WildWolf2813 wrote:Even if you wouldn't trade Zach for Wiggins, Zach LaVine would look pretty awful on the contract Wiggins has for us.
Zach would look better than Wiggins on that contract - much better. That's he point.
I don't know Lip, neither one has the chops to be a star in this league. They are both having decent, not great years. Would we be way better off with Zach? I doubt it.
WildWolf2813 wrote:Even if you wouldn't trade Zach for Wiggins, Zach LaVine would look pretty awful on the contract Wiggins has for us.
Zach would look better than Wiggins on that contract - much better. That's he point.
I don't know Lip, neither one has the chops to be a star in this league. They are both having decent, not great years. Would we be way better off with Zach? I doubt it.
I'd take Zach over Wiggins. And I think Zach is having close to an all-star season. But I have to agree with your central that neither one of those two is the star-caliber player the Wolves need to pair with KAT to become a contender. I don't think DLO is that player either.
WildWolf2813 wrote:Even if you wouldn't trade Zach for Wiggins, Zach LaVine would look pretty awful on the contract Wiggins has for us.
Zach would look better than Wiggins on that contract - much better. That's he point.
I don't know Lip, neither one has the chops to be a star in this league. They are both having decent, not great years. Would we be way better off with Zach? I doubt it.
I'd take Zach over Wiggins. And I think Zach is having close to an all-star season. But I have to agree with your central that neither one of those two is the star-caliber player the Wolves need to pair with KAT to become a contender. I don't think DLO is that player either.
You can take Zach over Wiggins but it's like saying you'd rather drown in a tub than jump off a bridge.
Listened to the Bill Simmons pod today w/ Ryen Russillo and they talked about lavine.
And of course they don't know everything but here were their comments on lavine. Lavine is now the next DeMarcus Cousins, he dosen't have a good relationship with his coach or teammates. He dosent make defensive rotations. In clutch situations this year lavine is #1 in usage and dead last in net rating in those situations.
They later named the all miserable team. They named Kat/beal/Dimwidde when Irving plays/ love. And finally lavine teammates having to watch lavine play basketball with them.
Once again these guys aren't the say all be all but just 2 more perspectives on lavine.
kekgeek1 wrote:Listened to the Bill Simmons pod today w/ Ryen Russillo and they talked about lavine.
And of course they don't know everything but here were their comments on lavine. Lavine is now the next DeMarcus Cousins, he dosen't have a good relationship with his coach or teammates. He makes defensive rotations. In clutch situations this year lavine is #1 in usage and dead last in net rating in those situations.
They later named the all miserable team. They named Kat/beal/Dimwidde when Irving plays/ love. And finally lavine teammates having to watch lavine play basketball with them.
Once again these guys aren't the say all be all but just 2 more perspectives on lavine.
That's why you can't just look the other way or dismiss these multi-year On/Off numbers. Something must be amiss if it's a trend that occurs over multiple years. What you relay from Simmons' podcast provides some insight as to the things that go just beyond what you can gleen from the standard box score stats.
Ive never seen someone with more basketball skill do less for winning than Lavine. Its uncanny how he takes the wind out of the sails of his team on both sides of the ball. Now watch him single-handedly beat the Wolves tonight.
thedoper wrote:Ive never seen someone with more basketball skill do less for winning than Lavine. Its uncanny how he takes the wind out of the sails of his team on both sides of the ball. Now watch him single-handedly beat the Wolves tonight.
Considering that LaVine, Wiggins and Towns have all been plagued by the same thing (look/lose the part)... is it a coincidence or telling that they were all "drafted" by the Wolves?
And it's also funny how 3 guys drafted by the Wolves also made the "all miserable" team.
Then again, any length of time in Minnesota, playing/watching the Wolves, is bound to make a person surly and miserable.
[Note: To be fair, Garnett proved INSTANTLY that he was not the one holding MN back. And Love won a title as a 3rd guy. Rubio made the playoffs as a starter after leaving. Billups proved to be a champion back in the day.]
thedoper wrote:Ive never seen someone with more basketball skill do less for winning than Lavine. Its uncanny how he takes the wind out of the sails of his team on both sides of the ball. Now watch him single-handedly beat the Wolves tonight.
Considering that LaVine, Wiggins and Towns have all been plagued by the same thing (look/lose the part)... is it a coincidence or telling that they were all "drafted" by the Wolves?
And it's also funny how 3 guys drafted by the Wolves also made the "all miserable" team.
Then again, any length of time in Minnesota, playing/watching the Wolves, is bound to make a person surly and miserable.
[Note: To be fair, Garnett proved INSTANTLY that he was not the one holding MN back. And Love won a title as a 3rd guy. Rubio made the playoffs as a starter after leaving. Billups proved to be a champion back in the day.]
The difference is that KAT and Wiggins have consistently had positive On/Off numbers, meaning they always outperform their backups in terms of Team Rating while on the floor. That doesn't necessarily mean they are awesome while on the floor, it just means that our bench has been HORRIBLE for a number of years now. LaVine literally helps his team when he sits. The same can't be said for the other two.
This discussion made me think of this... a trip down cursed memory lane...
I swear there's a Rick Mahorn curse hanging over this franchise.
Remember, after winning a title with Detroit... Rich Mahorn became the first Timberwolves player ever... being drafted #1 by the team in the NBA expansion draft. Heck, he was drafted over flashier players like Reggie Theus BECAUSE he was deemed a winner, while Theus was known as an empty stat guy. Irony?
Only, Mahorn was despondent that he was forced to leave a title team for a lousy expansion team -- and he refused to play for the Timberwolves.
In what was the first PROMISE OF HOPE trade/campaign... the Wolves traded the aging Mahorn to Philadelphia for a #1 draft pick! And two 2nd round draft picks! They could build a winning team on the same timeline as Pooh Richardson!
Mahorn won 53 games and made the 2nd round of the playoffs that season as a starter in Philly. He'd go on to make the playoffs for five more seasons for various teams.
Neither of the 2nd rd. picks made the NBA for the Wolves. Despite a little bit of promise while playing in blowouts... that #1 pick, Gerald Glass, didn't show any improvement and was eventually traded early in Year 3 for Lance Blanks, Brad Sellers and another 2nd rd pick(!!!)
Neither Blanks nor Sellers ever played NBA ball again after playing for the 63-loss Wolves. The 2nd rd. pick was never used.
Rick Mahorn definitely knew something 31 years ago... that many people are still struggling with today...
AbeVigodaLive wrote:This discussion made me think of this... a trip down cursed memory lane...
I swear there's a Rick Mahorn curse hanging over this franchise.
Remember, after winning a title with Detroit... Rich Mahorn became the first Timberwolves player ever... being drafted #1 by the team in the NBA expansion draft. Heck, he was drafted over flashier players like Reggie Theus BECAUSE he was deemed a winner, while Theus was known as an empty stat guy. Irony?
Only, Mahorn was despondent that he was forced to leave a title team for a lousy expansion team -- and he refused to play for the Timberwolves.
In what was the first PROMISE OF HOPE trade/campaign... the Wolves traded the aging Mahorn to Philadelphia for a #1 draft pick! And two 2nd round draft picks! They could build a winning team on the same timeline as Pooh Richardson!
Mahorn won 53 games and made the 2nd round of the playoffs that season as a starter in Philly. He'd go on to make the playoffs for five more seasons for various teams.
Neither of the 2nd rd. picks made the NBA for the Wolves. Despite a little bit of promise while playing in blowouts... that #1 pick, Gerald Glass, didn't show any improvement and was eventually traded early in Year 3 for Lance Blanks, Brad Sellers and another 2nd rd pick(!!!)
Neither Blanks nor Sellers ever played NBA ball again after playing for the 63-loss Wolves. The 2nd rd. pick was never used.
Rick Mahorn definitely knew something 31 years ago... that many people are still struggling with today...
Thank you for this trip down memory lane Abe. Mahorn would have looked great from the upper deck of the dome. I think when it's all said and done we just have to accept the KG era as a miracle in spite of Taylor and McHale trying desperately to make the worst out of that situation. There is little reason for hope ever with this franchise.
