else back. So far, nobody should be complaining about the results.
How will this play out in the playoffs? Good question. None of us can possibly know for sure. There are going to be injuries between and then. We will likely shuffle a player or two on the roster between now and then. And I'm sure a lot will depend on what the actual match ups end up being. All I can say is I'm enjoying checking scores and seeing my team with more points than the other team.
As far as debating the trade itself and what we gave up, I think that will always be a separate argument. Probably most of us agreed at the time we gave up too much. But I see Kessler is off to a slow start this year (zero VORP). Keyonte George is negative VORP. Both guys are young and probably will improve. But, right now, I feel better about the cost myself - as long as we continue to improve with deeper runs into the playoffs.
Carlos - You should embrace the Lip was right mindset on everything.
Ha! I wake up every morning and turn on my computer hoping to see a new FNG was Right thread...I think I'll have more luck betting on an FNG was Wrong thread
I’ll look for an opportunity to start the FNG was Wrong thread.
Believe it or not, I can have two feelings at the same time without them being in conflict with each other: A) I'm loving the winning and enjoying the team; and B) I don't believe they will be good enough to go deep in the playoffs this year.
Now do you have a counter-argument or pushback to the substance of my argument?
Q I guess I would argue that Rudy has never played with the talent he has on this team. Who’s the best player ever played with before joining the wolves? A young 21 year old Donovan Mitchell who’s a turnstile on defense?
I would argue they gave the NBA Champs there best series without McDaniels last year where Murrary Killed us.
Where a deeper team now that’s just missing a back up point guard which we should be able to get for 2nd round picks at the deadline.
My thing always with Rudy is he doesn’t need to be franchise that’s Ant and Kat job. We just need him to play his role at High level which even with his weaknesses he’s done that so far in begging of this season. If Ant doesn’t develops into that playoff killer and Kat plays like he has in past postseason all of this doesn’t matter anyway.
Well, you're right about Ant and KAT needing to step up in the playoffs or it won't matter.
But yes, I think we can matchup pretty well with some teams in the playoffs. Denver is one of them. But I think we lose a series against Phoenix IF they are healthy, which is a big question mark. Heck, I think Phoenix could be a Finals favorite if they stay healthy. Elite shooting trumps almost everything else and they have three guys that can absolutely catch fire. You just can't defend that.
I think the Kings are another team that could be a really tough matchup for us. They can put Sabonis out there with a bunch of shooting and quickness with Fox.
Phoenix is a team that would be favored I think if all healthy. That is a major question for sure considering age and history of injury. Durant / Booker and more or less Beal are just on another level both of which can ISO create their own and knock it down at an incredible rates which can beat elite defense. I'm not sure any other team has that fire power though who I would be concerned as much about.
I think to be a true contender we will need to add a good shooter that can play meaningful minutes. Not a Brynn Forbes type who you can't afford to play. This would complete our roster in my opinion and allow us to play with anyone.
I’ll look for an opportunity to start the FNG was Wrong thread. 
