Minnesota Sports Forum

Camden wrote:

Q-was-here wrote:

Camden wrote:

Q-was-here wrote:

Camden wrote:Last night's game might have been easier if Minnesota had Moses Brown, for example, on their bench and ready to play up to 20 minutes. At a minimum, that guy takes up significant space and secures rebounds, specifically defensive rebounds. Consider that Brown's career defensive rebound percentage is 26.9% compared to Reid's 18.9%. That's a nice weapon to have when you're getting killed on the glass.

But then do we give up something in other areas? I'm generally in favor of finding an upgrade to Naz as our backup C, but Brown seems a bit raw still.

Moses Brown is definitely a raw talent -- even goofy at times -- but there are tangible positives within his game that could compliment the Wolves roster, especially as the 14th or 15th man. What Minnesota would give up in lineups with Brown is any semblance of a scoring/shooting threat at the five. He's a bigger, less-skilled version of Jarred Vanderbilt, offensively. That's the trade off. But at 7'2, 245-pounds with a 7'5 wingspan and a 9'5 standing reach he can physically do things that neither Vanderbilt nor Reid can do.

I think he would have been a nice option last night and in future games where the Wolves struggle to clean the glass. There were rebound opportunities last night where if Minnesota had someone over 6'10 on the floor they probably secure the board, especially on the free throw misses. In short, I think his size translates even if the player in question is raw and unpolished.

Additionally, it doesn't have to be Brown. Even Greg Monroe would have been useful last night. I was simply using Brown as an example because he's young and already a good presence on the defensive glass.

I guess I'm looking for someone that is somewhere between Brown and starting level bigs like Nurkic and JoVal....Legit size and strength, but also with some refinement to their game....but not so much that it costs us more than $10M-12M per year! So not sure if that player exists!

It's almost like what Aaron Baynes was when he was playing for Detroit and Boston a few years ago. Big body, solid rebounder, great screen setter, and generally smart player. Wendell Carter Jr. is another name, although he would likely expect to start or play more than the 18 MPG we need. Tony Bradley is another name on the cheaper side, but seems more proven than Moses Brown.

I think you're asking for a player that's somewhat difficult to come by and won't be cheap to acquire on the trade market. Jakob Poeltl would almost be ideal, but are you prepared to give up the equivalent of two first-round picks to get him? Wendell Carter Jr. is right there as well as someone who would be nice to have. The realistic cost just doesn't make sense to me at this time considering Karl-Anthony Towns is going to play the bulk of his minutes at the five spot.

Maybe Minnesota could sneak in a sizable offer for Isaiah Hartenstein this summer after failing to do so last year. The Clippers already have $160-million on their payroll for next year so I could see them letting him go.

Yes, I get that I'm trying to thread the needle here in finding someone that is between a big, raw prospect and someone that can legit play but not be too expensive to obtain or desire to play 20+ minutes. Hartenstein is a good one for sure.

Camden wrote:

AbeVigodaLive wrote:

Camden wrote:Update: The Wolves are 27-17 (.614) this year when both Karl-Anthony Towns and D'Angelo Russell suit up. They're 40-29 (.580) together since the trade that brought Russell to Minnesota.

Basically a 50-win team. Not bad, especially for this franchise.

That being said... as one of the earliest Russell fans, what do you think is a reasonable extension for Russell? While there are moments like yesterday where he is awesome, I think there's a limit for what his next contract should be.

Just curious where that is for you.



[Note: I haven't looked into it, or comps, to venture a great guess at this time.]

I think a good deal is somewhere around four-years, $90-million. Somewhere in that ballpark. Maybe a little bit more than that depending on how the end of this season goes. I'm using Mike Conley Jr., Lonzo Ball, and Malcolm Brogdon as benchmarks.

I think that's fair. And I think I'd be cool with slightly more, too.

But it's a pretty steep reduction, so I guess the $140M+ question is whether Russell and his camp agree.

Q-was-here wrote:

Camden wrote:

Q-was-here wrote:

Camden wrote:

Q-was-here wrote:

Camden wrote:Last night's game might have been easier if Minnesota had Moses Brown, for example, on their bench and ready to play up to 20 minutes. At a minimum, that guy takes up significant space and secures rebounds, specifically defensive rebounds. Consider that Brown's career defensive rebound percentage is 26.9% compared to Reid's 18.9%. That's a nice weapon to have when you're getting killed on the glass.

But then do we give up something in other areas? I'm generally in favor of finding an upgrade to Naz as our backup C, but Brown seems a bit raw still.

Moses Brown is definitely a raw talent -- even goofy at times -- but there are tangible positives within his game that could compliment the Wolves roster, especially as the 14th or 15th man. What Minnesota would give up in lineups with Brown is any semblance of a scoring/shooting threat at the five. He's a bigger, less-skilled version of Jarred Vanderbilt, offensively. That's the trade off. But at 7'2, 245-pounds with a 7'5 wingspan and a 9'5 standing reach he can physically do things that neither Vanderbilt nor Reid can do.

I think he would have been a nice option last night and in future games where the Wolves struggle to clean the glass. There were rebound opportunities last night where if Minnesota had someone over 6'10 on the floor they probably secure the board, especially on the free throw misses. In short, I think his size translates even if the player in question is raw and unpolished.

Additionally, it doesn't have to be Brown. Even Greg Monroe would have been useful last night. I was simply using Brown as an example because he's young and already a good presence on the defensive glass.

I guess I'm looking for someone that is somewhere between Brown and starting level bigs like Nurkic and JoVal....Legit size and strength, but also with some refinement to their game....but not so much that it costs us more than $10M-12M per year! So not sure if that player exists!

It's almost like what Aaron Baynes was when he was playing for Detroit and Boston a few years ago. Big body, solid rebounder, great screen setter, and generally smart player. Wendell Carter Jr. is another name, although he would likely expect to start or play more than the 18 MPG we need. Tony Bradley is another name on the cheaper side, but seems more proven than Moses Brown.

I think you're asking for a player that's somewhat difficult to come by and won't be cheap to acquire on the trade market. Jakob Poeltl would almost be ideal, but are you prepared to give up the equivalent of two first-round picks to get him? Wendell Carter Jr. is right there as well as someone who would be nice to have. The realistic cost just doesn't make sense to me at this time considering Karl-Anthony Towns is going to play the bulk of his minutes at the five spot.

Maybe Minnesota could sneak in a sizable offer for Isaiah Hartenstein this summer after failing to do so last year. The Clippers already have $160-million on their payroll for next year so I could see them letting him go.

Yes, I get that I'm trying to thread the needle here in finding someone that is between a big, raw prospect and someone that can legit play but not be too expensive to obtain or desire to play 20+ minutes. Hartenstein is a good one for sure.

I just heard that Hartenstein is in the top 5 for opponent fg% at the rim.

Not bad for a guy currently making $1.7M. Just how much more will he command this summer?

AbeVigodaLive wrote:

Q-was-here wrote:

Camden wrote:

Q-was-here wrote:

Camden wrote:

Q-was-here wrote:

Camden wrote:Last night's game might have been easier if Minnesota had Moses Brown, for example, on their bench and ready to play up to 20 minutes. At a minimum, that guy takes up significant space and secures rebounds, specifically defensive rebounds. Consider that Brown's career defensive rebound percentage is 26.9% compared to Reid's 18.9%. That's a nice weapon to have when you're getting killed on the glass.

But then do we give up something in other areas? I'm generally in favor of finding an upgrade to Naz as our backup C, but Brown seems a bit raw still.

Moses Brown is definitely a raw talent -- even goofy at times -- but there are tangible positives within his game that could compliment the Wolves roster, especially as the 14th or 15th man. What Minnesota would give up in lineups with Brown is any semblance of a scoring/shooting threat at the five. He's a bigger, less-skilled version of Jarred Vanderbilt, offensively. That's the trade off. But at 7'2, 245-pounds with a 7'5 wingspan and a 9'5 standing reach he can physically do things that neither Vanderbilt nor Reid can do.

I think he would have been a nice option last night and in future games where the Wolves struggle to clean the glass. There were rebound opportunities last night where if Minnesota had someone over 6'10 on the floor they probably secure the board, especially on the free throw misses. In short, I think his size translates even if the player in question is raw and unpolished.

Additionally, it doesn't have to be Brown. Even Greg Monroe would have been useful last night. I was simply using Brown as an example because he's young and already a good presence on the defensive glass.

I guess I'm looking for someone that is somewhere between Brown and starting level bigs like Nurkic and JoVal....Legit size and strength, but also with some refinement to their game....but not so much that it costs us more than $10M-12M per year! So not sure if that player exists!

It's almost like what Aaron Baynes was when he was playing for Detroit and Boston a few years ago. Big body, solid rebounder, great screen setter, and generally smart player. Wendell Carter Jr. is another name, although he would likely expect to start or play more than the 18 MPG we need. Tony Bradley is another name on the cheaper side, but seems more proven than Moses Brown.

I think you're asking for a player that's somewhat difficult to come by and won't be cheap to acquire on the trade market. Jakob Poeltl would almost be ideal, but are you prepared to give up the equivalent of two first-round picks to get him? Wendell Carter Jr. is right there as well as someone who would be nice to have. The realistic cost just doesn't make sense to me at this time considering Karl-Anthony Towns is going to play the bulk of his minutes at the five spot.

Maybe Minnesota could sneak in a sizable offer for Isaiah Hartenstein this summer after failing to do so last year. The Clippers already have $160-million on their payroll for next year so I could see them letting him go.

Yes, I get that I'm trying to thread the needle here in finding someone that is between a big, raw prospect and someone that can legit play but not be too expensive to obtain or desire to play 20+ minutes. Hartenstein is a good one for sure.

I just heard that Hartenstein is in the top 5 for opponent fg% at the rim.

Not bad for a guy currently making $1.7M. Just how much more will he command this summer?

Interestingly enough, he didn't do so well in the defensive version of your favorite, the RPM stat.

Q-was-here wrote:

AbeVigodaLive wrote:

Q-was-here wrote:

Camden wrote:

Q-was-here wrote:

Camden wrote:

Q-was-here wrote:

Camden wrote:Last night's game might have been easier if Minnesota had Moses Brown, for example, on their bench and ready to play up to 20 minutes. At a minimum, that guy takes up significant space and secures rebounds, specifically defensive rebounds. Consider that Brown's career defensive rebound percentage is 26.9% compared to Reid's 18.9%. That's a nice weapon to have when you're getting killed on the glass.

But then do we give up something in other areas? I'm generally in favor of finding an upgrade to Naz as our backup C, but Brown seems a bit raw still.

Moses Brown is definitely a raw talent -- even goofy at times -- but there are tangible positives within his game that could compliment the Wolves roster, especially as the 14th or 15th man. What Minnesota would give up in lineups with Brown is any semblance of a scoring/shooting threat at the five. He's a bigger, less-skilled version of Jarred Vanderbilt, offensively. That's the trade off. But at 7'2, 245-pounds with a 7'5 wingspan and a 9'5 standing reach he can physically do things that neither Vanderbilt nor Reid can do.

I think he would have been a nice option last night and in future games where the Wolves struggle to clean the glass. There were rebound opportunities last night where if Minnesota had someone over 6'10 on the floor they probably secure the board, especially on the free throw misses. In short, I think his size translates even if the player in question is raw and unpolished.

Additionally, it doesn't have to be Brown. Even Greg Monroe would have been useful last night. I was simply using Brown as an example because he's young and already a good presence on the defensive glass.

I guess I'm looking for someone that is somewhere between Brown and starting level bigs like Nurkic and JoVal....Legit size and strength, but also with some refinement to their game....but not so much that it costs us more than $10M-12M per year! So not sure if that player exists!

It's almost like what Aaron Baynes was when he was playing for Detroit and Boston a few years ago. Big body, solid rebounder, great screen setter, and generally smart player. Wendell Carter Jr. is another name, although he would likely expect to start or play more than the 18 MPG we need. Tony Bradley is another name on the cheaper side, but seems more proven than Moses Brown.

I think you're asking for a player that's somewhat difficult to come by and won't be cheap to acquire on the trade market. Jakob Poeltl would almost be ideal, but are you prepared to give up the equivalent of two first-round picks to get him? Wendell Carter Jr. is right there as well as someone who would be nice to have. The realistic cost just doesn't make sense to me at this time considering Karl-Anthony Towns is going to play the bulk of his minutes at the five spot.

Maybe Minnesota could sneak in a sizable offer for Isaiah Hartenstein this summer after failing to do so last year. The Clippers already have $160-million on their payroll for next year so I could see them letting him go.

Yes, I get that I'm trying to thread the needle here in finding someone that is between a big, raw prospect and someone that can legit play but not be too expensive to obtain or desire to play 20+ minutes. Hartenstein is a good one for sure.

I just heard that Hartenstein is in the top 5 for opponent fg% at the rim.

Not bad for a guy currently making $1.7M. Just how much more will he command this summer?

Interestingly enough, he didn't do so well in the defensive version of your favorite, the RPM stat.

If I remember correctly, I think we were told that the ESPN created stat uses historical references or something... so younger players can get lost a bit?

I'm trying to remember the details from when we were trying to justify guys like Towns and Wiggins being so low on the list.

Camden wrote:

Q-was-here wrote:

Camden wrote:Last night's game might have been easier if Minnesota had Moses Brown, for example, on their bench and ready to play up to 20 minutes. At a minimum, that guy takes up significant space and secures rebounds, specifically defensive rebounds. Consider that Brown's career defensive rebound percentage is 26.9% compared to Reid's 18.9%. That's a nice weapon to have when you're getting killed on the glass.

But then do we give up something in other areas? I'm generally in favor of finding an upgrade to Naz as our backup C, but Brown seems a bit raw still.

Moses Brown is definitely a raw talent -- even goofy at times -- but there are tangible positives within his game that could compliment the Wolves roster, especially as the 14th or 15th man. What Minnesota would give up in lineups with Brown is any semblance of a scoring/shooting threat at the five. He's a bigger, less-skilled version of Jarred Vanderbilt, offensively. That's the trade off. But at 7'2, 245-pounds with a 7'5 wingspan and a 9'5 standing reach he can physically do things that neither Vanderbilt nor Reid can do.

I think he would have been a nice option last night and in future games where the Wolves struggle to clean the glass. There were rebound opportunities last night where if Minnesota had someone over 6'10 on the floor they probably secure the board, especially on the free throw misses. In short, I think his size translates even if the player in question is raw and unpolished.

Additionally, it doesn't have to be Brown. Even Greg Monroe would have been useful last night. I was simply using Brown as an example because he's young and already a good presence on the defensive glass.

I think the best addition to this team would be a guy like Nurkic who would start at the C spot with KAT sliding over to PF. I had my way, the Wolves would have traded for Steven Adams last summer to fill that role. But alas.... Adding Nurkic would allow the Wolves would have Vanderbilt coming off the bench at the PF position and Naz at center. Vanderbilt would bring energy, defense and rebounding while Naz would bring scoring and some rim protection. Nurkic will be an unrestricted free agent after this season. Could the Wolves possible sign him to a 4-year deal using the MLE with maximum allowed annual increases. I suspect not, but it's not completely unrealistic given Nurkic's current salary and his injury propensity. But perhaps there's a sign-and-trade possibility involving Beasley. I wouldn't give up a future first for Nurkic, but Beasley and a couple 2nd-round picks seems reasonable. Perhaps the Wolves could include Naz Reid.

Otherwise, I agree that Moses Brown would be a smart addition. As you've pointed out, you can't teach his size. And as I've pointed out, he's already proven to be a terrific defensive rebounder at a very young age and this team needs defensive rebounding help more than anything. Moreover, his youth and size combo gives him substantial upside. Otherwise, a more sure thing would be signing Hartenstein as a free agent using our BAE, which starts at around $3.9M.

lipoli390 wrote:

Camden wrote:

Q-was-here wrote:

Camden wrote:Last night's game might have been easier if Minnesota had Moses Brown, for example, on their bench and ready to play up to 20 minutes. At a minimum, that guy takes up significant space and secures rebounds, specifically defensive rebounds. Consider that Brown's career defensive rebound percentage is 26.9% compared to Reid's 18.9%. That's a nice weapon to have when you're getting killed on the glass.

But then do we give up something in other areas? I'm generally in favor of finding an upgrade to Naz as our backup C, but Brown seems a bit raw still.

Moses Brown is definitely a raw talent -- even goofy at times -- but there are tangible positives within his game that could compliment the Wolves roster, especially as the 14th or 15th man. What Minnesota would give up in lineups with Brown is any semblance of a scoring/shooting threat at the five. He's a bigger, less-skilled version of Jarred Vanderbilt, offensively. That's the trade off. But at 7'2, 245-pounds with a 7'5 wingspan and a 9'5 standing reach he can physically do things that neither Vanderbilt nor Reid can do.

I think he would have been a nice option last night and in future games where the Wolves struggle to clean the glass. There were rebound opportunities last night where if Minnesota had someone over 6'10 on the floor they probably secure the board, especially on the free throw misses. In short, I think his size translates even if the player in question is raw and unpolished.

Additionally, it doesn't have to be Brown. Even Greg Monroe would have been useful last night. I was simply using Brown as an example because he's young and already a good presence on the defensive glass.

I think the best addition to this team would be a guy like Nurkic who would start at the C spot with KAT sliding over to PF. I had my way, the Wolves would have traded for Steven Adams last summer to fill that role. But alas.... Adding Nurkic would allow the Wolves would have Vanderbilt coming off the bench at the PF position and Naz at center. Vanderbilt would bring energy, defense and rebounding while Naz would bring scoring and some rim protection. Nurkic will be an unrestricted free agent after this season. Could the Wolves possible sign him to a 4-year deal using the MLE with maximum allowed annual increases. I suspect not, but it's not completely unrealistic given Nurkic's current salary and his injury propensity. But perhaps there's a sign-and-trade possibility involving Beasley. I wouldn't give up a future first for Nurkic, but Beasley and a couple 2nd-round picks seems reasonable. Perhaps the Wolves could include Naz Reid.

Otherwise, I agree that Moses Brown would be a smart addition. As you've pointed out, you can't teach his size. And as I've pointed out, he's already proven to be a terrific defensive rebounder at a very young age and this team needs defensive rebounding help more than anything. Moreover, his youth and size combo gives him substantial upside. Otherwise, a more sure thing would be signing Hartenstein as a free agent using our BAE, which starts at around $3.9M.

Unless the yearly amount is pretty cheap I would hesitant to give Nurkic a 4 year deal with his injury history and he is a big. 2 years from now he could be the next Andre Drummond type a former starter who is basically a vet min guy. I think the Wolbes need to be smart and find the next cheapish big that they don't have to pay a bunch of money for...or hardly any. Hartenstein for the BAE should qualify as that type of deal.

monsterpile wrote:Unless the yearly amount is pretty cheap I would hesitant to give Nurkic a 4 year deal with his injury history and he is a big. 2 years from now he could be the next Andre Drummond type a former starter who is basically a vet min guy. I think the Wolbes need to be smart and find the next cheapish big that they don't have to pay a bunch of money for...or hardly any. Hartenstein for the BAE should qualify as that type of deal.

Jusuf Nurkic will be 28-years old in August. At the full mid-level amount, I'd certainly rather him sign a three-year deal, but I'd be willing to go four years with him. I think above average bigs are harder to find right now than most people would think and Nurkic would really solve some issues this team has in the middle. We're basically talking about four-years, $43-million. At that price, his injury history is built in.

The real question is, would that be enough to sign him? I have to think another team outbids any mid-level offer in terms of money, including Portland. It might depend on how interested Nurkic is in winning.

Camden wrote:

monsterpile wrote:Unless the yearly amount is pretty cheap I would hesitant to give Nurkic a 4 year deal with his injury history and he is a big. 2 years from now he could be the next Andre Drummond type a former starter who is basically a vet min guy. I think the Wolbes need to be smart and find the next cheapish big that they don't have to pay a bunch of money for...or hardly any. Hartenstein for the BAE should qualify as that type of deal.

Jusuf Nurkic will be 28-years old in August. At the full mid-level amount, I'd certainly rather him sign a three-year deal, but I'd be willing to go four years with him. I think above average bigs are harder to find right now than most people would think and Nurkic would really solve some issues this team has in the middle. We're basically talking about four-years, $43-million. At that price, his injury history is built in.

The real question is, would that be enough to sign him? I have to think another team outbids any mid-level offer in terms of money, including Portland. It might depend on how interested Nurkic is in winning.

That's true mid-level is the most we can do so yeah I would do a 4 year deal for that price. I agree I think it's unlikely that would be enough to sign him.

A couple things about tonight's game. If 76er games are going to be officiated this way going forward, schedule the parade and hand them the trophy right now. And regarding Ant's outside shot - in my opinion he's struggling because his feet are too close together as he elevates. It's hard to stay balanced that way. Oh, and Doc Rivers is still a piece of shit.