Minnesota Sports Forum

TXviking wrote:I would rather try and get Mike Conley. I don't think he'll leave Memphis $$$$$. But I would like to see the push to try and upgrade the pg. Then trade Rubio.

I'd really like Conley as well. Would have to trade rubio first though.

bleedspeed177 wrote:I don't think vets are useless, but at some point I think you look at the roster and try and get a player that can be a leader ad still play and fits. I am thinking you trade anyone not named Towns, Wiggins, and LaVine for that player that is an all-star or near.

No way I'd trade Rubio before LaVine. To me Zach and Bazz are prime assets to trade to speed up the proccess.

Brooklyn_Wolves wrote:

bleedspeed177 wrote:I don't think vets are useless, but at some point I think you look at the roster and try and get a player that can be a leader ad still play and fits. I am thinking you trade anyone not named Towns, Wiggins, and LaVine for that player that is an all-star or near.

No way I'd trade Rubio before LaVine. To me Zach and Bazz are prime assets to trade to speed up the proccess.

Dieng is probably the guy that we have the best chance of getting a decent return on versus his future contract situation. This preseason, he is shooting 60% from the field, 80% from the line, and averaging 20 points per 36 minutes. He's even showing signs of adding a 3-point shot to his arsenal! It's really amazing how far his offense has come since Louisville.

The problem is I see the same sieve-like defense we witnessed last year. If attacked directly in the paint, he almost always ends up giving up a bucket, whether it's a strong drive by a perimeter player or a post-up by a big. However, given his improving offensive game and good health, other teams may be willing to overlook his defensive issues and give us something of value for him.

If we hold onto him, just realize that his next contract will cost us $10M+ per year in all likelihood. Towns is eventually going to do everything Gorgui does on offense - and probably well before his rookie contract is up. We need a defensive big man that can backup Towns or even pair up with him at times. Gorgui isn't that guy in the long run.

Ok, so we have 3 assets to get a good a good youngish player. I wonder who's available. Denver can be a team that may be dismantled soon, but I may be wrong on this. But player like Gallo would look good on our roster.

Q12543 wrote:

Brooklyn_Wolves wrote:

bleedspeed177 wrote:I don't think vets are useless, but at some point I think you look at the roster and try and get a player that can be a leader ad still play and fits. I am thinking you trade anyone not named Towns, Wiggins, and LaVine for that player that is an all-star or near.

No way I'd trade Rubio before LaVine. To me Zach and Bazz are prime assets to trade to speed up the proccess.

Dieng is probably the guy that we have the best chance of getting a decent return on versus his future contract situation. This preseason, he is shooting 60% from the field, 80% from the line, and averaging 20 points per 36 minutes. He's even showing signs of adding a 3-point shot to his arsenal! It's really amazing how far his offense has come since Louisville.

The problem is I see the same sieve-like defense we witnessed last year. If attacked directly in the paint, he almost always ends up giving up a bucket, whether it's a strong drive by a perimeter player or a post-up by a big. However, given his improving offensive game and good health, other teams may be willing to overlook his defensive issues and give us something of value for him.

If we hold onto him, just realize that his next contract will cost us $10M+ per year in all likelihood. Towns is eventually going to do everything Gorgui does on offense - and probably well before his rookie contract is up. We need a defensive big man that can backup Towns or even pair up with him at times. Gorgui isn't that guy in the long run.

I agree, Q. I recall Flip saying this summer that most of the serious trade inquiries he got were for Dieng and secondarily Shabazz. Dieng's preseason has further enhance his value. So if a significant trade happens involving one of our young players this year, it will likely be Dieng with Shabazz possibly included.

If it were up to me, I wouldn't deal Dieng until after this season if at all. I still see hm improving defensively and it would be nice to see him play with better defensive coaching. He is our best player so far this preseason and he'll continue to get even better.

We're going to have to be patient and see how this season plays out with our rookies, 2nd year guys and third year guys playing alongside Ricky with the vets mixed in to see what we have for the future. I don't totally dismiss the value of winning, but are a rebuilding franchise and the focus has to be on evaluation and development aimed at what this team will be in 2017 and beyond.

I'm also not a fan of trading Dieng, at least not right now. As Lip said, he has been our best pre-season player, and his terrific five games are on the heels of a strong African games tournament. His PER this pre-season is 27.1 with an eFG% of 62.5! His defense has disappointed many on this board, but let's not forget that just three years ago he was considered a dominant defensive center on a very good NCAA team, so I still think the potential is there to become at least an average center. And I don't think his value is high enough around to bring much back. Backup centers playing behind rookies typically don't have great trade value...I see his value to us as being much higher than his value around the league. Pek's future is still uncertain and he is also not young, and Towns is going to play some PF in the future too. So I think there will be plenty of minutes for Gorgui to deserve the $10 million+ he is going to command in his next contract.

Long, Dieng's defense at Louisville was played in the context of a zone. His length was a real asset in that system and his lack of strength wasn't really exposed. And besides, why is that even relevant at this point heading into his 3rd year? At some point, you have to throw out the window whatever someone did as a prep or college player.

I guess where I differ is that I see his value higher in the open market than I see it intrinsically with the Wolves. I believe many of the skills we see from Gorgui on offense will eventually be replicated and surpassed by Towns - post-ups, mid-range game, 3's, passing. Towns will be able to do it in higher volume too. And Towns is already just as good of a rebounder as Dieng. He may already be just as good of a defender (although that's not saying much).

If we can swap out Dieng for a defensive-minded big that can muck it up for 20 MPG and clear bodies out of the way, I'd be willing to bet that will cost us less than $10M per year while at the same time proving to be the more complementary skill-set to what we already have.

This squad is woefully short on defensive talent. We literally have only 3 guys that can defend and one will retire within the next two years.

I don't know, Q. The idea of Dieng and Towns playing together is intriguing. I would be hesitant to trade Dieng for a 20 MPG "muck it up" defensive big. It seems those guys can be found in free agency more so than competent offensive bigs.

That's where I am too, tim...at least right now. I didn't see Gorgui's African play or much of pre-season, but his offensive stats the past few months have been nothing short of terrific. And I like how he is always trying to expand his offensive game...last year the 10-15 foot bank shot, this year extending beyond the arc. Q may be right that Gorgui will never be the elite defender he was at Louisville, but I also want to put his first two years in the pros in context. It's difficult for me to condemn a young player's defense on a terrible team with a coach not known for stressing defense. I'm eager to see how he looks defensively this year if the players around him stay healthy. Maybe he will be looking for $10 million with his new contract, but based on his performance and in light of the new cap, I think that will be a bargain.

The question on Dieng is can whatever $ he commands as a free agent be spent in a way that yields a higher return to our team?

He's absolutely a huge bargain right now because he's a fairly efficient one-way player on a late 1st round rookie scale. But the fact he can play Center, he's reasonably durable, and has a burgeoning offensive repertoire suggests that he could be ripe for an overpay when he becomes a restricted free agent. It also means he could be worth something of value in the open market. I don't want to invest double-digit millions per year for a backup Center that can't defend.