Wolves Power Forward Position - What To Do?

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

Hoping kbd or patton emerge and be good enough to start is a stretch. It is the best cass scenario for us but unlikely to be next season. Im not as high on dieng as lip is.

Best scenario might be resigning taj to a short 1 yr deal or using the midlevel money.

1 name I will target is jordan bell of the warriors. Good defender and rebounder. Score efficiently and warriors are cap out and facing a klay thomson, kevin durant and cousins free agency.

Jordan Bell is a guy a number of us loved before last year's draft and then lamented not getting him in the Chicago trade (something Lip has been very vocal about). He'd be PERFECT next to KAT.

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

I think the league may have passed Dieng by in terms of him playing the 4. He'd be having to guard a lot of guys a lot more mobile than he is and then on the other end he couldn't really punish them because he's not known for being able to post up or get deep position.

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

But Patton can't even get on the court and when he did he didn't even shine at the G-League level.

Ehh, he did shine, just perhaps not as much defensively as some had hoped. However, I understand that until he plays consistently for the NBA team he's not going to get the benefit of the doubt around here because of the perception that he's soft, broken, and one of Thibs' choices -- which automatically puts you in the doghouse on this forum.

Patton in the G-League: 12.7 PPG (.526 TS%), 5.4 RPG, 1.6 APG, 1.0 SPG, 1.3 BPG in 23.1 MPG.

Extrapolating that to 36 minutes: 19.8 PPG (.526 TS%), 8.4 RPG, 2.5 APG, 1.6 SPG, 2.1 BPG.

He's uber-talented and I'd even say Karl-Anthony lite in that he has a similar set of tools and skills that he possesses. He has to get healthy, that's understood, but writing him off after he's really done nothing to deserve that is jumping the gun excessively.

[Monster]

But Patton can't even get on the court and when he did he didn't even shine at the G-League level.

Ehh, he did shine, just perhaps not as much defensively as some had hoped. However, I understand that until he plays consistently for the NBA team he's not going to get the benefit of the doubt around here because of the perception that he's soft, broken, and one of Thibs' choices -- which automatically puts you in the doghouse on this forum.

Patton in the G-League: 12.7 PPG (.526 TS%), 5.4 RPG, 1.6 APG, 1.0 SPG, 1.3 BPG in 23.1 MPG.

Extrapolating that to 36 minutes: 19.8 PPG (.526 TS%), 8.4 RPG, 2.5 APG, 1.6 SPG, 2.1 BPG.

He's uber-talented and I'd even say Karl-Anthony lite in that he has a similar set of tools and skills that he possesses. He has to get healthy, that's understood, but writing him off after he's really done nothing to deserve that is jumping the gun excessively.

Nothing eye catching here.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=aQ1hRg5pMO0

I get the skeptism about him and highlights make guys look good but Patton really does do some nifty things for a guy his size and has a nice blend of skills. Will he be able to realize them? Idk but I still feel a bit hopeful.

[Lipoli390]

This is a worthwhile consideration that LST kept bringing up while we were talking about the draft.

Randle's ship hasn't sailed. He has a player option for just over 9 million next year. I'm not holding my breath on him coming here but its still an option.

Ideally...alot of us hoped Belly would be good enough to step in as a starter even if that didn't mean 30 mpg giving the Wolves a very versatile player at that spot and obviously helping spacing. To me the new ideal is that KBD is that guy. Will it happen? idk but its a POSSIBLE option. Note Belly only signed for 1 year.

Another option is resigning Taj to another short term contract.

A free agent. You never know who may be available and might even sign a reasonable deal to come here especially if there is a giant hole with a starting position to be had.

Future draft pick. Yep sounds optimistic but you never know.

Trade Nothing comes to mind but there are likely some options.

To me I need to see Dieng do some positive stuff before I consider him an option as a starter again. Plus the fit now is even harder to see with the way the league has gone. Patton is the same way (in terms of needing to show something) except he is completely unproven and injured. Youth and upside plus the theory of him (versatile guy) if he can play makes more sense in the new NBA. Both are options and hopefully both show they are at least worthwhile players (Patton at least shows some promise) this season.

To me one thing about the PF position is that I'm not sure what direction the Wolves should go. I feel like that spot has a few different directions the ream could go even though they need to add shooting. If the Wolves actually take a step forward this year maybe it will be time to start looking at players that can match up against the best teams in the playoffs. That's very different than just getting a good player to help you win games in the regular season. To me that is what makes the case for KBD as a PF going forward if he is actually any good.

Ideally, KDB would emerge as the heir to Taj as our starting PF. But as you noted, that's a long shot right now. Perhaps a future pick or free agent option will emerge, but we can't strategize around that possibility since we can't control or count on it. Signing Taj to another short-term deal is also a possibility, but it's another think beyond the Wolves control. The possible emergence of Patton is a huge long shot given that we can't even know if and when he'll be fully recovered and able to play. Moreover, nothing in his G-League play suggests he's remotely close to being a rotation player in the NBA much less a future starter for the Wolves.

What is within our control is what we do with our current personnel. One option within our control will be giving KDB every chance to suceed with ample playing time and enough rope to make mistakes. I hope Thibs does that. Another option within the team's control is my suggestion to restore Dieng to the starting lineup. I think it's pretty clear he plays better as a starter. If we start him for an initial stretch of games and he doesn't do well, then we can always put him back on the bench. But the only way to know is to try it, already knowing that he faired better as starter two years ago. It's become popular to dump on Gorgui, but he's not terrible. The potential double benefit of getting more out of Gorgui and a stronger bench with Taj as part of the second unit makes it a good short-term strategy, while Gorgui's potential further development and enhanced market value from starting makes it a smart long-term strategy. As for his skill set, yes he's not an ideal fit for the modern PF position. But he has be developing a pretty decent corner 3 and before last season had a highly reliable mid-range shot. So he's not strictly a paint player.

Lip Dieng has a resume as a player and as a person deserves to have you so firmly in his corner. It's only a couple relatively meaningless games but what i saw in Senegal was very concerning to me and I believe you know I'm a Dieng fan. I think it's perfectly rational to hope Dieng can find his game again and be a worthwhile rotation player. Putting him as a starter again just doesn't do it for me. Jim Peterson was and is as big of Dieng fan as you will find and he has said for a couple years Dieng is good 3rd backup big. I get your idea of I'm starting getting the most out of the players on the roster but idk if that's the best way to go.

Jon K thinks based on some of Thibs comments that he is actually looking to do more mixing and matching of players this year. I think that's a legit criticism of Thibs last year that he didn't experiment more. I wanted to see more of it. On the other hand you can have a coach tinkering way too much (go on other message boards and fans go bonkers complaining about that) and players have no idea what is coming. There is a balance. There are times I think Dieng would really benefit from being inserted in matchups that favor him instead of just thrown out there against guys he will likely struggle against. Dieng is basically a reclamation project. I hope for the best. My expectations are low which makes me sad.

One point I will make on Patton when it comes to his health timeline was Thibs said he would be out summer league summer etc and most of fall. What "fall" means could be up to interpretation. I think a lot of people (including myself initially) thought that meant going into retailer season games even. Thins outlined the ways to get better he outlines all the times and fall seemed to be workouts/training camp. We don't know what the timeline really will because injuries are tricky and obviously this one already has been BUT if Patton really can be full go to at least practice and play in the G-league when the season starts that's not ideal but not the worst outcome either. I'm guessing they will take it easy with him. Also maybe you mentioned something about this in the SL thread but did you see Patton interating with guys on the bench etc?

I guess I have more confidence in Gorgui than Jim Peterson and others. But I'll admit I wouldn't count on him as our answer at PF over the long term. I just think if we're going to have him on this team, we're better off with him starting and playing with our top players than coming off the bench as part of our second unit. But I'm with you in not getting my expectations very high when it comes to Gorgui.

Patton was on the bench, but was very quiet and not interactive with the other guys. To be fair, it's hard to be interactive when you're in street cloths and not playing. And he might just be a quiet guy. We still don't know what we have in him. I sure hopes Thibs turns out to be right about him.

[Monster]

This is a worthwhile consideration that LST kept bringing up while we were talking about the draft.

Randle's ship hasn't sailed. He has a player option for just over 9 million next year. I'm not holding my breath on him coming here but its still an option.

Ideally...alot of us hoped Belly would be good enough to step in as a starter even if that didn't mean 30 mpg giving the Wolves a very versatile player at that spot and obviously helping spacing. To me the new ideal is that KBD is that guy. Will it happen? idk but its a POSSIBLE option. Note Belly only signed for 1 year.

Another option is resigning Taj to another short term contract.

A free agent. You never know who may be available and might even sign a reasonable deal to come here especially if there is a giant hole with a starting position to be had.

Future draft pick. Yep sounds optimistic but you never know.

Trade Nothing comes to mind but there are likely some options.

To me I need to see Dieng do some positive stuff before I consider him an option as a starter again. Plus the fit now is even harder to see with the way the league has gone. Patton is the same way (in terms of needing to show something) except he is completely unproven and injured. Youth and upside plus the theory of him (versatile guy) if he can play makes more sense in the new NBA. Both are options and hopefully both show they are at least worthwhile players (Patton at least shows some promise) this season.

To me one thing about the PF position is that I'm not sure what direction the Wolves should go. I feel like that spot has a few different directions the ream could go even though they need to add shooting. If the Wolves actually take a step forward this year maybe it will be time to start looking at players that can match up against the best teams in the playoffs. That's very different than just getting a good player to help you win games in the regular season. To me that is what makes the case for KBD as a PF going forward if he is actually any good.

Ideally, KDB would emerge as the heir to Taj as our starting PF. But as you noted, that's a long shot right now. Perhaps a future pick or free agent option will emerge, but we can't strategize around that possibility since we can't control or count on it. Signing Taj to another short-term deal is also a possibility, but it's another think beyond the Wolves control. The possible emergence of Patton is a huge long shot given that we can't even know if and when he'll be fully recovered and able to play. Moreover, nothing in his G-League play suggests he's remotely close to being a rotation player in the NBA much less a future starter for the Wolves.

What is within our control is what we do with our current personnel. One option within our control will be giving KDB every chance to suceed with ample playing time and enough rope to make mistakes. I hope Thibs does that. Another option within the team's control is my suggestion to restore Dieng to the starting lineup. I think it's pretty clear he plays better as a starter. If we start him for an initial stretch of games and he doesn't do well, then we can always put him back on the bench. But the only way to know is to try it, already knowing that he faired better as starter two years ago. It's become popular to dump on Gorgui, but he's not terrible. The potential double benefit of getting more out of Gorgui and a stronger bench with Taj as part of the second unit makes it a good short-term strategy, while Gorgui's potential further development and enhanced market value from starting makes it a smart long-term strategy. As for his skill set, yes he's not an ideal fit for the modern PF position. But he has be developing a pretty decent corner 3 and before last season had a highly reliable mid-range shot. So he's not strictly a paint player.

Lip Dieng has a resume as a player and as a person deserves to have you so firmly in his corner. It's only a couple relatively meaningless games but what i saw in Senegal was very concerning to me and I believe you know I'm a Dieng fan. I think it's perfectly rational to hope Dieng can find his game again and be a worthwhile rotation player. Putting him as a starter again just doesn't do it for me. Jim Peterson was and is as big of Dieng fan as you will find and he has said for a couple years Dieng is good 3rd backup big. I get your idea of I'm starting getting the most out of the players on the roster but idk if that's the best way to go.

Jon K thinks based on some of Thibs comments that he is actually looking to do more mixing and matching of players this year. I think that's a legit criticism of Thibs last year that he didn't experiment more. I wanted to see more of it. On the other hand you can have a coach tinkering way too much (go on other message boards and fans go bonkers complaining about that) and players have no idea what is coming. There is a balance. There are times I think Dieng would really benefit from being inserted in matchups that favor him instead of just thrown out there against guys he will likely struggle against. Dieng is basically a reclamation project. I hope for the best. My expectations are low which makes me sad.

One point I will make on Patton when it comes to his health timeline was Thibs said he would be out summer league summer etc and most of fall. What "fall" means could be up to interpretation. I think a lot of people (including myself initially) thought that meant going into retailer season games even. Thins outlined the ways to get better he outlines all the times and fall seemed to be workouts/training camp. We don't know what the timeline really will because injuries are tricky and obviously this one already has been BUT if Patton really can be full go to at least practice and play in the G-league when the season starts that's not ideal but not the worst outcome either. I'm guessing they will take it easy with him. Also maybe you mentioned something about this in the SL thread but did you see Patton interating with guys on the bench etc?

I guess I have more confidence in Gorgui than Jim Peterson and others. But I'll admit I wouldn't count on him as our answer at PF over the long term. I just think if we're going to have him on this team, we're better off with him starting and playing with our top players than coming off the bench as part of our second unit. But I'm with you in not getting my expectations very high when it comes to Gorgui.

Patton was on the bench, but was very quiet and not interactive with the other guys. To be fair, it's hard to be interactive when you're in street cloths and not playing. And he might just be a quiet guy. We still don't know what we have in him. I sure hopes Thibs turns out to be right about him.

Thank for the response on Patton. That's interesting because I think it was Zgoda that said he was being interactive on the bench which was why I asked. Everything I know about Patton is he is not a quiet guy but pretty social dude with energy. Maybe he was doing it very quietly so you wouldn't know it. :) I'm certainly not disputing what you saw.

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

Yeah, Patton's already been out and about in Minnesota with Okogie so I wouldn't really call him a guy that keeps to himself.

[Lipoli390]

But Patton can't even get on the court and when he did he didn't even shine at the G-League level.

Ehh, he did shine, just perhaps not as much defensively as some had hoped. However, I understand that until he plays consistently for the NBA team he's not going to get the benefit of the doubt around here because of the perception that he's soft, broken, and one of Thibs' choices -- which automatically puts you in the doghouse on this forum.

Patton in the G-League: 12.7 PPG (.526 TS%), 5.4 RPG, 1.6 APG, 1.0 SPG, 1.3 BPG in 23.1 MPG.

Extrapolating that to 36 minutes: 19.8 PPG (.526 TS%), 8.4 RPG, 2.5 APG, 1.6 SPG, 2.1 BPG.

He's uber-talented and I'd even say Karl-Anthony lite in that he has a similar set of tools and skills that he possesses. He has to get healthy, that's understood, but writing him off after he's really done nothing to deserve that is jumping the gun excessively.

Those are pretty good numbers when you extrapolate to 36 minutes. But even then, I'm not too impressed by 8.4 rebounds by a 7'0 center at the G-League level. Then again, maybe my John Collins bias is clouding my judgment on this. :)

[khans2k5 [enjin:6608728]]

But Patton can't even get on the court and when he did he didn't even shine at the G-League level.

Ehh, he did shine, just perhaps not as much defensively as some had hoped. However, I understand that until he plays consistently for the NBA team he's not going to get the benefit of the doubt around here because of the perception that he's soft, broken, and one of Thibs' choices -- which automatically puts you in the doghouse on this forum.

Patton in the G-League: 12.7 PPG (.526 TS%), 5.4 RPG, 1.6 APG, 1.0 SPG, 1.3 BPG in 23.1 MPG.

Extrapolating that to 36 minutes: 19.8 PPG (.526 TS%), 8.4 RPG, 2.5 APG, 1.6 SPG, 2.1 BPG.

He's uber-talented and I'd even say Karl-Anthony lite in that he has a similar set of tools and skills that he possesses. He has to get healthy, that's understood, but writing him off after he's really done nothing to deserve that is jumping the gun excessively.

Those are pretty good numbers when you extrapolate to 36 minutes. But even then, I'm not too impressed by 8.4 rebounds by a 7'0 center at the G-League level. Then again, maybe my John Collins bias is clouding my judgment on this. :)

KAT's gonna grab all the rebounds anyways so it's a match made in heaven.

[Monster]

But Patton can't even get on the court and when he did he didn't even shine at the G-League level.

Ehh, he did shine, just perhaps not as much defensively as some had hoped. However, I understand that until he plays consistently for the NBA team he's not going to get the benefit of the doubt around here because of the perception that he's soft, broken, and one of Thibs' choices -- which automatically puts you in the doghouse on this forum.

Patton in the G-League: 12.7 PPG (.526 TS%), 5.4 RPG, 1.6 APG, 1.0 SPG, 1.3 BPG in 23.1 MPG.

Extrapolating that to 36 minutes: 19.8 PPG (.526 TS%), 8.4 RPG, 2.5 APG, 1.6 SPG, 2.1 BPG.

He's uber-talented and I'd even say Karl-Anthony lite in that he has a similar set of tools and skills that he possesses. He has to get healthy, that's understood, but writing him off after he's really done nothing to deserve that is jumping the gun excessively.

Those are pretty good numbers when you extrapolate to 36 minutes. But even then, I'm not too impressed by 8.4 rebounds by a 7'0 center at the G-League level. Then again, maybe my John Collins bias is clouding my judgment on this. :)

KAT's gonna grab all the rebounds anyways so it's a match made in heaven.

Yep he is already used to playing minutes next to Amile. :)