Minnesota Sports Forum

monsterpile wrote:

longstrangetrip wrote:

Q12543 wrote:I don't know about you guys, but I'm disillusioned by lottery picks at this point. I'm tired of them. Hell, look at the lotto picks from this past draft. How many of them are on court pluses? We're still talking about how young and inexperienced and patient we need to be with guys like Wiggins and LaVine and they are in their 3rd year!

Just Say No to more lottery picks! Trade the damn thing!

Yeah, that's exactly where I am, Q...just not interested in another lottery pick that isn't ready to contribute. We need to win now! I was an advocate of trading last year's pick, and I'm an advocate of trading this year's.

Well those lottery picks are why there is any optimism about this team going forward. This team will have a bunch of cap space this offseason if you want to get some vet players. If there is a good player there to pick they should pick them. It makes even more sense when next year they actually have their own d-league team where they can develop their guy for a stretch instead of it just being someplace for the guy to go play games. There could be a trade that makes sense but trading away picks because they won't make enough difference now is not what I want to see.

When it comes to lottery picks, I absolutely want to trade it. We can't wait any longer to make our move. We have plenty of youth and potential on this squad, now we need to put a real team together that can go out and win games. We thought that would happen this year, but it didn't because our young guys aren't ready yet. Adding another young guy with one year of college experience isn't going to help.

Now if we were in the business of winning and getting late 1sts and 2nd rounders, I absolutely agree that those draft picks should be kept and carefully groomed through the D-league. It doesn't work that way with lottery picks, where the expectation is much higher, not just by the organization but by the player and his agent. You can't stick a #4 or #6 pick in the D-league for two or three months. You can do that with later picks and bring them along much more slowly (Tyus Jones is a good example).

Q12543 wrote:

monsterpile wrote:

longstrangetrip wrote:

Q12543 wrote:I don't know about you guys, but I'm disillusioned by lottery picks at this point. I'm tired of them. Hell, look at the lotto picks from this past draft. How many of them are on court pluses? We're still talking about how young and inexperienced and patient we need to be with guys like Wiggins and LaVine and they are in their 3rd year!

Just Say No to more lottery picks! Trade the damn thing!

Yeah, that's exactly where I am, Q...just not interested in another lottery pick that isn't ready to contribute. We need to win now! I was an advocate of trading last year's pick, and I'm an advocate of trading this year's.

Well those lottery picks are why there is any optimism about this team going forward. This team will have a bunch of cap space this offseason if you want to get some vet players. If there is a good player there to pick they should pick them. It makes even more sense when next year they actually have their own d-league team where they can develop their guy for a stretch instead of it just being someplace for the guy to go play games. There could be a trade that makes sense but trading away picks because they won't make enough difference now is not what I want to see.

When it comes to lottery picks, I absolutely want to trade it. We can't wait any longer to make our move. We have plenty of youth and potential on this squad, now we need to put a real team together that can go out and win games. We thought that would happen this year, but it didn't because our young guys aren't ready yet. Adding another young guy with one year of college experience isn't going to help.

Now if we were in the business of winning and getting late 1sts and 2nd rounders, I absolutely agree that those draft picks should be kept and carefully groomed through the D-league. It doesn't work that way with lottery picks, where the expectation is much higher, not just by the organization but by the player and his agent. You can't stick a #4 or #6 pick in the D-league for two or three months. You can do that with later picks and bring them along much more slowly (Tyus Jones is a good example).

Q I don't think the stigma against playing in the D-league is what it was. Teams have shuttled various pick down there for short amounts of time. There are good players in the league that have basically developed in that league. If it's between a young player sitting on the bench or playing games the player and the agent may see plenty of benefits to getting in some game action. Would they send a top 5ish pick down there? Idk probably not for very long but it's still a good avenue for development this team hasn't had before and another reason this team should be looking for a 2nd round pick to buy.

Now as far as this team being so young...we don't know what will happen in the offseason. Wiggins Towns, Lavine, Dunn and Tyus are young and Belly is inexperienced. That's 6 guys that are young/inexperienced. There would be room for a couple developmental guys while adding somevets guys as well. Name the trades where a team traded a top 10 pick for a vet player that worked out. I'd like to see the scenarios.

I get the angst but this team also has 2 positions PG and PF that aren't shored up yet. It's possible this is a draft they could fill one or even both spots if they get lucky with 2 picks. I think Thibs and Layden are trusting their process and are being patient.

I'm not in the camp of trading the pick... just to trade it. But I certainly understand it.

For example, I championed for trading the pick when the #2 pick was Derrick Williams. I championed trading the #4 pick when it was Wes Johnson. And I championed trading the #5 pick when it was Kris Dunn. And the value of those draft spots is going to be more than the actual player in most cases because certain teams like/want certain players and don't want to lose that guy to somebody else.

But every draft is different. This is supposed to be a very good draft. And the Wolves have two question marks on the roster right now among the young guys... LaVine and Dunn. I'm not saying definitively either way what they should do... even though it's obvious this team needs a legit veteran presence.

But if there's a superstar in waiting at #3 or #4 or wherever the Wolves are picking... things might get dicey.

If Ball or Fultz are available, I can see keeping the pick, but the reality is these guys will probably go in the top 2 or 3, so I doubt we have a shot at them.

The top of the draft is not very deep at PF, so I don't see that as a good option. We could get a Tatum or Jackson at SF, but neither one stands out to me.

The bottom-line is our needs and what looks to be available in the position we'll draft in doesn't match up well.

Q12543 wrote:If Ball or Fultz are available, I can see keeping the pick, but the reality is these guys will probably go in the top 2 or 3, so I doubt we have a shot at them.

The top of the draft is not very deep at PF, so I don't see that as a good option. We could get a Tatum or Jackson at SF, but neither one stands out to me.

The bottom-line is our needs and what looks to be available in the position we'll draft in doesn't match up well.

Sure. Let's see how it all shakes out. If that's the case... by all means... trade that pick.

Abe I was wanting the Wolves to trade the pick in some of those drafts also. I was more interested in trading down to get more picks. Why? Like you I wasn't sold on the players available at the spots there and thought you could get value with the higher picks. An example (although lower in the draft) was when Flip traded #10 down and got two better players than Burke in Bazz and Dieng. Personally Innthe Derrick Williams draft I would have taken Kanter. In this last draft I wasn't completely sold on the guards available but Dunn according to a bunch of people fell into the Wolves laps at #5.

I get that Q isn't just saying to trade it to trade it but I'm skeptical of a deal that's actually going to be worth making. If it's not a really good player then the Wolves should be signing a good enough vet FA or developing their next Jamychal Green or whatever success story is high enough within reason. Every good team has at least one 2nd round pick or undrafted guy that becomes a legit contributor. The Wolves don't have that right now but I bet they find one guy. If they can't make those other smart solid moves this team won't get to the level we want them to regardless of what they do with that pick.

It's also a little early to make decisions about the draft and how good it is and whether the team should keep it if we are in one spot or another (but it's a forum so that's what we do!). There is a lot of college basketball to be played. There could be an international player that hasn't really been talked about much. It's possible te Wolves could get a young player and get one that doesn't suck right away as well. It's also possible Thibs doesn't play the young guys right away like he did this year. He might have more in place after adding some vets and have guys develop from the bench.

monsterpile wrote:

longstrangetrip wrote:

Q12543 wrote:I don't know about you guys, but I'm disillusioned by lottery picks at this point. I'm tired of them. Hell, look at the lotto picks from this past draft. How many of them are on court pluses? We're still talking about how young and inexperienced and patient we need to be with guys like Wiggins and LaVine and they are in their 3rd year!

Just Say No to more lottery picks! Trade the damn thing!

Yeah, that's exactly where I am, Q...just not interested in another lottery pick that isn't ready to contribute. We need to win now! I was an advocate of trading last year's pick, and I'm an advocate of trading this year's.

Well those lottery picks are why there is any optimism about this team going forward. This team will have a bunch of cap space this offseason if you want to get some vet players. If there is a good player there to pick they should pick them. It makes even more sense when next year they actually have their own d-league team where they can develop their guy for a stretch instead of it just being someplace for the guy to go play games. There could be a trade that makes sense but trading away picks because they won't make enough difference now is not what I want to see.

I agree Monster! Long term success typically requires a team draft well and keep talented, young, and inexpensive players transitioning up the depth chart. The Wolves can make an impact in free agency if they want to so I'm still good with drafting the best player available.

Draft the best player available and keep him as this will be the last high pick for some time! Wait, I feel like I've said this before a time or four.

I think you look for best value period. Biggest needs for us in my opinion are a starting PF and a backup 3&D guy.

bleedspeed177 wrote:I think you look for best value period. Biggest needs for us in my opinion are a starting PF and a backup 3&D guy.

Tough to place a value on a mid-lottery pick since no one knows what he will turn out to be. What we do know is that he will likely be a liability for his first year or two. Can we afford to have that kind of player in the rotation next year? I don't think so.

If we can't find a good vet to use the pick to trade for, I'd be fine with trading down in the draft or trading for future picks. I just don't think we are in a position to accommodate another 19 or 20-year old kid in the rotation....or any rookie for that matter, but it's most likely that age with a lottery pick.

If we trade down, we have lot more leeway to groom the player slowly via the D-League and the end of our bench.

Q12543 wrote:

bleedspeed177 wrote:I think you look for best value period. Biggest needs for us in my opinion are a starting PF and a backup 3&D guy.

Tough to place a value on a mid-lottery pick since no one knows what he will turn out to be. What we do know is that he will likely be a liability for his first year or two. Can we afford to have that kind of player in the rotation next year? I don't think so.

If we can't find a good vet to use the pick to trade for, I'd be fine with trading down in the draft or trading for future picks. I just don't think we are in a position to accommodate another 19 or 20-year old kid in the rotation....or any rookie for that matter, but it's most likely that age with a lottery pick.

If we trade down, we have lot more leeway to groom the player slowly via the D-League and the end of our bench.

So you are still ok with a young player on the team then right? :) If you think a guy is going to be a good player (espcially if you think they fit your team) then you pick them regardless of how young your team is. I say and have said that for years and that's whether it's a top 5 pick middle of the first round end of the first round 2nd round etc. There is no excuse for passing on good players because they are young. Look at all the picks the Wolves have sold and traded away and teams have used picks to get legit players. It's sickening. I'm tired of that too.