TeamRicky wrote:Sorry to be Scrooge, but I have serious doubts about whether Russell's game will translate well to the NBA. I think he can be defended in the NBA. He doesn't finish well. Can't shoot with his right hand. He doesn't have great athleticism or strength. He shot poorly when he faced the better teams. He hasn't been a good defender. To me, his best skills are his three point shooting and passing but he's kind of a tweener. I know its popular to slam Ricky, but I think our offense would run better thru Ricky if he's healthy and if not, I think we can play LaVine or sign a good point guard (with the ton of cap space we'll have in another season) that will be as good a distributor as Russell. Good point guards are much more plentiful than good bigs. Given that he's likely a top 4 pick, I don't see how we'd obtain him without trading our top pick and I think either Towns or Okafor will be better NBA players and fit the team's needs more.
He shot 62% at the rim this year, but he doesn't finish well?
The scouting reports and videos I have watched say he's not a great finisher. Haven't seen that stat, but I ask you 62% against who? A parade of cupcakes. Ohio State had a very soft schedule and he never shot better than 50% against any ranked team. Against good teams, he was stuffed and defended when he tried to take it to the hole. Given that he doesn't have great athleticism or strength , can't shoot to his right and shot poorly against good teams, I don't see him as a good finisher in the NBA.
where did you get that stat khan, just wondering because I have read he is a bad finisher but haven't seen a stat to back it up
TeamRicky wrote:Sorry to be Scrooge, but I have serious doubts about whether Russell's game will translate well to the NBA. I think he can be defended in the NBA. He doesn't finish well. Can't shoot with his right hand. He doesn't have great athleticism or strength. He shot poorly when he faced the better teams. He hasn't been a good defender. To me, his best skills are his three point shooting and passing but he's kind of a tweener. I know its popular to slam Ricky, but I think our offense would run better thru Ricky if he's healthy and if not, I think we can play LaVine or sign a good point guard (with the ton of cap space we'll have in another season) that will be as good a distributor as Russell. Good point guards are much more plentiful than good bigs. Given that he's likely a top 4 pick, I don't see how we'd obtain him without trading our top pick and I think either Towns or Okafor will be better NBA players and fit the team's needs more.
He shot 62% at the rim this year, but he doesn't finish well?
The scouting reports and videos I have watched say he's not a great finisher. Haven't seen that stat, but I ask you 62% against who? A parade of cupcakes. Ohio State had a very soft schedule and he never shot better than 50% against any ranked team. Against good teams, he was stuffed and defended when he tried to take it to the hole. Given that he doesn't have great athleticism or strength , can't shoot to his right and shot poorly against good teams, I don't see him as a good finisher in the NBA.
where did you get that stat khan, just wondering because I have read he is a bad finisher but haven't seen a stat to back it up
It was in Ford's write up earlier in the thread.
"From an offensive point of view, there isn't a more complete guard in the draft. Russell is equally adept at stroking the long ball and getting to the basket. He shot 62 percent at the rim this season and 41 percent from 3, according to Hoops-Math.com."
TeamRicky wrote:Sorry to be Scrooge, but I have serious doubts about whether Russell's game will translate well to the NBA. I think he can be defended in the NBA. He doesn't finish well. Can't shoot with his right hand. He doesn't have great athleticism or strength. He shot poorly when he faced the better teams. He hasn't been a good defender. To me, his best skills are his three point shooting and passing but he's kind of a tweener. I know its popular to slam Ricky, but I think our offense would run better thru Ricky if he's healthy and if not, I think we can play LaVine or sign a good point guard (with the ton of cap space we'll have in another season) that will be as good a distributor as Russell. Good point guards are much more plentiful than good bigs. Given that he's likely a top 4 pick, I don't see how we'd obtain him without trading our top pick and I think either Towns or Okafor will be better NBA players and fit the team's needs more.
He shot 62% at the rim this year, but he doesn't finish well?
The scouting reports and videos I have watched say he's not a great finisher. Haven't seen that stat, but I ask you 62% against who? A parade of cupcakes. Ohio State had a very soft schedule and he never shot better than 50% against any ranked team. Against good teams, he was stuffed and defended when he tried to take it to the hole. Given that he doesn't have great athleticism or strength , can't shoot to his right and shot poorly against good teams, I don't see him as a good finisher in the NBA.
He's a guard. 50% is not a normal shooting percentage for guards. Steph Curry might be the greatest shooter ever and he shot a league leading 48.7 FG% for PG's. Only 5 PG's in the league shot 45% or higher. Only 5 PG's in the league shot 50% or better from 2. He's also 19 and learning to finish over size is not some inherent skill. It takes time to master. Given his high basketball IQ I don't see this huge red flag that you do. It doesn't make sense to talk about these guys as what you see is what you get type of prospects. They are all going to have adjustment periods and smart players like Russell usually figure it out. You don't need to be an elite athlete to be a star in this league. Harden and Curry are average athletes at best and they were 1-2 in the MVP voting. I'm not saying Russell will be those guys, but to basically write him off because he showed some weakness in college is dumb in my opinion. Strength of schedule frankly doesn't matter. How hard was Damien Lillard's college schedule? How about Steph Curry? Kyrie Irving barely played in college and multiple stars in the 90's and 00's never played a game in college. They all had to adjust to the NBA level. You could play this year's Kentucky team every game all year and still have a big adjustment to make it in the NBA.
TeamRicky wrote:Sorry to be Scrooge, but I have serious doubts about whether Russell's game will translate well to the NBA. I think he can be defended in the NBA. He doesn't finish well. Can't shoot with his right hand. He doesn't have great athleticism or strength. He shot poorly when he faced the better teams. He hasn't been a good defender. To me, his best skills are his three point shooting and passing but he's kind of a tweener. I know its popular to slam Ricky, but I think our offense would run better thru Ricky if he's healthy and if not, I think we can play LaVine or sign a good point guard (with the ton of cap space we'll have in another season) that will be as good a distributor as Russell. Good point guards are much more plentiful than good bigs. Given that he's likely a top 4 pick, I don't see how we'd obtain him without trading our top pick and I think either Towns or Okafor will be better NBA players and fit the team's needs more.
He shot 62% at the rim this year, but he doesn't finish well?
The scouting reports and videos I have watched say he's not a great finisher. Haven't seen that stat, but I ask you 62% against who? A parade of cupcakes. Ohio State had a very soft schedule and he never shot better than 50% against any ranked team. Against good teams, he was stuffed and defended when he tried to take it to the hole. Given that he doesn't have great athleticism or strength , can't shoot to his right and shot poorly against good teams, I don't see him as a good finisher in the NBA.
He's a guard. 50% is not a normal shooting percentage for guards. Steph Curry might be the greatest shooter ever and he shot a league leading 48.7 FG% for PG's. Only 5 PG's in the league shot 45% or higher. Only 5 PG's in the league shot 50% or better from 2. He's also 19 and learning to finish over size is not some inherent skill. It takes time to master. Given his high basketball IQ I don't see this huge red flag that you do. It doesn't make sense to talk about these guys as what you see is what you get type of prospects. They are all going to have adjustment periods and smart players like Russell usually figure it out. You don't need to be an elite athlete to be a star in this league. Harden and Curry are average athletes at best and they were 1-2 in the MVP voting. I'm not saying Russell will be those guys, but to basically write him off because he showed some weakness in college is dumb in my opinion. Strength of schedule frankly doesn't matter. How hard was Damien Lillard's college schedule? How about Steph Curry? Kyrie Irving barely played in college and multiple stars in the 90's and 00's never played a game in college. They all had to adjust to the NBA level. You could play this year's Kentucky team every game all year and still have a big adjustment to make it in the NBA.
You said what I was going to say except I think Harden is a better athlete than you give him credit for. I never thought he was below average. I always thought he was was actually a better prospect than Mayo even when they were both Freshman partly because of his size and overall length and really their freshman year numbers weren't that far apart to make him what most people considered a true broke Mayo. In fact Harden shot an obscenely high percentage of his shots and got to the line at a higher rate. Compared to Mayo the concern for Russell is both guys didn't realy get to the line as much as you would like which makes you worry about them not attacking enough and settling for jumpers but Russell has the edge on both assist numbers rebounding all while turning over the ball a little less. He seems more like a guy with more actual PG skills than Mayo did but idk I am biased I thought Mayo was a little overrated at the time of the draft.
Slim - I refuse to believe Flip is this stupid. I will kick him in the balls if he is. Russel is closer to OJ Mayo than Paul George or James Harden. He's a Tweener who can shoot. Flip is not trading Ricky at the bottom of his market value. Russell will be there for the sixer's. And they might just pass, you never know
I agree with you Papal....Flip can not be that stupid. But....and I say like a dog who has been beaten in the past, stuff like this makes me nervous for no reason!
I do disagree with you on the spectrum level being closer to OJ mayo and less like George and Harden. I actually think Russell will be a significant player in the league...his size, skillset, swagger and physical strengths are going to be incredible for being 6'5''. I watched numerous games this season for Ohio State, and he was so well rounded as a player...kid has so much talent, will be special!
Slim, you may be right. I remember Philly took Evan Turner 2nd and got burned (2010). I wonder if that will spook them. That was the year we took Wes Johnson with Cousins, George and Monroe on the board. At least we weren't alone.
TeamRicky wrote:Sorry to be Scrooge, but I have serious doubts about whether Russell's game will translate well to the NBA. I think he can be defended in the NBA. He doesn't finish well. Can't shoot with his right hand. He doesn't have great athleticism or strength. He shot poorly when he faced the better teams. He hasn't been a good defender. To me, his best skills are his three point shooting and passing but he's kind of a tweener. I know its popular to slam Ricky, but I think our offense would run better thru Ricky if he's healthy and if not, I think we can play LaVine or sign a good point guard (with the ton of cap space we'll have in another season) that will be as good a distributor as Russell. Good point guards are much more plentiful than good bigs. Given that he's likely a top 4 pick, I don't see how we'd obtain him without trading our top pick and I think either Towns or Okafor will be better NBA players and fit the team's needs more.
He shot 62% at the rim this year, but he doesn't finish well?
The scouting reports and videos I have watched say he's not a great finisher. Haven't seen that stat, but I ask you 62% against who? A parade of cupcakes. Ohio State had a very soft schedule and he never shot better than 50% against any ranked team. Against good teams, he was stuffed and defended when he tried to take it to the hole. Given that he doesn't have great athleticism or strength , can't shoot to his right and shot poorly against good teams, I don't see him as a good finisher in the NBA.
where did you get that stat khan, just wondering because I have read he is a bad finisher but haven't seen a stat to back it up
It was in Ford's write up earlier in the thread.
"From an offensive point of view, there isn't a more complete guard in the draft. Russell is equally adept at stroking the long ball and getting to the basket. He shot 62 percent at the rim this season and 41 percent from 3, according to Hoops-Math.com."
khans2k5 wrote:
TeamRicky wrote:
khans2k5 wrote:
TeamRicky wrote:Sorry to be Scrooge, but I have serious doubts about whether Russell's game will translate well to the NBA. I think he can be defended in the NBA. He doesn't finish well. Can't shoot with his right hand. He doesn't have great athleticism or strength. He shot poorly when he faced the better teams. He hasn't been a good defender. To me, his best skills are his three point shooting and passing but he's kind of a tweener. I know its popular to slam Ricky, but I think our offense would run better thru Ricky if he's healthy and if not, I think we can play LaVine or sign a good point guard (with the ton of cap space we'll have in another season) that will be as good a distributor as Russell. Good point guards are much more plentiful than good bigs. Given that he's likely a top 4 pick, I don't see how we'd obtain him without trading our top pick and I think either Towns or Okafor will be better NBA players and fit the team's needs more.
He shot 62% at the rim this year, but he doesn't finish well?
The scouting reports and videos I have watched say he's not a great finisher. Haven't seen that stat, but I ask you 62% against who? A parade of cupcakes. Ohio State had a very soft schedule and he never shot better than 50% against any ranked team. Against good teams, he was stuffed and defended when he tried to take it to the hole. Given that he doesn't have great athleticism or strength , can't shoot to his right and shot poorly against good teams, I don't see him as a good finisher in the NBA.
He's a guard. 50% is not a normal shooting percentage for guards. Steph Curry might be the greatest shooter ever and he shot a league leading 48.7 FG% for PG's. Only 5 PG's in the league shot 45% or higher. Only 5 PG's in the league shot 50% or better from 2. He's also 19 and learning to finish over size is not some inherent skill. It takes time to master. Given his high basketball IQ I don't see this huge red flag that you do. It doesn't make sense to talk about these guys as what you see is what you get type of prospects. They are all going to have adjustment periods and smart players like Russell usually figure it out. You don't need to be an elite athlete to be a star in this league. Harden and Curry are average athletes at best and they were 1-2 in the MVP voting. I'm not saying Russell will be those guys, but to basically write him off because he showed some weakness in college is dumb in my opinion. Strength of schedule frankly doesn't matter. How hard was Damien Lillard's college schedule? How about Steph Curry? Kyrie Irving barely played in college and multiple stars in the 90's and 00's never played a game in college. They all had to adjust to the NBA level. You could play this year's Kentucky team every game all year and still have a big adjustment to make it in the NBA.
I never said 50% was expected. I said that was his "best" day against a ranked team and his average was just under 36%. If he can't be efficient against ranked college teams, I have serious concerns about his ability to be an efficient scorer in the NBA.
papalrep wrote:Slim, you may be right. I remember Philly took Evan Turner 2nd and got burned (2010). I wonder if that will spook them. That was the year we took Wes Johnson with Cousins, George and Monroe on the board. At least we weren't alone.
I agree with slim in that Russell is silky smooth on offense, usually makes the smart play, and has an extremely well rounded offensive game. I think he's a lot easier to project than a guy like Turner because Russell already has deep range, is younger, and is just smoother overall.
