khans2k5 wrote:KG put this franchise on the map. Not Glenn Taylor. The KG era is the only successful franchise build we've ever had. Glenn has been a massive fuck up his whole time as owner outside of the KG/Flip era. They deserve more IMO. KG can say whatever he wants. I'm not siding with the shit owner in this case even if KG and Flip never brought home a title.
At least you don't know them today as the New Orleans Wolves. At a minimum you can thank Glenn for that.
A majority of teams don't move so I'm not giving him credit for not moving. You don't get credit for doing something most of your peers do and frankly we wouldn't even be in talks like that if the franchise was run well.
Not your best take.
4 teams have moved in my lifetime (Brooklyn, OKC, Memphis and NO (Charlotte got an expansion team back). That leaves 26 teams. Bravo Glenn. What would we do without his grand leadership that kept this team here? He only did what 26 other teams have done in my lifetime and the value of his franchise has only gone up over 400% since he bought the team. What a guy!?
Khanzie, you should let this one go. The Wolves were as good as gone to New Orleans, and then Taylor entered the picture to save the day. You are absolutely right that Taylor deserves mucho criticism for the Wolves ineptitude. But I'll take that over losing yet another NBA team...
khans2k5 wrote:KG put this franchise on the map. Not Glenn Taylor. The KG era is the only successful franchise build we've ever had. Glenn has been a massive fuck up his whole time as owner outside of the KG/Flip era. They deserve more IMO. KG can say whatever he wants. I'm not siding with the shit owner in this case even if KG and Flip never brought home a title.
At least you don't know them today as the New Orleans Wolves. At a minimum you can thank Glenn for that.
A majority of teams don't move so I'm not giving him credit for not moving. You don't get credit for doing something most of your peers do and frankly we wouldn't even be in talks like that if the franchise was run well.
Not your best take.
4 teams have moved in my lifetime (Brooklyn, OKC, Memphis and NO (Charlotte got an expansion team back). That leaves 26 teams. Bravo Glenn. What would we do without his grand leadership that kept this team here? He only did what 26 other teams have done in my lifetime and the value of his franchise has only gone up over 400% since he bought the team. What a guy!?
I don't think you understand what happened. The team was ready to move until he stepped in and bought it some 20 years ago. Either that or you just want to argue. I made what I thought was a statement not open to argument, yet you found some way to try. Sometimes it's okay to accept a reply to a post. Not everything needs to be contested.
khans2k5 wrote:4 teams have moved in my lifetime (Brooklyn, OKC, Memphis and NO (Charlotte got an expansion team back).
I would suggest the possibility that the fans who lost those four teams would be grateful for a Taylor type to have stepped in and saved their team. It's possible to both appreciate Taylor's stepping in and saving the team for Minnesota while also holding him responsible for the ineptitude of his tenure as owner.
It's interesting there was 2 articles that came out today with people taking to KG. I'll say this about both of them he got in some shots but they moved on...at least that's how the authors portrayed it.
KG has some reasons to have a beef with Glen. Abe pointed out one of them. They could have handled Letting Sam go better than they did etc.
On the other hand the piece Jon K did makes me think it's a good thing he has moved on. He was upset the Wolves didn't do enough or as I saw it what he wanted them to do for Flip. Maybe he wasn't shown enough empathy during that time but he doesn't seem to show enough empathy either. Glen Taylor and how many people in that whole franchise were close to Flip. It was a shock. How were they supposed to move on? On top of that people grieve differently. that extends to his role with the organization. What role did he want? What role were the Wolves folks willing to give him?
Overall it sounds like he is doing well enjoying life. I think at some point he will let go and come back and show the love at least for the fans and his guys he mentored.
As for Glen as an owner he is a mixed bag. There is plenty of things to criticize about him but the last few years he has done some pretty positive things. Hiring Flip turned out to be a good move. The Wolves set up the best training and practice facility in the league. He got the best coach available last year. The Target center renovation isn't amazing but it will make the place suck less. He got Dieng to take less manoney than he probably could have gotten down the road. Even the last couple of years it hasn't all been positive but Glen has put forth some good things to put this franchise in the right direction. The real question is whether he will be willing to go to lux tax land to build a contender. If he is and does what he can to get minority owners on board or gets stronger minority ownership that will go for that I think he will be perceived in a better light by people that are understandably unhappy with his tenure as owner. Glen has made some terrible errors but this franchise has also had some really unfortunate luck.
As for Taylor saving the franchise... yes... and no.
Remember, the NBA rejected the New Orleans bid. And it wasn't because Taylor had rode in on his white horse. Bill Sexton was trying to buy the team for many months. Taylor stepped in after his bid failed... a few months after the suspect New Orleans bid was exposed.
I don't get all of the hate for Taylor on this. He hired Mchale who is the only GM to ever get this team to the playoffs and drafted 2 of the teams 3 best players. Kahns was a mess, but he was trying to break up the country club. He did hire Adelman who was probably the best coach the team has had outside Musleman. Then we had Flip that was able to put together our young core. Now he hired Thibs who was considered the best coach on the market and gave him PBO like Flip had. He is not perfect, but KG just took his emotions public that shouldn't be. Anytime you do that it hardly ever works out. KG seems to have a few entitlement issues. If he had his say this team woutd have Sam Mitchell, Troy Hudson, and his buddies running this team.
bleedspeed177 wrote:I don't get all of the hate for Taylor on this. He hired Mchale who is the only GM to ever get this team to the playoffs and drafted 2 of the teams 3 best players. Kahns was a mess, but he was trying to break up the country club. He did hire Adelman who was probably the best coach the team has had outside Musleman. Then we had Flip that was able to put together our young core. Now he hired Thibs who was considered the best coach on the market and gave him PBO like Flip had. He is not perfect, but KG just took his emotions public that shouldn't be. Anytime you do that it hardly ever works out. KG seems to have a few entitlement issues. If he had his say this team woutd have Sam Mitchell, Troy Hudson, and his buddies running this team.
Wait. What?
You're going to rip Garnett for THIS... and give Taylor a pass for claiming publicly that Garnett tanked after the trade... one year after the Mark Madsen fiasco?
Again. I think Garnett can be an asshole... but I don't see how he looks worse than Taylor in anything that happened between them. Taylor's quotes nearly a decade ago trump anything else. They were reprehensible.
And that's where the lion's share of animosity between them seems to have originated.
You're going to rip Garnett for THIS... and give Taylor a pass for claiming publicly that Garnett tanked after the trade... one year after the Mark Madsen fiasco?
Again. I think Garnett can be an asshole... but I don't see how he looks worse than Taylor in anything that happened between them. Taylor's quotes nearly a decade ago trump anything else. They were reprehensible.
And that's where the lion's share of animosity between them seems to have originated.
He looks worse because he is still bringing this up. When KG agreed to come back in my eyes all was forgiven. Now KG is whining because he lost his partner to buy into the Wolves in Flip and Taylor went in a different direction. He comes off as bullheaded to me. I get he has a lot of pride and anger, but going public at this time seems like a cry for continued relevance. It also comes when the playoffs are going on so it even seems strategic.
You're going to rip Garnett for THIS... and give Taylor a pass for claiming publicly that Garnett tanked after the trade... one year after the Mark Madsen fiasco?
Again. I think Garnett can be an asshole... but I don't see how he looks worse than Taylor in anything that happened between them. Taylor's quotes nearly a decade ago trump anything else. They were reprehensible.
And that's where the lion's share of animosity between them seems to have originated.
He looks worse because he is still bringing this up. When KG agreed to come back in my eyes all was forgiven. Now KG is whining because he lost his partner to buy into the Wolves in Flip and Taylor went in a different direction. He comes off as bullheaded to me. I get he has a lot of pride and anger, but going public at this time seems like a cry for continued relevance. It also comes when the playoffs are going on so it even seems strategic.
Fair enough. We can agree to [vehemently] disagree.
I don't even see Garnett's comments as being very incendiary...
When asked Garnett if he was disappointed that the plan fell apart:
A little bit. A little bit. To say Debbie Downer is an understatement. It was a huge disappointment and one that showed me the true Glen Taylor. It showed me how he really feels. When this guy got the team, it was worth $90 million. When I left it, it was worth somewhere in the $400 (millions). That was never taken into account in my value or none of that. I guess I served my purpose, and I was on to the next. So it's all good. So it's all good. I'm moving on and taking my ball and playing somewhere else. (Laughs.)
The whole thing actually seems pretty tame compared to situations elsewhere. For as big of a loon as he was on the court emotionally... I think Garnett has done a much better job tempering those emotions off the court. This is mostly nothing. I just couldn't let Taylor get a free pass on it though.
Abe, I get it, but what was his goal in this? If it was to become partial owner of the Wolves he just killed any chance of that by acting like a kid when things didn't go his way. If he woudl have been open about change in management and played his card right he could have probably still been part of a partial ownership group headed up by him, but it really looks like a stretch now. Bitching about the value of the franchise going up because of KG is very egotistical. All franchises have gone up in price. Taylor paid him very well. He never cheaped out on him. So is KG saying all players should get a peice of the pie with franchise prices rising? Nope he is saying he should. That is very self centered. I am glad he is not around the kids anymore. He have been an asset on the court but off the court he is just a problem. I have been very impressed with how LeBron handles his business. KG is not in his league as a player or businessman.
