Minnesota Sports Forum

I'm on the fence on this one. Green does have a reputation, so that likely entered into the league's decision (do you think the league would have given Ricky Rubio a flagrant 1 if he swiped and missed an opponent?). I like Green, but he is young and fiery, and has to learn that his behavior is going to hurt him sometimes.

I'm generally not a conspiracy guy, but I wonder if the series situation entered into the decision at all. The NBA can't be too happy with this finals (and to some extent, the entire playoffs)...too many blowouts, and little chance of even getting to a Game 6. Without Green, the Cavs have a better chance of extending the series and bringing in some more money (but I don't think they will win anyway).

I wish you would stop saying LeBron threw Draymond to the ground because that's not what actually happened. LeBron got a little physical with him and Draymond took a dive in order to try and sell a call. He does that from time to time and he's often successful with it. Also, it's late in the fourth quarter of an NBA Finals game and the guy guarding you just fell to the floor. Are you really thinking, "Man, I should go out of my way to walk around him," or are you trying to stay involved in the play? The latter makes the most sense.

And yes, Draymond has a history of hitting guys in the groin, whether "accidental" or not. Flagrant fouls as of recent aren't based off intent, they're based on what happened. Just a couple weeks ago, Bismack Biyombo was given a flagrant for elbowing Kevin Love in the jaw on a basketball play. Biyombo didn't do that on purpose, but he still connected. That's what mattered. Draymond connected. That's what mattered. Oh, and I don't know anybody that gets up from the floor while flailing an arm out. He tried to hit him in some capacity. You want to argue that he couldn't see where he was swinging, BUT HE STILL SWUNG.

Camden0916 wrote:I wish you would stop saying LeBron threw Draymond to the ground because that's not what actually happened. LeBron got a little physical with him and Draymond took a dive in order to try and sell a call. He does that from time to time and he's often successful with it. Also, it's late in the fourth quarter of an NBA Finals game and the guy guarding you just fell to the floor. Are you really thinking, "Man, I should go out of my way to walk around him," or are you trying to stay involved in the play? The latter makes the most sense.

And yes, Draymond has a history of hitting guys in the groin, whether "accidental" or not. Flagrant fouls as of recent aren't based off intent, they're based on what happened. Just a couple weeks ago, Bismack Biyombo was given a flagrant for elbowing Kevin Love in the jaw on a basketball play. Biyombo didn't do that on purpose, but he still connected. That's what mattered. Draymond connected. That's what mattered. Oh, and I don't know anybody that gets up from the floor while flailing an arm out. He tried to hit him in some capacity. You want to argue that he couldn't see where he was swinging, BUT HE STILL SWUNG.

Lebron took his arm, put it across Draymond's chest/neck and pushed him to the ground. There was no flop. Get off Lebron's dick and view the play objectively. Lebron pushed him to the ground, looked at him and walked over him. It would have actually been super easy to not walk over him, but he did so intentionally. He had the entire left side of the court to walk around him. He chose to walk over him to get to the top of the key to send a message. Get your head out of Lebron's ass and stop defending a punk play because you don't like Draymond. Draymond swung because Lebron T bagged him walking over him. Any normal NBA player is going to do that. And if you don't believe me read Speight's quote today on the play.

Okay, khans. Pipe down. How sweet of you to tell me that I'm not looking at the situation objectively because we disagree. It is possible, and likely, that we saw the play differently. Meanwhile, you're getting riled up within your post saying this and that about me because I don't think LeBron was in the wrong there. Whatever, man. Draymond was rightfully issued a flagrant for his actions and will be missing Game 5. That's a done deal.

One thing I'm sure of is Lebron did the step over with complete intent and knowledge of what he was doing. It's really naïve to think otherwise.

As I indicated in a prior post, I've been on the fence regarding my feelings towards LeBron. I don't hate him and I truly appreciate his greatness even though I found his behavior in the last game punkish with respect to both Green AND Curry. Actually, I've never liked Green.

But at the end of the day I don't think this suspension was warranted. I've looked a the replay a half dozen times. LeBron did throw Green to the ground. It seems a bit of a stretch to reach any other conclusion. And then, of course, he stepped over him in an obviously aggressive act. It's really hard to know whether Green really intended to make contact and, fact is, he didn't make contact. Given the circumstances and uncertainty, a suspension of such a pivotal player in game 5 of the NBA finals is unacceptable. LeBron was clearly the instigator and primary aggressor in this skirmish. I just don't think it's reasonable to assess a flagrant foul on Green for a swipe that missed, especially under those circumstances.

lipoli390 wrote:As I indicated in a prior post, I've been on the fence regarding my feelings towards LeBron. I don't hate him and I truly appreciate his greatness even though I found his behavior in the last game punkish with respect to both Green AND Curry. Actually, I've never liked Green.

But at the end of the day I don't think this suspension was warranted. I've looked a the replay a half dozen times. LeBron did throw Green to the ground. It seems a bit of a stretch to reach any other conclusion. And then, of course, he stepped over him in an obviously aggressive act. It's really hard to know whether Green really intended to make contact and, fact is, he didn't make contact. Given the circumstances and uncertainty, a suspension of such a pivotal player in game 5 of the NBA finals is unacceptable. LeBron was clearly the instigator and primary aggressor in this skirmish. I just don't think it's reasonable to assess a flagrant foul on Green for a swipe that missed, especially under those circumstances.

Lip look particularly at the 3rd clip in this article. He did make contact which is very hard to see in real time.

http://www.si.com/nba/2016/06/10/lebron-james-draymond-green-scuffle-game-4-warriors-cavs-finals

This was 100% instigated by Lebron and pretty standard reaction by Green. Green probably should have been a little smarter knowing his flagrant foul situation but his reaction was what any basketball fan would have expected to see, trying to push the guy off.

The bottom line here (and it was mentioned already) is this ruling comes down to money. The NBA saw an opportunity to increase the odds of this series going more than 5 games and they took it.

The Rage Monster wrote:This was 100% instigated by Lebron and pretty standard reaction by Green. Green probably should have been a little smarter knowing his flagrant foul situation but his reaction was what any basketball fan would have expected to see, trying to push the guy off.

The bottom line here (and it was mentioned already) is this ruling comes down to money. The NBA saw an opportunity to increase the odds of this series going more than 5 games and they took it.

So you are pretty confident that if Green was not 1 flagrant point away from suspesion, the NBA would have just out right suspended him?

I am not naive enough to think the NBA would ignore the current playoff situation in making their decision. But it sure seems like a stretch to say their decision was based soley on increasing the likelihood of extending the series.

60WinTim wrote:

The Rage Monster wrote:This was 100% instigated by Lebron and pretty standard reaction by Green. Green probably should have been a little smarter knowing his flagrant foul situation but his reaction was what any basketball fan would have expected to see, trying to push the guy off.

The bottom line here (and it was mentioned already) is this ruling comes down to money. The NBA saw an opportunity to increase the odds of this series going more than 5 games and they took it.

So you are pretty confident that if Green was not 1 flagrant point away from suspesion, the NBA would have just out right suspended him?

I am not naive enough to think the NBA would ignore the current playoff situation in making their decision. But it sure seems like a stretch to say their decision was based soley on increasing the likelihood of extending the series.

I did not say that. I said the NBA saw an opportunity to increase the odds of the series continuing beyond 5 games. This opportunity came because Green was only 1 flagrant away from a suspension allowing the league to hide behind that policy.

Just look how the league handled the situation, they gave Green a flagrant foul and Lebron a tech. If this was called on the court I am confident they would have given double techs. The league didn't do that I believe becasue a tech wouldn't have given Green a suspension