Q12543 wrote:Also, we've had ball handlers and shot creators here that hurt us more than helped us. Michael Beasley was a great shot creator, yet he really didn't help us all that much. Derrick Williams could create his own shot. JJ Barea is excellent at creating shots. The problem is these guys simply weren't that good.
The key is finding someone that is a shot creator and can actually make shots! That's a lot easier said than done!
Q -- Redick, Thompson and Barnes are not great slasher/shot-creators, but they are good in that area and definitely better than Martin or Brewer. Redick in particular is a very good ball handler. And yes, I agree shot-creators only help if they can make shots e.g., Williams and Beasley (although I don't see Williams as a good ball handler by any stretch.) I continue to view the three Warrior players I mentioned to be good ball handlers/shot-creators who can make shots. While not "easy" to find good ball handler/slashers who can score, it's not a Herculean task either.
I agree with you that defense is the bigger distinguishing factor between Martin and the other guys I mentioned.
There are 3 guys that fits this description that i wiuld love to get. Namely gordon hayward, dion waiters and danillo gallinari.
Hayward would be ideal, he brings shooting and playmaking as well. Only chance jazz trade him is if they are in position to land parker or wiggins. Pek or a 3 team trade would be needed to get hayward.
Waiters is the most realistic scenario. Pek +bud for waiters +varejao+gee seema fair for bith sides.
Gallo is coming off serious knee injury and denver is rebuilding. thats the only reason he might be available. Do we take a chance on him? If the price isnt to steep i would take chance at him. The guy is good.
worldK wrote:There are 3 guys that fits this description that i wiuld love to get. Namely gordon hayward, dion waiters and danillo gallinari.
Hayward would be ideal, he brings shooting and playmaking as well. Only chance jazz trade him is if they are in position to land parker or wiggins. Pek or a 3 team trade would be needed to get hayward.
Waiters is the most realistic scenario. Pek +bud for waiters +varejao+gee seema fair for bith sides.
Gallo is coming off serious knee injury and denver is rebuilding. thats the only reason he might be available. Do we take a chance on him? If the price isnt to steep i would take chance at him. The guy is good.
The Waiters love continues to baffle me. It's like seeing an oasis in a desert that ends up being just a hallucination. What do you guys see in Waiters that makes him worth giving up someone that's actually good, like Pekovic?
I like that he can create his own shot, shoots a decent percentage from 3, and can get to the line. I think his growth has been stunted playing next to Irving in Cleveland. I realize he is a little small, but there aren't a lot of options when it comes to the SG position. I would rather grab Beal, but I doubt Wash would move him. Seems like a good fit with Rubio. He is also still on a rookie deal for a couple more seasons as well.
Moving Pek is more about salary and replacements. I think this team is better with an upgrade at SG, and a defensive oriented C. If we were able to get AV and Waiters for Pek, it improves us more as a team.
I'm still very much on the fence about trading Pek, and am trending towards "why on earth would we trade Pek?!?"
Love, Pek and Deing could be pretty damn good as our top 3 bigs . It's something we didn't get a chance to see because Deing's emergence didn't occur until Pek was injured. I don't think our holes are so big that we need to break up those three to fill them. And a defensive-minded coach might even make them more awesome.
We absolutely need a couple of ball handlers/shot creators to displace Barea and Shved. But I'm not convinced we need the "big buck" ones that would require us to trade anything significant (like Pek).
How about a simple trade addressing this need of #13/Barea for Afflalo. I think this makes sense for both sides. Orlando is in a complete rebuild, and Afflalo is simply not a guy a young team builds around. They will also need a vet PG to take over for Nelson, as they will certainly decline the last year of his deal at $8M.
Orlando would now have 3 picks in the top 13 of what is perceived as a loaded draft. This allows them to trade up a bit with picks 12 & 13 if they like someone a few slots higher, to go along with what will be a top 3 pick with their pick.
I know Cam will hate not having a chance at Stauskas, but if the Wolves truly want to get better NEXT SEASON, Stauskas is not the answer (nor is anyone else outside the top 3). Afflalo, while clearly not a star player, is a solid 2 way guy that would clearly make us much better next season. I would then look to sign Jordan Hill and either Vazquez/Sessions/Chalmers to play backup PG.
Starters:
C - Pek / Dieng / Turiaf
PF - Love / Hill / Moute
SF - Brewer / Bud / Shabazz
SG - Afflalo / Martin / Bud
PG - Rubio / FA / Shved
I like the depth on the bench much better with this lineup.
sjm34 wrote:I like that he can create his own shot, shoots a decent percentage from 3, and can get to the line. I think his growth has been stunted playing next to Irving in Cleveland. I realize he is a little small, but there aren't a lot of options when it comes to the SG position. I would rather grab Beal, but I doubt Wash would move him. Seems like a good fit with Rubio. He is also still on a rookie deal for a couple more seasons as well.
Moving Pek is more about salary and replacements. I think this team is better with an upgrade at SG, and a defensive oriented C. If we were able to get AV and Waiters for Pek, it improves us more as a team.
I don't see Waiters as an upgrade at SG. If he wasn't very successful in two seasons in Cleveland, then we're basically making a bet that he'll suddenly blossom in Minnesota. No thanks.
As for Center, we already have two defensive-oriented guys at that position signed at very reasonable deals - Dieng and Turiaf. Why would we need AV?
This seems like a poor deal to me. I'm all for exploring options for Pek, but at the end of the day, I don't think there are very many out there that actually make us a better team.
60WinTim wrote:I'm still very much on the fence about trading Pek, and am trending towards "why on earth would we trade Pek?!?"
Love, Pek and Deing could be pretty damn good as our top 3 bigs . It's something we didn't get a chance to see because Deing's emergence didn't occur until Pek was injured. I don't think our holes are so big that we need to break up those three to fill them. And a defensive-minded coach might even make them more awesome.
We absolutely need a couple of ball handlers/shot creators to displace Barea and Shved. But I'm not convinced we need the "big buck" ones that would require us to trade anything significant (like Pek).
I agree Tim. A reach like Waiters seems like a desperate move that doesn't have to be made. Luol Deng I can get my mind wrapped around, but not speculative trades that rely on the hope that someone will suddenly improve.
Q, Deng posted about the same numbers as Waiters last year, and one guy is on his way up while the other is on his way down in their respective careers. I would still rather take Deng over Pek, but I think Waiters and AV make more sense salary and flexibility wise.
Why would we think we can suddenly land the wing players we need without using any assets, when we haven't been able to accomplish in ten years?
Maybe you want to block out the injury issues with Pek, but I know it is likely that a guy weighing 290 lbs having repetitive type injuries in his ankle will have more trouble moving forward, not less. Add to that the guy is making 12 mil a year for the next 4 seasons, and I see a disaster waiting to happen. Don't throw out the less minutes, less injuries theme, because Pek has already proven that to be false. Unless you plan on cutting him down to 15 minutes a night, and then I would ask why are we paying him 12 mil. Take into account that this team posted the same record regardless of whether Pek was playing or not, and it seems like a no brainer to me.
AV can EFFETIVELY play PF or C for our team, and more importantly is on an expiring deal. Waiters is still on his rookie deal, and should be more attractive to us in the case that Love decides to leave. I don't see how making miniscule improvements going into next season will help us keep Love.
