Game Report - Wolves v. Blazers

[Monster]

Monster -- Very Interesting stuff in your post. Thanks.

I knew that Thibs loves Gorgui. Now we know the players do as well. As you know, I've always believed it's highly unlikely Gorgui gets traded because of how much Thibs likes him. Knowing the Butler also likes him a lot should remove any doubt. It's also worth noting that, if Taj goes down with an injury, Gorgui is the only guy on the roster who can reliably fill in behind him. Belly can't be counted on because of his foot and there's no one else. So folks should forget about trading Gorgui for a win. It's not going to happen.

More generally, I don't see the Wolves making any trades this season. We have 8 players on our roster who at least some teams would have interest in acquiring - Butler, KAT, Taj, Teague, Wiggins, Gorgui, Crawford and Tyus. Of those, Butler and KAT would probably be the only ones who would generate a lot of interest and it should be obvious that Thibs won't trade either one - nor should he. I don't see Thibs trading any of the other players he acquired last summer - Taj, Teague and Crawford. Thibs has too much of his ego invested in them and they are all playing well. Moreover, I think it would be hard to find a team willing to take on Teague's contract and also give us good value in return. If it were me, I'd be shopping Wiggins, but his contract extension includes a "poison pill" component that makes it nearly impossible to trade him before next summer. That leave's Gorgui and Tyus. As already discussed, Gorgui's not going anywhere and contrary to some of the opinion on this board, that's a good thing. Meanwhile we don't have any excess 1st picks or even any excess 2nd rounders to trade. That leaves Tyus. In my view he's worth far more to us than anything we'd get in return for him.

I agree I don't think there will be any trades unless it's something that looks relatively minor like an Aldrich for Dudley trade. The buyout market could be a place where we get involved more than a trade.

I agree I don't think Dieng gets moved and you are right about his value to the team right now. I do think it makes sense to speculative fans to look for possible deals just because of his contract and role at this point. That could change this season to some extent and in a year or 2 his value either for the Wolves or around the league could go up. Wolfson has reported the last couple weeks that Dieng is gettable by teams but like us he doesn't see a fit.

[Leado01]

Great report. I feel like Thibs is sucking some of the life out of this team. Heads are often hung.

We've stopped playing as a team. We've stopped moving on offense. Isolation is the death of hope as so few are even involved.

Ran into Bjelica on Sunday and he will be back this week. Didn't have the heart to ask why Bazz is buried.

When a guy is the 4th or 5th option on the second team it's hard to get on a roll.

Arghh...I actually feel like this win reinforces Thibs unacceptable schemes.

[Duke13]

Lip can be about as stubborn as Tibs. Because of a conversation he had with G 4 years ago he's forever in love with him. His contact doesn't match his production, and his role is repetitive with Taj, who are both outdated players and should be 20 minutes a game players. For that reason a trade should be explored and at the least management should be open to the idea And to say he shouldn't or won't be moved because Tibs "likes" him or praises him publicly is insane and just plain stupid. That's the same mentality most criticize Tibs for.

[Big O [enjin:13874644]]

Gibson may be more skilled at this point but I would like to see Gorgui get some starts. Gorgui and KAT had a pretty good thing going at the end of last year and at 32 years old coming off the bench for more limited minutes would help Gibson come playoff time.

[Monster]

I think it's worth mentioning that many of Dieng's numbers are as good or better on a per minute basis than they were last year. It seems like the last few games he and his new teammates are starting to figure out what works offensively. He needs to make an adjustment to guys closing out on his long 2's and either get them to foul or having good footwork to drive past them. He has a good pump fake. I like that he is spacing out and taking 3's even if they aren't going down. He is such a good long 2 shooter (he is one guy that should take them when he is open) that it feels like it may be a matter of time be fore he starts hitting a solid percentage on corner 3's which makes his value go up. He started slow last year also before playing well on a semi-consistent basis that a typical legit rotation player would give you. Dieng has such a weird wonky effectiveness to his game it makes it hard to assess him sometimes.

[AbeVigodaLive]

I think it's worth mentioning that many of Dieng's numbers are as good or better on a per minute basis than they were last year. It seems like the last few games he and his new teammates are starting to figure out what works offensively. He needs to make an adjustment to guys closing out on his long 2's and either get them to foul or having good footwork to drive past them. He has a good pump fake. I like that he is spacing out and taking 3's even if they aren't going down. He is such a good long 2 shooter (he is one guy that should take them when he is open) that it feels like it may be a matter of time be fore he starts hitting a solid percentage on corner 3's which makes his value go up. He started slow last year also before playing well on a semi-consistent basis that a typical legit rotation player would give you. Dieng has such a weird wonky effectiveness to his game it makes it hard to assess him sometimes.

There are rumblings that he's not exactly thrilled with the fewer minutes.

I'm sure it takes some adjustment figuring out the new role. Overall, he's been "about" the same the last time I looked.

He has good games... bad games. He's a decent 1st big off the bench. Is that worth $14M? Meh.

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

Is Dieng worth $14M annually to us? Not even close, in my mind. That money should be used on someone that can contribute at the wing. Serviceable bench bigs are everywhere. Look up, look down, look left, look right -- they're all around the NBA, the G-League, the college game, overseas, etc.

Tell me Amile Jefferson (using him as an example), who is currently playing for the Iowa affiliate, couldn't give you 10-20 minutes per night and not kill your team. All your bench bigs are asked to do is to play with energy, clean the glass, bring it on the defensive end, and get whatever dunks/layups come your way. Gorgui's pretty clearly more skilled than that, but it's almost unnecessary for the role he plays.

However, your bench wing needs to come in and be able to do a myriad of things. In today's game, you almost have to have a third wing that can come in and give you a jolt offensively, or provide you with 3&D capabilities. I mean, shit, we saw how a hot-shooting Jamal Crawford completely altered the result of last night's game. Good teams have that happen regularly, not one out of every thirty games.

In our case, the need for another wing is amplified by the complete dogshit level productivity we're getting from Andrew Wiggins. Tom Thibodeau has to know it. Jimmy Butler has alluded to it all season that we need more from Wigs -- and Towns defensively. Jim Petersen was a broken record last night about it as well. It's no secret. We need to make a move -- if not now, then this upcoming summer.

[AbeVigodaLive]

Is Dieng worth $14M annually to us? Not even close, in my mind. That money should be used on someone that can contribute at the wing. Serviceable bench bigs are everywhere. Look up, look down, look left, look right -- they're all around the NBA, the G-League, the college game, overseas, etc.

Tell me Amile Jefferson (using him as an example), who is currently playing for the Iowa affiliate, couldn't give you 10-20 minutes per night and not kill your team. All your bench bigs are asked to do is to play with energy, clean the glass, bring it on the defensive end, and get whatever dunks/layups come your way. Gorgui's pretty clearly more skilled than that, but it's almost unnecessary for the role he plays.

However, your bench wing needs to come in and be able to do a myriad of things. In today's game, you almost have to have a third wing that can come in and give you a jolt offensively, or provide you with 3&D capabilities. I mean, shit, we saw how a hot-shooting Jamal Crawford completely altered the result of last night's game. Good teams have that happen regularly, not one out of every thirty games.

In our case, the need for another wing is amplified by the complete dogshit level productivity we're getting from Andrew Wiggins. Tom Thibodeau has to know it. Jimmy Butler has alluded to it all season that we need more from Wigs -- and Towns defensively. Jim Petersen was a broken record last night about it as well. It's no secret. We need to make a move -- if not now, then this upcoming summer.

Do you think there's any chance Andrew Wiggins is going to be benched? The guy is guaranteed 37 minutes every night... whether he's playing well or not.

That's been the way it's been for 3+ seasons and with three different coaches now. And obviously, the owner of the team agrees with it too... considering he's ponying up $146.5M for the guy.

As fans, we better get used to living and dying with Andrew Wiggins playing 35+ mpg for at least one more year... and probably several more. It would be nice to have a viable wing. But with Butler and Wiggins slated for big minutes... Crawford's role set... Jones role set... Teague's role set...

I just don't see how anybody of relevance would come in and play enough minutes to justify the move. I think a guy like Marco Belinelli could provide a legit veteran off the bench if given the minutes. But I don't know if those minutes are here.

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

Is Dieng worth $14M annually to us? Not even close, in my mind. That money should be used on someone that can contribute at the wing. Serviceable bench bigs are everywhere. Look up, look down, look left, look right -- they're all around the NBA, the G-League, the college game, overseas, etc.

Tell me Amile Jefferson (using him as an example), who is currently playing for the Iowa affiliate, couldn't give you 10-20 minutes per night and not kill your team. All your bench bigs are asked to do is to play with energy, clean the glass, bring it on the defensive end, and get whatever dunks/layups come your way. Gorgui's pretty clearly more skilled than that, but it's almost unnecessary for the role he plays.

However, your bench wing needs to come in and be able to do a myriad of things. In today's game, you almost have to have a third wing that can come in and give you a jolt offensively, or provide you with 3&D capabilities. I mean, shit, we saw how a hot-shooting Jamal Crawford completely altered the result of last night's game. Good teams have that happen regularly, not one out of every thirty games.

In our case, the need for another wing is amplified by the complete dogshit level productivity we're getting from Andrew Wiggins. Tom Thibodeau has to know it. Jimmy Butler has alluded to it all season that we need more from Wigs -- and Towns defensively. Jim Petersen was a broken record last night about it as well. It's no secret. We need to make a move -- if not now, then this upcoming summer.

Do you think there's any chance Andrew Wiggins is going to be benched? The guy is guaranteed 37 minutes every night... whether he's playing well or not.

That's been the way it's been for 3+ seasons and with three different coaches now. And obviously, the owner of the team agrees with it too... considering he's ponying up $146.5M for the guy.

As fans, we better get used to living and dying with Andrew Wiggins playing 35+ mpg for at least one more year... and probably several more. It would be nice to have a viable wing. But with Butler and Wiggins slated for big minutes... Crawford's role set... Jones role set... Teague's role set...

I just don't see how anybody of relevance would come in and play enough minutes to justify the move. I think a guy like Marco Belinelli could provide a legit veteran off the bench if given the minutes. But I don't know if those minutes are here.

There's not a chance in hell that Wiggins is getting benched, nor should he in the grand scheme of things. As long as he's in Minnesota, we either need him to start and hope he wakes up and becomes a star -- doesn't look likely -- or keep starting and provide enough reasons for another team to buy in on his potential and take him for their disgruntled All-Star (fingers crossed).

Either way, we'll still need a third wing that can play 20-30 MPG depending on the game. And it would be nice, though certainly not necessary, if this wing could play stints with Butler and stints with Wiggins therefore keeping them rotated and fresh. I think those minutes are there now actually. And when I talk about this, I'm not really keeping Crawford and his 15-20 MPG in mind because the guy's like 40-years old and is a wildcard. If his shot isn't falling, he is just as useless as Wiggins.

[AbeVigodaLive]

Is Dieng worth $14M annually to us? Not even close, in my mind. That money should be used on someone that can contribute at the wing. Serviceable bench bigs are everywhere. Look up, look down, look left, look right -- they're all around the NBA, the G-League, the college game, overseas, etc.

Tell me Amile Jefferson (using him as an example), who is currently playing for the Iowa affiliate, couldn't give you 10-20 minutes per night and not kill your team. All your bench bigs are asked to do is to play with energy, clean the glass, bring it on the defensive end, and get whatever dunks/layups come your way. Gorgui's pretty clearly more skilled than that, but it's almost unnecessary for the role he plays.

However, your bench wing needs to come in and be able to do a myriad of things. In today's game, you almost have to have a third wing that can come in and give you a jolt offensively, or provide you with 3&D capabilities. I mean, shit, we saw how a hot-shooting Jamal Crawford completely altered the result of last night's game. Good teams have that happen regularly, not one out of every thirty games.

In our case, the need for another wing is amplified by the complete dogshit level productivity we're getting from Andrew Wiggins. Tom Thibodeau has to know it. Jimmy Butler has alluded to it all season that we need more from Wigs -- and Towns defensively. Jim Petersen was a broken record last night about it as well. It's no secret. We need to make a move -- if not now, then this upcoming summer.

Do you think there's any chance Andrew Wiggins is going to be benched? The guy is guaranteed 37 minutes every night... whether he's playing well or not.

That's been the way it's been for 3+ seasons and with three different coaches now. And obviously, the owner of the team agrees with it too... considering he's ponying up $146.5M for the guy.

As fans, we better get used to living and dying with Andrew Wiggins playing 35+ mpg for at least one more year... and probably several more. It would be nice to have a viable wing. But with Butler and Wiggins slated for big minutes... Crawford's role set... Jones role set... Teague's role set...

I just don't see how anybody of relevance would come in and play enough minutes to justify the move. I think a guy like Marco Belinelli could provide a legit veteran off the bench if given the minutes. But I don't know if those minutes are here.

There's not a chance in hell that Wiggins is getting benched, nor should he in the grand scheme of things. As long as he's in Minnesota, we either need him to start and hope he wakes up and becomes a star -- doesn't look likely -- or keep starting and provide enough reasons for another team to buy in on his potential and take him for their disgruntled All-Star (fingers crossed).

Either way, we'll still need a third wing that can play 20-30 MPG depending on the game. And it would be nice, though certainly not necessary, if this wing could play stints with Butler and stints with Wiggins therefore keeping them rotated and fresh. I think those minutes are there now actually. And when I talk about this, I'm not really keeping Crawford and his 15-20 MPG in mind because the guy's like 40-years old and is a wildcard. If his shot isn't falling, he is just as useless as Wiggins.

Yes. My question was rhetorical... should have been more clear.

Of course he's not getting benched. But Crawford is playing the fewest minutes in the past 15+ years with close-to-the-same efficiency as recent seasons. Are you suggesting dumping Dieng for a guy to play 10 mpg?

Or for somebody who won't get more than that until next season... at the earliest?