Minnesota Sports Forum

KiwiMatt wrote:I'm more optimistic about this teams future than others.

Finishing at .500 in a tough Western Conference is nothing to be disappointed about, especially with all the new faces on this roster. Look at all the teams ahead of us, they're established teams with low player turnovers and established cores.

We are not as far off as most people think. Look at Portland's transformation from last season to this season. It's the path we need to follow and a realistic one at that, without having to blow up the roster again.

These are the things that need to happen in the offseason for us to make the next step:

* Hire a defensive minded coach good at developing players (Hollins, Skiles etc).
* The continued development of Muhammad and Dieng.
* Draft the BPA with 1st round pick (provided we keep it).
* Upgrade the backup PG and PF's spots.
* Rubio becoming more of an scoring threat.

Matt - I like your optimism. I also think your analysis is reasonable and I agree with the five key steps you've identified. But I still don't think we can improve enough with Brewer and Martin as our starting wings for several reasons.

1. First, neither one is a good ball handler at their position and one of them, Brewer, is a terrible ball handler. So neither one scores well on dribble penetration and Ricky is forced to bear the starting unit's entire ball handling burden. A starting lineup with no good dribble penetration scorers is generally not a winning formula in the NBA and we have repeatedly seen the results down the stretch in close games. Meanwhile, bearing the entire ballhandling burden stresses Ricky's stamina, which I think negatively impacts his shooting and defense.

2. Second, Martin is a good overall scorer, but he's a terrible defender at a position that typically matches up against many of the best scorers in the League. It would be one thing if he were an average or slightly below average defender, but he's a really bad defender. And even on the offensive end, he's very inconsistent game to game. Even worse, he often becomes passive and actually hides in the offense or passes up shots in crunch time. I'd love him as a 6th man, but I think we need to improve over him at the starting SG spot if possible. I might see things differently if we had a better paint defender up front next to Love, but the lack of a stellar defender at the center position magnifies Martin's poor defense.

3. Third, Brewer is the reverse of Martin. He's a good defender, but poor offensive player. And his defense, while good, isn't great. I really like Brewer and can definitely see him as an important rotation player, but as a starting SF he falls short of what we need given the other players in our starting lineup.

So while I agree that improving our bench and hiring a better, defensive-minded head coach would definitely improve this team, I still think we have a fundamental flaw in our starting lineup that needs to be fixed. And I'm not confident that we can expect Shabazz and Dieng to become positive impact players next season. Meanwhile we have no cap room and limited trade prospects other than Love and Ricky unless we trade Pekovic.

Bottom line is this. You are right that there are reasons to be optimistic about this team's prospects. But I think it will take some really smart decisions by our front office this summer and a healthy dose of plain old luck to turn your optimistic vision into reality. Let's keep our fingers crossed.

Doper, I agree that this season has been frustrating. I predicted 50 wins out of this club, and it looks like they are going to fall 6-7 wins short...big underachieving year. But 2013-4 is far from the worst season to be a fan. I was a season ticket holder for many years, and it was really difficult to find compelling reasons to venture down to Target Center in the post KG years. Those teams were unwatchable. This year's squad has lots of parts that are intriguing to watch. Watching Love reinvent the PF position and put up ridiculous numbers is worth the price of admission alone. In addition we get occasional inspired and creative play from Rubio, whirling dervish energy from Brewer, and the always watchable Pek smash. Finally, I have tuned in on some nights just to see if Adelman would give some minutes to two rookies that I find quite intriguing, and when they have played, they have shown a lot of potential.

Like you, I want more success. Jeez, at least give us a playoff game. But I still enjoyed this year's version of the team much more than the ones in the dark years between the Kevins.

Let's face it. Nik Stauskas and a new backup PG (Steve Blake) puts in the playoffs. That's still the first step: playoffs. Growth from Bazz and Gorgui increases our team potential as well. If Ricky would make one more layup a game we'd be fine with his PPG/FG%. And back to Stauskas, the kid has STAR potential. Is it a lock that Flip takes him? Certainly not, but I do believe he'll be available considering the other prospects in this class. SG that can handle the basketball, create for himself and others, fantastic shooter, "carry my team on my back" persona, smart too (very good ast/to ratio). This move would/could push Martin to the sixth man role where many of us feel he'd be better suited (keep his minutes in check too). As for SF, I believe Bazz can be what we need. Strong, physical 3-man that has the potential to be good defensively. Hustle player. Just needs time; he's still a young man (we forget that sometimes).

You'll probably read this and push it to the side because of the Stauskas name-drop. Yes, I know it's not a lock that we get him. Is he what we need, though? No doubt about it in my mind.

Cam, in on board with you on the stauskus train. The kid is an elite shooter. Steph curry and klay thompson like shooting ability.

that said, i still think we need to retool the roster. Like lip, im not a fan of brewer and martin as the starting wings. Il be all for trading martin this off season. He seems to have no bearing whatsoever whether we win a game or lose a game. He puts up nice numbers but i would like a guy that has more impact to the way we play than martin has so far. Brewer is really better suited to be a bench guy giving you 20+mins a night as opposed to a starter playing 30+ a night. Flip has to make the right moves to build this thing into a contender. No more 'improve from within' mantra that he and mchale pushbin the kg years. Were not good enough as it is. Pieces needs to be added and move around to balance the roster and build one last time around love and rubio.

worldK wrote:Cam, in on board with you on the stauskus train. The kid is an elite shooter. Steph curry and klay thompson like shooting ability.

that said, i still think we need to retool the roster. Like lip, im not a fan of brewer and martin as the starting wings. Il be all for trading martin this off season. He seems to have no bearing whatsoever whether we win a game or lose a game. He puts up nice numbers but i would like a guy that has more impact to the way we play than martin has so far. Brewer is really better suited to be a bench guy giving you 20+mins a night as opposed to a starter playing 30+ a night. Flip has to make the right moves to build this thing into a contender. No more 'improve from within' mantra that he and mchale pushbin the kg years. Were not good enough as it is. Pieces needs to be added and move around to balance the roster and build one last time around love and rubio.

Stauskas shooting contest:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yuH5mqHKIUk

AbeVigodaLive wrote:

worldK wrote:Cam, in on board with you on the stauskus train. The kid is an elite shooter. Steph curry and klay thompson like shooting ability.

that said, i still think we need to retool the roster. Like lip, im not a fan of brewer and martin as the starting wings. Il be all for trading martin this off season. He seems to have no bearing whatsoever whether we win a game or lose a game. He puts up nice numbers but i would like a guy that has more impact to the way we play than martin has so far. Brewer is really better suited to be a bench guy giving you 20+mins a night as opposed to a starter playing 30+ a night. Flip has to make the right moves to build this thing into a contender. No more 'improve from within' mantra that he and mchale pushbin the kg years. Were not good enough as it is. Pieces needs to be added and move around to balance the roster and build one last time around love and rubio.

Stauskas shooting contest:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yuH5mqHKIUk

Okay, but can he do it with a dry ball? :undecided:

Stauskas looks to be a great shooter, and has enough handle to get by. We could do a lot worse at #13. My one concern is his defense. I think if he is able to add a little more strength, he can at least reach average in that category. He seems to have the mindset you want in a scorer, and looks to be a hard worker as well.

I am not sure that Bazz would be a great fit next to him though. I would want a guy in the 6'7-8 225-35 lb range for our SF to play next to him. The SF would need to be a solid defender that could the take the tougher assignment. Think Tony Allen. If we could add those two guys, with Martin and Brewer going to the bench, I think we look to improve significantly. Using Pek/Bud to find a more defensive oriented C (cheaper) and that SG-SF defensive guy should be doable.

I just have the feeling Stauskas has the potential to be a plus defender in the NBA. He's reasonably athletic, and more importantly, has a nasty edge to him. He's a cocky guy who just doesn't think the other guy is better than him. And those kinds of guys often excel on defense. Don't think of this guy as just a shooter...he's much more than that.

sjm34 wrote:Taylor already came out in a TV interview and said it was decision not to give Love the 5th year, and also said he didn't hire Kahn to do talent evaluation, but never hired anyone else to take the duties over.

I have no idea what Taylor was thinking when hiring Flip. Maybe he thought it would get the media off his back because they couldn't rip Kahn enough. Funny that the media never go after Flip. Even in the article by Brit Robison that Abe linked in another thread, he never actually comes out and rips Adelman. Only suggesting lineup changes, but not questioning why they haven't already happened.

If Taylor already said it was his decision doesn't this seal that Love would want to leave? If this is the case then if Flip could somehow convince Love to stay, he would have to be GM of the year.

longstrangetrip wrote:I just have the feeling Stauskas has the potential to be a plus defender in the NBA. He's reasonably athletic, and more importantly, has a nasty edge to him. He's a cocky guy who just doesn't think the other guy is better than him. And those kinds of guys often excel on defense. Don't think of this guy as just a shooter...he's much more than that.

I think he could be a cross between Kmart on offense with a better looking shot and a little more aggressive in slashing, and a Steve Blake on D if he gets a little stronger.