Minnesota Sports Forum

khans2k5 wrote:At the end of the day Rosas and Ryan just need to swallow their pride and forget about this small ball bullshit. Use Ricky and Beasley to bring in real front court help. If you have Okogie/Culver or another 3 who can defend with a 4 who can actually defend then Russell/Edwards/Towns is something that can be built around. There are a ton of terrible defending PG's in the NBA. Russell isn't the first and he won't be the last. Towns stretches the floor so there isn't a need for a 4 who needs to stretch the floor as well. The experiment failed. The team is complete trash without Towns because they are just at a significant size disadvantage every night. Turn the veteran guards into a wing with actual size or an actual PF and kill two birds with one stone clearing up the backcourt log jam and filling in a significant hole.

You're right about the need to ditch this small ball crap. But we both know deep down that Rosas and Ryan won't do that.

As for Russell, I wish poor defense were his only problem. But he's also a drag offensively. He's a below average athlete with below average quickness for his position and while he's a good perimeter shooter, he's not elite. Most importantly, he doesn't facilitate good ball movement and doesn't make his teammates better. Statistically, he's had a negative impact on the offensive end throughout almost his entire 5-year career. Add to that a lazy, careless streak that's just plain weird and you have a guy who has an overall negative impact on the team with some really good games in between.

Beasley is one of the few guys on this team I wouldn't trade. He's a good 3-point shooter on a team that has no elite 3-point shooters other than KAT. More importantly, he plays with toughness and heart - a couple other things in short supply on this team.

We need a new owner who should then replace Rosas and Gersson's replacement should then replace Ryan. That won't happen, if at all, until after this season. So in the meantime, we'll have to suffer while hopefully taking some solace in the development of Edwards, Culver and Vanderbilt.

It doesn't matter if Beasley is one of the few guys who can hit 3's. It doesn't matter if Ricky is one of the few guys who plays for his teammates. Russell isn't getting traded because of his contract and you shouldn't want Edwards to be traded based on what he's shown at 19 in the NBA. That means your tradeable assets are the two veteran role players who aren't long term pieces for the team. Beasley certainly doesn't fit next to Russell/Edwards and while Ricky could, the defense on the wing and front court is just needed that much more. If people like J Mac and Nowell so much why is clearing out players in front of them to fill other holes on the team a bad thing? It makes literally no sense to just sit here and suffer when we know Russell/Towns is here to stay and Edwards should be untouchable based on what he's shown to date. 1/2/5 are done. We know those pieces. Go get size, length and defense to go with them.

khans2k5 wrote:It doesn't matter if Beasley is one of the few guys who can hit 3's. It doesn't matter if Ricky is one of the few guys who plays for his teammates. Russell isn't getting traded because of his contract and you shouldn't want Edwards to be traded based on what he's shown at 19 in the NBA. That means your tradeable assets are the two veteran role players who aren't long term pieces for the team. Beasley certainly doesn't fit next to Russell/Edwards and while Ricky could, the defense on the wing and front court is just needed that much more. If people like J Mac and Nowell so much why is clearing out players in front of them to fill other holes on the team a bad thing? It makes literally no sense to just sit here and suffer when we know Russell/Towns is here to stay and Edwards should be untouchable based on what he's shown to date. 1/2/5 are done. We know those pieces. Go get size, length and defense to go with them.

You know that isn't happening with Rosas running the show.

CoolBreeze44 wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:It doesn't matter if Beasley is one of the few guys who can hit 3's. It doesn't matter if Ricky is one of the few guys who plays for his teammates. Russell isn't getting traded because of his contract and you shouldn't want Edwards to be traded based on what he's shown at 19 in the NBA. That means your tradeable assets are the two veteran role players who aren't long term pieces for the team. Beasley certainly doesn't fit next to Russell/Edwards and while Ricky could, the defense on the wing and front court is just needed that much more. If people like J Mac and Nowell so much why is clearing out players in front of them to fill other holes on the team a bad thing? It makes literally no sense to just sit here and suffer when we know Russell/Towns is here to stay and Edwards should be untouchable based on what he's shown to date. 1/2/5 are done. We know those pieces. Go get size, length and defense to go with them.

You know that isn't happening with Rosas running the show.

You can play small, but you need length to do it. For example and this won't be popular but if you swapped Ricky or Beasley for Rudy Gay we'd still be small, but we'd be significantly better off size wise. Go get a Gay or an MKG or another 3/4 wing with length and it's still small ball but with a bigger player. It isn't a requirement that everyone be 6'6 or shorter to play small ball.

khans2k5 wrote:

CoolBreeze44 wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:It doesn't matter if Beasley is one of the few guys who can hit 3's. It doesn't matter if Ricky is one of the few guys who plays for his teammates. Russell isn't getting traded because of his contract and you shouldn't want Edwards to be traded based on what he's shown at 19 in the NBA. That means your tradeable assets are the two veteran role players who aren't long term pieces for the team. Beasley certainly doesn't fit next to Russell/Edwards and while Ricky could, the defense on the wing and front court is just needed that much more. If people like J Mac and Nowell so much why is clearing out players in front of them to fill other holes on the team a bad thing? It makes literally no sense to just sit here and suffer when we know Russell/Towns is here to stay and Edwards should be untouchable based on what he's shown to date. 1/2/5 are done. We know those pieces. Go get size, length and defense to go with them.

You know that isn't happening with Rosas running the show.

You can play small, but you need length to do it. For example and this won't be popular but if you swapped Ricky or Beasley for Rudy Gay we'd still be small, but we'd be significantly better off size wise. Go get a Gay or an MKG or another 3/4 wing with length and it's still small ball but with a bigger player. It isn't a requirement that everyone be 6'6 or shorter to play small ball.

Kahns - I think you're preaching to the choir. Unfortunately, as Cool pointed out, Rosas won't make any moves like the ones your described. Heck, he wouldn't even stick with RHJ as a minimum salary free agent. You mentioned MKG. Well I'd say that RHJ is exactly the same type of player only younger and better. We can quibble about what guards we would prefer to trade for more size, but we all agree that we need more size. Right now, we can bring RHJ back as a free agent without giving up anything. That's the immediate move to make. And then Rosas can explore various trades for players like Rudy Gay or Larry Nance Jr. But again, we're all in an echo chamber here while Rosas is in his own little world believing somehow that size no longer matters in the modern NBA. Kevin Lynch and Jim Peterson were both calling Rosas out for the lack of size on this roster. I just don't expect Rosas to do anything about it.

lipoli390 wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:

CoolBreeze44 wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:It doesn't matter if Beasley is one of the few guys who can hit 3's. It doesn't matter if Ricky is one of the few guys who plays for his teammates. Russell isn't getting traded because of his contract and you shouldn't want Edwards to be traded based on what he's shown at 19 in the NBA. That means your tradeable assets are the two veteran role players who aren't long term pieces for the team. Beasley certainly doesn't fit next to Russell/Edwards and while Ricky could, the defense on the wing and front court is just needed that much more. If people like J Mac and Nowell so much why is clearing out players in front of them to fill other holes on the team a bad thing? It makes literally no sense to just sit here and suffer when we know Russell/Towns is here to stay and Edwards should be untouchable based on what he's shown to date. 1/2/5 are done. We know those pieces. Go get size, length and defense to go with them.

You know that isn't happening with Rosas running the show.

You can play small, but you need length to do it. For example and this won't be popular but if you swapped Ricky or Beasley for Rudy Gay we'd still be small, but we'd be significantly better off size wise. Go get a Gay or an MKG or another 3/4 wing with length and it's still small ball but with a bigger player. It isn't a requirement that everyone be 6'6 or shorter to play small ball.

Kahns - I think you're preaching to the choir. Unfortunately, as Cool pointed out, Rosas won't make any moves like the ones your described. Heck, he wouldn't even stick with RHJ as a minimum salary free agent. You mentioned MKG. Well I'd say that RHJ is exactly the same type of player only younger and better. We can quibble about what guards we would prefer to trade for more size, but we all agree that we need more size. Right now, we can bring RHJ back as a free agent without giving up anything. That's the immediate move to make. And then Rosas can explore various trades for players like Rudy Gay or Larry Nance Jr. But again, we're all in an echo chamber here while Rosas is in his own little world believing somehow that size no longer matters in the modern NBA. Kevin Lynch and Jim Peterson were both calling Rosas out for the lack of size on this roster. I just don't expect Rosas to do anything about it.

We saw how many moves Rosas made at the deadline last year so why would he not do the same this year with things not working again? The guy makes moves. This idea that he's locked into this roster has no backing because he makes moves when things aren't working. It's not going to happen after 5 games, but we are not going into the second half of the season with the same roster if things continue to be this bad.

khans2k5 wrote:

lipoli390 wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:

CoolBreeze44 wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:It doesn't matter if Beasley is one of the few guys who can hit 3's. It doesn't matter if Ricky is one of the few guys who plays for his teammates. Russell isn't getting traded because of his contract and you shouldn't want Edwards to be traded based on what he's shown at 19 in the NBA. That means your tradeable assets are the two veteran role players who aren't long term pieces for the team. Beasley certainly doesn't fit next to Russell/Edwards and while Ricky could, the defense on the wing and front court is just needed that much more. If people like J Mac and Nowell so much why is clearing out players in front of them to fill other holes on the team a bad thing? It makes literally no sense to just sit here and suffer when we know Russell/Towns is here to stay and Edwards should be untouchable based on what he's shown to date. 1/2/5 are done. We know those pieces. Go get size, length and defense to go with them.

You know that isn't happening with Rosas running the show.

You can play small, but you need length to do it. For example and this won't be popular but if you swapped Ricky or Beasley for Rudy Gay we'd still be small, but we'd be significantly better off size wise. Go get a Gay or an MKG or another 3/4 wing with length and it's still small ball but with a bigger player. It isn't a requirement that everyone be 6'6 or shorter to play small ball.

Kahns - I think you're preaching to the choir. Unfortunately, as Cool pointed out, Rosas won't make any moves like the ones your described. Heck, he wouldn't even stick with RHJ as a minimum salary free agent. You mentioned MKG. Well I'd say that RHJ is exactly the same type of player only younger and better. We can quibble about what guards we would prefer to trade for more size, but we all agree that we need more size. Right now, we can bring RHJ back as a free agent without giving up anything. That's the immediate move to make. And then Rosas can explore various trades for players like Rudy Gay or Larry Nance Jr. But again, we're all in an echo chamber here while Rosas is in his own little world believing somehow that size no longer matters in the modern NBA. Kevin Lynch and Jim Peterson were both calling Rosas out for the lack of size on this roster. I just don't expect Rosas to do anything about it.

We saw how many moves Rosas made at the deadline last year so why would he not do the same this year with things not working again? The guy makes moves. This idea that he's locked into this roster has no backing because he makes moves when things aren't working. It's not going to happen after 5 games, but we are not going into the second half of the season with the same roster if things continue to be this bad.

Khans, Your still not listening, or rather, reading what others are saying....We know Rosas can and will churn the roster. No one here said he's "locked in" to it. The concern is that he's stuck on his system and is unwilling to go get a legit second big that can be paired effectively with KAT. Kudos to him if he comes to his senses and does just that before the trade deadline, but nothing he has said or done previously indicates a desire to do so.

What are you guys talking about with Rosas' roster being void of bigs?

How quickly we forget the Ed Davis trade!

Recap:
1. Knicks get TWO 2nd round picks to take on Ed Davis' salary.
2. Wolves give Knicks a 2nd round pick to take on Ed Davis' salary.

High price to pay for a 3rd string Center when the team doesn't even really have any PFs? Hogwash!

khans2k5 wrote:

lipoli390 wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:

CoolBreeze44 wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:It doesn't matter if Beasley is one of the few guys who can hit 3's. It doesn't matter if Ricky is one of the few guys who plays for his teammates. Russell isn't getting traded because of his contract and you shouldn't want Edwards to be traded based on what he's shown at 19 in the NBA. That means your tradeable assets are the two veteran role players who aren't long term pieces for the team. Beasley certainly doesn't fit next to Russell/Edwards and while Ricky could, the defense on the wing and front court is just needed that much more. If people like J Mac and Nowell so much why is clearing out players in front of them to fill other holes on the team a bad thing? It makes literally no sense to just sit here and suffer when we know Russell/Towns is here to stay and Edwards should be untouchable based on what he's shown to date. 1/2/5 are done. We know those pieces. Go get size, length and defense to go with them.

You know that isn't happening with Rosas running the show.

You can play small, but you need length to do it. For example and this won't be popular but if you swapped Ricky or Beasley for Rudy Gay we'd still be small, but we'd be significantly better off size wise. Go get a Gay or an MKG or another 3/4 wing with length and it's still small ball but with a bigger player. It isn't a requirement that everyone be 6'6 or shorter to play small ball.

Kahns - I think you're preaching to the choir. Unfortunately, as Cool pointed out, Rosas won't make any moves like the ones your described. Heck, he wouldn't even stick with RHJ as a minimum salary free agent. You mentioned MKG. Well I'd say that RHJ is exactly the same type of player only younger and better. We can quibble about what guards we would prefer to trade for more size, but we all agree that we need more size. Right now, we can bring RHJ back as a free agent without giving up anything. That's the immediate move to make. And then Rosas can explore various trades for players like Rudy Gay or Larry Nance Jr. But again, we're all in an echo chamber here while Rosas is in his own little world believing somehow that size no longer matters in the modern NBA. Kevin Lynch and Jim Peterson were both calling Rosas out for the lack of size on this roster. I just don't expect Rosas to do anything about it.

We saw how many moves Rosas made at the deadline last year so why would he not do the same this year with things not working again? The guy makes moves. This idea that he's locked into this roster has no backing because he makes moves when things aren't working. It's not going to happen after 5 games, but we are not going into the second half of the season with the same roster if things continue to be this bad.

You're not tracking with me. I'd not suggesting Rosas won't make roster moves. I'm simply suggesting that he won't make smart roster changes.

Rosas is obviously devoted to some ill-defined small-ball style or system. He seems convinced that size doesn't matter or that the players he has are big enough - either one of which means he's clueless.

This is the guy who wants to play fast, full-court basketball with lots of ball movement but who traded for a slow, half-court ball-dominant PG as his second star. He's the guy who wants to rely heavily on 3-point shots, but then added another non-shooter guard named Ricky to an already crowded non-shooting backcourt after drafting non-shooter Culver last year. He's the guy who gave Juancho a $7M per year contract, leaving the team with an incredibly unbalanced roster that lacks size and rebounding.

So yes, Rosas likes to make moves. But Rosas is the guy who created the problem - terrible roster balance and slavish devotion to an ill-defined "system" that doesn't appear to even fit the players he's brought in. Do you trust that guy to fix it? I don't.

lipoli390 wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:

lipoli390 wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:

CoolBreeze44 wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:It doesn't matter if Beasley is one of the few guys who can hit 3's. It doesn't matter if Ricky is one of the few guys who plays for his teammates. Russell isn't getting traded because of his contract and you shouldn't want Edwards to be traded based on what he's shown at 19 in the NBA. That means your tradeable assets are the two veteran role players who aren't long term pieces for the team. Beasley certainly doesn't fit next to Russell/Edwards and while Ricky could, the defense on the wing and front court is just needed that much more. If people like J Mac and Nowell so much why is clearing out players in front of them to fill other holes on the team a bad thing? It makes literally no sense to just sit here and suffer when we know Russell/Towns is here to stay and Edwards should be untouchable based on what he's shown to date. 1/2/5 are done. We know those pieces. Go get size, length and defense to go with them.

You know that isn't happening with Rosas running the show.

You can play small, but you need length to do it. For example and this won't be popular but if you swapped Ricky or Beasley for Rudy Gay we'd still be small, but we'd be significantly better off size wise. Go get a Gay or an MKG or another 3/4 wing with length and it's still small ball but with a bigger player. It isn't a requirement that everyone be 6'6 or shorter to play small ball.

Kahns - I think you're preaching to the choir. Unfortunately, as Cool pointed out, Rosas won't make any moves like the ones your described. Heck, he wouldn't even stick with RHJ as a minimum salary free agent. You mentioned MKG. Well I'd say that RHJ is exactly the same type of player only younger and better. We can quibble about what guards we would prefer to trade for more size, but we all agree that we need more size. Right now, we can bring RHJ back as a free agent without giving up anything. That's the immediate move to make. And then Rosas can explore various trades for players like Rudy Gay or Larry Nance Jr. But again, we're all in an echo chamber here while Rosas is in his own little world believing somehow that size no longer matters in the modern NBA. Kevin Lynch and Jim Peterson were both calling Rosas out for the lack of size on this roster. I just don't expect Rosas to do anything about it.

We saw how many moves Rosas made at the deadline last year so why would he not do the same this year with things not working again? The guy makes moves. This idea that he's locked into this roster has no backing because he makes moves when things aren't working. It's not going to happen after 5 games, but we are not going into the second half of the season with the same roster if things continue to be this bad.

You're not tracking with me. I'd not suggesting Rosas won't make roster moves. I'm simply suggesting that he won't make smart roster changes.

Rosas is obviously devoted to some ill-defined small-ball style or system. He seems convinced that size doesn't matter or that the players he has are big enough - either one of which means he's clueless.

This is the guy who wants to play fast, full-court basketball with lots of ball movement but who traded for a slow, half-court ball-dominant PG as his second star. He's the guy who wants to rely heavily on 3-point shots, but then added another non-shooter guard named Ricky to an already crowded non-shooting backcourt after drafting non-shooter Culver last year. He's the guy who gave Juancho a $7M per year contract, leaving the team with an incredibly unbalanced roster that lacks size and rebounding.

So yes, Rosas likes to make moves. But Rosas is the guy who created the problem - terrible roster balance and slavish devotion to an ill-defined "system" that doesn't appear to even fit the players he's brought in. Do you trust that guy to fix it? I don't.

So you are of the belief then that Rosas will just trade for different guards at the deadline?