Minnesota Sports Forum

CoolBreeze44 wrote:

monsterpile wrote:Preach Future Preach. I agree with all that you are saying.

I will say that for teams trading for backups that Matt Schaub worked out pretty well for a few years.

What the hell is the matter with you Monster? Future's takes in this thread are ridiculous and I'm starting to think he's just trolling.

Not sure how you are taking these viewpoints as being so ridiculous. Maybe you could explain why.

CoolBreeze44 wrote:

TheFuture wrote:

CoolBreeze44 wrote:<cough> Curt Warner <cough>

Kurt Warner is an extreme exception, not the rule. There was also a ton more experience under his belt than anyone else you've been bringing up. He also was not traded for. Your idea of salvaging this season is bonkers. What we should do is exactly what the staff will do. Trade a late pick or pick up a cheap option through FA. If hill and that FA fail our team then we accept our mid to high level draft pick and continue to build for our future.

Teams only spend a 2nd - 4th round pick on a rookie QB they can control and develop for 4 seasons. They don't give such valuable assets away for another teams garbage. The Successful franchises are always gaining, never giving. Just go look at what Green Bay, indianapolis, or New England did when their QBs got hurt, they accepted the lost season and got better draft position.

Nobody in the NFL accepts a lost season before it even begins. That might happen in the NBA, but not the NFL where there is so much parity. Your idea to throw away this season is just idiotic. We have extra picks to deal and I believe Rick is going to pony up to bring in a decent option.

Nobody accepts a lost season in the NFL? How about the Browns this season? Or the last? Or the season before that? How about the Lions for so many seasons?

I agree, the chances of going from zero to championship in the NFL is much higher than any other league, because of the short season and the injuries, but it all does hinge on a QB. Those QBs just happen to be the most difficult to replace in all of sports. The exact position we just suffered a huge loss at. Fans tend to focus on that one position, and not what is being built around them over several years. We have nearly everything built, but will have to suffer a setback of the one position that makes the most difference. Waiting again is something we are used to, and something we have to accept doing again. You may desire a championship, like we all do, but your ignorance doesn't change the reality that it very likely won't be happening this season with or without your unicorn replacement QB.

CoolBreeze44 wrote:

monsterpile wrote:Preach Future Preach. I agree with all that you are saying.

I will say that for teams trading for backups that Matt Schaub worked out pretty well for a few years.

What the hell is the matter with you Monster? Future's takes in this thread are ridiculous and I'm starting to think he's just trolling.

So your default narrative is to think someone has something wrong with them when said other person agrees with a point you disagree with?

Oh I forgot, post counts are more important than reality. That's why he should disagree with me.

You're extremely dense.

So, we just gave up a 1st rounder and another pick for Sam Bradford.

Let's start hearing from the "I told you so" guys... ;-)

60WinTim wrote:So, we just gave up a 1st rounder and another pick for Sam Bradford.

Let's start hearing from the "I told you so" guys... ;-)

This tells me they don't expect teddy to be back at all next year

60WinTim wrote:So, we just gave up a 1st rounder and another pick for Sam Bradford.

Let's start hearing from the "I told you so" guys... ;-)

Personally I think it's a lot and initially a I wasn't thrilled however...

Bradford makes a ton of sense for these reasons.

Signed for 2 years so if Teddy isn't ready to start the 2017 season we have an option to keep rolling with Bradford.

He has talent and it fits what this team wants to do. The guy has had some success and it's been without a lot of talent around him both guys reviewing his passes and RBs.

To me Bradford is more talented and a better bet if healthy than some of the other names (especially scrap heap guys) that have been discussed. I still feel like it was a lot to give up but as long as the Vikings don't have to upgrade the Oline with a high pick getting a pretty legit QB when you really need one makes complete sense.

In addition when it comes to value if Bradford stays healthy and performs somewhat well and Teddy is healthy they can turn around and trade him if they want to and get at least a 3rd rounder. If he looks good they could get the 1st round pick back.

Big move. As fans, you have to be happy with the swift and decisive action to save a season where it seems all the pieces are in place.

Do I think they paid too much? Yes. I don't think we could turn around and trade Bradford tomorrow and get a 1st and a 4th back. But that's what happens when you are desperate. And we were desperate. Pretending that we would be happy going into this season starting Shaun Hill was laughable. I think the biggest lesson out of this was we should have upgraded the backup QB situation over the off season. Of course, if Taylor Heinicke hadn't hurt himself right before camp, we might have approached this from a completely different angle (I personally would have like to see that kid play). But facing the facts of only Shaun Hill and Rico Stave as the only healthy QBs, they obviously had to pay the price to bring in someone to stabilize things.

As far as next year and beyond? We went from thinking we have our Franchise QB to not really having one IMO. Teddy hasn't done much up to this point. I'm not saying he was horrible. He did okay. But we were primarily winning games because of AP and our defense. Now he has a lost season and there is usually some recovery time once guys come back just to get back to where they were before. So, we go from hoping this was going to be his breakout year to just hoping he can get back to where he was last year (average). It's a tough break for the kid. But once you sit out a year, a lot of things can change. Look what happened to Sullivan. If Bradford plays well and we have a nice season, Teddy isn't coming back as our starter next year. It's a "what have you done for me lately" world.

What a shit trade. We brought in a glass quarterback who doesn't stretch the field for major assets. He doesn't fit what Norv likes to do. He likes short-intermediate passes and we needed someone who likes to air it out over the 8-9 man fronts we're gonna see. Spielman just has a bad record for evaluating QB talent outside of Teddy who is still a work in progress and who dropped so far down in the first round it was a no brainer. So stupid to give up that much for such a mediocre QB.

I don't know what to think of this deal. Sam Bradford has been so unremarkable in his career, he hasn't been on my radar screen. Here are his stats in his 6 games against the NFC North. 0-6 record, QBR of 26.2, 21 sacks...oh, oh. Reports from Philly are of massive parades and ticker tape being thrown out of skyscrapers...wait, you're telling me we're unloading Bradford AND getting, not giving, a first round pick...really?

So having said that, why am I mixed on this deal? Because the Vikings brass knows way more about Hill/Stave than me, and their conclusion obviously was much more dire than mine. A 1st and a 4th sounds like grand theft larceny, but with the Browns asking for a 3rd rounder for aging Josh McCown, a lot more was going to be asked for a young former first round pick like Bradford...even with his spotty record. And for those who sought someone like Rivers, this tells me his price tag would have started with 2 picks and also included a solid defensive starter. So I think Rick paid what he had to pay to control Bradford for the 2 years Teddy might be out or limited. The question for me is whether a scrap heap free agent for free might have been a better option.

So, what's the timetable for Bradford? Ideally he will need at least 2 weeks to learn the offense, so I don't see him starting before the 3rd week. I also don't think Zimmer will bench Hill until he loses a game, and I see them beating the Titans in the opener and beating the Pack in the inaugural game in the new stadium. So I think Bradford either starts the 4th game of the season after a loss in Carolina, or gets swapped in for Hill during the 3rd game.

I don't know khans, I have seen more than one analyst say that Bradford fits the mold of a Norv QB more so than Teddy.

No doubt it is a high price. And it could very well fail if Bradford's injuries continue, or he just plain sucks. But it seems just as likely that Bradford could be rejuvenated and flourish under Norv and being surrounded by the players the Vikings have.

In any event, it seems silly to declare this trade a boon or a bust. I am happy the Vikings made a move that has the potential to work out very well.