Minnesota Sports Forum

KiwiMatt wrote:
What if this is all part of an elaborate plan by Thibs to try and 'light the fire' in Towns and Wiggins.

Nice try, but this is Thibs we are talking about. Doling out unlimited playing time and max contracts while not requiring that they play any defense refutes any motivation theory. Thibs is all about self preservation and would never take any action that he thought might risk his job. He's also isn't much for forward thinking either. He might be good at checkers but is probably horrible at chess.

Squishypoo wrote:Then he goes on to say this was are best practice of the year? Just fire thibs already and have him take jimmy with him. Find a real GM and HC and then see what Wig and kat can become .

Your point is a good one, and what you suggest is exactly what should happen. Take Richardson, Adebayo, and a draft pick and fire Thibs at the same time. But this is the Wolves. We don't make good decisions. We will screw this up just like we have for 30 years.

crazysauce wrote:A ploy to get kat to sign his extension?

https://twitter.com/DWolfsonKSTP/status/1050155170125021184?s=19

Wiggins and Kat need to wake the hell up.

That Butler interview is telling. I have no problem with anything Butler said in that interview or anything he is reported to have done in practice today. Wiggins and KAT absolutely need to wake the hell up. What happened today will probably encourage Miami and other teams to take an even harder negotiation stance because they see the dysfunction and figure Glen will step in and force a trade. As I said from the beginning, it's unlikely Butler's trade value will increase over time and it could decrease. Worst case scenario, Butler gets hurt. Thibodeau is playing a dangerous game. On the other hand, what Butler said in that interview might make Riley want him even more. So maybe we'll get Adebayo now. :)

Here's the most interesting comment from Jimmy:

A source of Butler's discontent is the bold claim that not everyone in the organization is committed to winning.

"I think that's the part everybody doesn't see," Butler said. "I'm not going to say no names. I'm going to be honest: If your No. 1 priority isn't winning, people can tell. That's the battle. Now there is a problem between people. That's where the disconnect is."

Showing up to practice doesn't appear to have resolved the issues he has with the team.

"It's not fixed," Butler told Nichols. "Let's be honest."

Asked it if could be fixed, he said: "It could be. Do I think so? No."

Maybe Jimmy's just putting on a show and spewing crap. On the other hand, maybe he's serious. If so, I wonder who those people are Butler won't name. I doubt it's Thibodeau. Is it Layden? Is it Taylor? Is it others in the front office? Is it Wiggins and Towns? Who else? And what does he mean when he says "it could be fixed" ? What would it mean to be "fixed"? Does it mean that KAT or Wiggins (maybe both) need to be traded?

I'm going to take a stab in the dark at deciphering what Butler means and what ultimately led to his trade demand. I'm convinced he told Thibodeau and Layden at least as far back as last April that he wanted the organization to deal KAT and Wiggins and build around him a team of players to his liking. He probably included a new max contract in his list of demands, which would go hand and hand with trading Wiggins and KAT. Thibodeau clearly told him no and told him to be patient and that he'd change his mind after playing out the season. That obviously wasn't enough for Jimmy.

lipoli390 wrote:Here's the most interesting comment from Jimmy:

A source of Butler's discontent is the bold claim that not everyone in the organization is committed to winning.

"I think that's the part everybody doesn't see," Butler said. "I'm not going to say no names. I'm going to be honest: If your No. 1 priority isn't winning, people can tell. That's the battle. Now there is a problem between people. That's where the disconnect is."

Showing up to practice doesn't appear to have resolved the issues he has with the team.

"It's not fixed," Butler told Nichols. "Let's be honest."

Asked it if could be fixed, he said: "It could be. Do I think so? No."

Maybe Jimmy's just putting on a show and spewing crap. On the other hand, maybe he's serious. If so, I wonder who those people are Butler won't name. I doubt it's Thibodeau. Is it Layden? Is it Taylor? Is it others in the front office? Is it Wiggins and Towns? Who else? And what does he mean when he says "it could be fixed" ? What would it mean to be "fixed"? Does it mean that KAT or Wiggins (maybe both) need to be traded?

I'm going to take a stab in the dark at deciphering what Butler means and what ultimately led to his trade demand. I'm convinced he told Thibodeau and Layden at least as far back as last April that he wanted the organization to deal KAT and Wiggins and build around him a team of players to his liking. He probably included a new max contract in his list of demands, which would go hand and hand with trading Wiggins and KAT. Thibodeau clearly told him no and told him to be patient and that he'd change his mind after playing out the season. That obviously wasn't enough for Jimmy.

I still think his biggest issue is with kat. They both want to be the guy to carry the team. Butler is a diva and has a very high opinion of himself, but he wants to be the guy. Kat also wants to be that guy. Both guys are all about social media.

Some of the reports from the scrimmage has jimmy barking and making comments about defending kat. And kat trying to gather the guys, but no one listening.

Wiggs on the other hand doesnt want any of that. People can be pissed because of his laissez faire attitude, but i don't think this is what jimmy is going on about. Wiggs and jimmy even exchanged hand daps after the scrimmage.

So i think jimmy wanted to be paid and got some assurances from thibs and taylor. But maybe kat did give some sort of ultimatum.

Taj on todays practice:

It was a fun, competitive practice. Everything is being taken out of context. Everyone there understood the context and enjoyed it. It was not actually Butler and the bench vs. the starters. Afterwards they all huddled up just like every other practice. But when asked specifically he said Butler was not in the final huddle because he had "medical stuff" to take care of.

lipoli390 wrote:Here's the most interesting comment from Jimmy:

A source of Butler's discontent is the bold claim that not everyone in the organization is committed to winning.

"I think that's the part everybody doesn't see," Butler said. "I'm not going to say no names. I'm going to be honest: If your No. 1 priority isn't winning, people can tell. That's the battle. Now there is a problem between people. That's where the disconnect is."

Showing up to practice doesn't appear to have resolved the issues he has with the team.

"It's not fixed," Butler told Nichols. "Let's be honest."

Asked it if could be fixed, he said: "It could be. Do I think so? No."

Maybe Jimmy's just putting on a show and spewing crap. On the other hand, maybe he's serious. If so, I wonder who those people are Butler won't name. I doubt it's Thibodeau. Is it Layden? Is it Taylor? Is it others in the front office? Is it Wiggins and Towns? Who else? And what does he mean when he says "it could be fixed" ? What would it mean to be "fixed"? Does it mean that KAT or Wiggins (maybe both) need to be traded?

I'm going to take a stab in the dark at deciphering what Butler means and what ultimately led to his trade demand. I'm convinced he told Thibodeau and Layden at least as far back as last April that he wanted the organization to deal KAT and Wiggins and build around him a team of players to his liking. He probably included a new max contract in his list of demands, which would go hand and hand with trading Wiggins and KAT. Thibodeau clearly told him no and told him to be patient and that he'd change his mind after playing out the season. That obviously wasn't enough for Jimmy.

That's a pretty good breakdown and possible narrative especially moving Wiggins. I'll add this...I think Thibs thought that some of his moves this offseason might make Jimmy reconsider. I don't think Thibs did some things just because they might convince Jimmy but I could see Thibs saying after the draft, "Jimmy Josh Okogie...this kid is all energy all the time. You'll love working with him" Tolliver seems like a seasoned vet that would appeal to Butler as well. I get if Butler was resolute and all that but I also find it weird that he didn't even seem to give it any chance. Your scenario honestly makes as much sense as anything I've read about all this. Bravo.

One more thing. Butler said he did tell Thibs how he felt 4 days after the playoffs. I'll say that's pretty soon after the season. I think it's absolutely understandable that Thibs would give him a bit of a cooling off period and then have some time to convince him to stay. Thibs had/has a special relationship with Jimmy I think it's fair to give Thibs some time to change Butler's mind even if you don't think he was gonna be able to do it or even go further and you don't want to convince Butler to come back. At some point It does seem clear now Thibs, Layden and Glen should have realized they needed to do something before the September meeting and avoid the circus we have now. It is highly entertaining though!!!!

crazy-canuck wrote:Taj on todays practice:

It was a fun, competitive practice. Everything is being taken out of context. Everyone there understood the context and enjoyed it. It was not actually Butler and the bench vs. the starters. Afterwards they all huddled up just like every other practice. But when asked specifically he said Butler was not in the final huddle because he had "medical stuff" to take care of.

Thanks for posting. I found the podcast where he appeared on the Waddle and Silvey show. It's just 6 minutes long.

https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/waddle-silvy/id255781463?mt=2&i=1000421542368

He just want's to be wanted :( poor guy

monsterpile wrote:

lipoli390 wrote:Here's the most interesting comment from Jimmy:

A source of Butler's discontent is the bold claim that not everyone in the organization is committed to winning.

"I think that's the part everybody doesn't see," Butler said. "I'm not going to say no names. I'm going to be honest: If your No. 1 priority isn't winning, people can tell. That's the battle. Now there is a problem between people. That's where the disconnect is."

Showing up to practice doesn't appear to have resolved the issues he has with the team.

"It's not fixed," Butler told Nichols. "Let's be honest."

Asked it if could be fixed, he said: "It could be. Do I think so? No."

Maybe Jimmy's just putting on a show and spewing crap. On the other hand, maybe he's serious. If so, I wonder who those people are Butler won't name. I doubt it's Thibodeau. Is it Layden? Is it Taylor? Is it others in the front office? Is it Wiggins and Towns? Who else? And what does he mean when he says "it could be fixed" ? What would it mean to be "fixed"? Does it mean that KAT or Wiggins (maybe both) need to be traded?

I'm going to take a stab in the dark at deciphering what Butler means and what ultimately led to his trade demand. I'm convinced he told Thibodeau and Layden at least as far back as last April that he wanted the organization to deal KAT and Wiggins and build around him a team of players to his liking. He probably included a new max contract in his list of demands, which would go hand and hand with trading Wiggins and KAT. Thibodeau clearly told him no and told him to be patient and that he'd change his mind after playing out the season. That obviously wasn't enough for Jimmy.

That's a pretty good breakdown and possible narrative especially moving Wiggins. I'll add this...I think Thibs thought that some of his moves this offseason might make Jimmy reconsider. I don't think Thibs did some things just because they might convince Jimmy but I could see Thibs saying after the draft, "Jimmy Josh Okogie...this kid is all energy all the time. You'll love working with him" Tolliver seems like a seasoned vet that would appeal to Butler as well. I get if Butler was resolute and all that but I also find it weird that he didn't even seem to give it any chance. Your scenario honestly makes as much sense as anything I've read about all this. Bravo.

One more thing. Butler said he did tell Thibs how he felt 4 days after the playoffs. I'll say that's pretty soon after the season. I think it's absolutely understandable that Thibs would give him a bit of a cooling off period and then have some time to convince him to stay. Thibs had/has a special relationship with Jimmy I think it's fair to give Thibs some time to change Butler's mind even if you don't think he was gonna be able to do it or even go further and you don't want to convince Butler to come back. At some point It does seem clear now Thibs, Layden and Glen should have realized they needed to do something before the September meeting and avoid the circus we have now. It is highly entertaining though!!!!

Over a month ago, Thibodeau said he was talking to Jimmy regularly. Does anyone really think Jimmy said he was feeling better about things?? One wonders if Thibodeau even asked him, but Butler probably told him exactly what he was feeling because Jimmy doesn't hold anything back as we've seen.

There is absolutely no excuse for failing to get this resolved one way or the other back in June. Thibodeau probably thought Jimmy needed time to cool off after Butler shared his frustration back in April. But the draft was two months after that initial conversation! Would it be reasonable to expect Thibodeau to reassess the situation with Butler in early June after giving Butler 6 or 7 weeks enough time to "cool off??!!" Fact is, there is no excuse for Thibodeau's inaction regarding Butler. This is no mystery. Thibodeau just couldn't stand the thought of losign Butler and he knew trading Wiggins and KAT wasn't an option. So our favorite stubborn troll just barricaded himself in his cave and refused to do his job. His job was to deal with the situation and he failed.

I don't know what to think of Butler. Rondo said of Butler something to the effect that he can't imagine anyone wanting to be around him. We know Butler alienated a lot of players in Chicago, not just Rondo. And we're read reports about the reluctance of some GMs to pursue Butler because of his potential problems with teammates. But Butler is what he is. And if anyone should have known what Butler is, it's Thibodeau. Yet, Thibodeau traded for him and then failed to address Butler telling him months ago that he hated the situation here didn't stay. This situation this team is in right now is unconscionable. And responsibility for the situation rests with almost entirely with Thibodeau, but also with his lapdog assistant, Scott Layden, and his feckless boss, Glen Taylor, who should have fired him at least two weeks ago if not sooner. As a fan and long-term season ticket holder who has put a lot of money into this organization, I'm disgusted and offended by the unbelievable display of incompetence we're seeing from this franchise.