Minnesota Sports Forum

Jimmy butler trade falling apart. The heat can't find a trade partner to take on Dragic (same contact as Teague)

CoolBreeze44 wrote:Why did Miami want Butler so bad? And why would he want to go there? He just got further away from the championship. To me it looks like Philadelphia fleeced the entire league. They keep Tobias and add a perfect fit in Horford. I think they will win the East next year.

Butler choosing Miami over the Sixers (or Houston for that matter) shouldn't be a surprise unless you really believe Butler is all about winning. Of course, we know through experience that Butler is about the money and the limelight. The lights are brighter in Miami and he'll be the undisputed leader of that team with no allstar caliber talent on the roster to steal his thunder. And as a guy who knows Jimmy Butler and other NBA players through his business said to me last season, "Jimmy is probably the League's biggest diva." Now that's saying something!

CoolBreeze44 wrote:Why did Miami want Butler so bad? And why would he want to go there? He just got further away from the championship. To me it looks like Philadelphia fleeced the entire league. They keep Tobias and add a perfect fit in Horford. I think they will win the East next year.

Huh? Horford is a very valuable player, but in no way is he a perfect fit in a lineup that looks to start Tobias Harris and Joel Embiid. Not to mention they lost J.J. Reddick and Jimmy Butler to other suitors. You think they win the East. I think they took a big step back.

Camden wrote:

CoolBreeze44 wrote:Why did Miami want Butler so bad? And why would he want to go there? He just got further away from the championship. To me it looks like Philadelphia fleeced the entire league. They keep Tobias and add a perfect fit in Horford. I think they will win the East next year.

Huh? Horford is a very valuable player, but in no way is he a perfect fit in a lineup that looks to start Tobias Harris and Joel Embiid. Not to mention they lost J.J. Reddick and Jimmy Butler to other suitors. You think they win the East. I think they took a big step back.

I don't know, Cam. Horford is a career 37% three-point shooter as well as a very good rebounder and passer. He's an excellent defender, a great teammate who makes his teammates better. I think he fits well next to Embiid and gives the Sixers someone who can step in as the main big when Embiid is out. And we all know, Embiid will be out a lot of games. No doubt the Sixers will miss Redick, but Horford's 3-point shooting helps take some of the sting (just some) away. Horford will improve the team's rebounding as well. So I think the Sixers would be a better team with Butler and Redick instead of Horford? Yes. But I don't think the drop off is huge and a lot depends on who else the Sixers sign and how well their young guys play. I also think Harris will play better next season than he did after being traded to the Sixers. So we'll see. I'd much rather be the Sixers than the Wolves or Knicks among others. :)

lipoli390 wrote:

Camden wrote:

CoolBreeze44 wrote:Why did Miami want Butler so bad? And why would he want to go there? He just got further away from the championship. To me it looks like Philadelphia fleeced the entire league. They keep Tobias and add a perfect fit in Horford. I think they will win the East next year.

Huh? Horford is a very valuable player, but in no way is he a perfect fit in a lineup that looks to start Tobias Harris and Joel Embiid. Not to mention they lost J.J. Reddick and Jimmy Butler to other suitors. You think they win the East. I think they took a big step back.

I don't know, Cam. Horford is a career 37% three-point shooter as well as a very good rebounder and passer. He's an excellent defender, a great teammate who makes his teammates better. I think he fits well next to Embiid and gives the Sixers someone who can step in as the main big when Embiid is out. And we all know, Embiid will be out a lot of games. No doubt the Sixers will miss Redick, but Horford's 3-point shooting helps take some of the sting (just some) away. Horford will improve the team's rebounding as well. So I think the Sixers would be a better team with Butler and Redick instead of Horford? Yes. But I don't think the drop off is huge and a lot depends on who else the Sixers sign and how well their young guys play. I also think Harris will play better next season than he did after being traded to the Sixers. So we'll see. I'd much rather be the Sixers than the Wolves or Knicks among others. :)

Lip, I agree with you that Sixers did well, especially, if they get Josh Richardson. Horford, Tobias, Richardson added to Emibiid and Simmons is quite a starting lineup. If Kawhi doesn't resign with Toronto, Sixers will be the class of the East.

lipoli390 wrote:

Camden wrote:

CoolBreeze44 wrote:Why did Miami want Butler so bad? And why would he want to go there? He just got further away from the championship. To me it looks like Philadelphia fleeced the entire league. They keep Tobias and add a perfect fit in Horford. I think they will win the East next year.

Huh? Horford is a very valuable player, but in no way is he a perfect fit in a lineup that looks to start Tobias Harris and Joel Embiid. Not to mention they lost J.J. Reddick and Jimmy Butler to other suitors. You think they win the East. I think they took a big step back.

I don't know, Cam. Horford is a career 37% three-point shooter as well as a very good rebounder and passer. He's an excellent defender, a great teammate who makes his teammates better. I think he fits well next to Embiid and gives the Sixers someone who can step in as the main big when Embiid is out. And we all know, Embiid will be out a lot of games. No doubt the Sixers will miss Redick, but Horford's 3-point shooting helps take some of the sting (just some) away. Horford will improve the team's rebounding as well. So I think the Sixers would be a better team with Butler and Redick instead of Horford? Yes. But I don't think the drop off is huge and a lot depends on who else the Sixers sign and how well their young guys play. I also think Harris will play better next season than he did after being traded to the Sixers. So we'll see. I'd much rather be the Sixers than the Wolves or Knicks among others. :)

One thing the Sixers lack right now is a guy that can get his on the perimeter anytime. Will Richardson with more talent and spacing be part of the answer? Ben Simmons step forward with complimentary pieces surrounding him and a more clear role? Maybe all the pieces just fit well together and they just thrive? I'm sure they will do very well in the regular season but the playoffs is a bit of a question in terms of star power. That type looks like it could have a very nice dynamic though. Also ai saw a report that Horford on got 4 years 96 million. That's more palatable.

The Sixers are about to start a massive 5 man unit, but they don't have the guy anymore with Jimmy gone who can create offense on the perimeter. I also wonder how the defense will look with that many big guys. Can they stick with faster teams on the perimeter? I don't know. I do know however that you just aren't scoring in the paint against that team so maybe that makes up for the lack of perimeter quickness. They are a very weird team right now that has weird strengths and bad weaknesses in today's game. I wouldn't pencil them in as the class of the East. They lack "the guy" every elite team has had to have in basketball.

monsterpile wrote:

lipoli390 wrote:

Camden wrote:

CoolBreeze44 wrote:Why did Miami want Butler so bad? And why would he want to go there? He just got further away from the championship. To me it looks like Philadelphia fleeced the entire league. They keep Tobias and add a perfect fit in Horford. I think they will win the East next year.

Huh? Horford is a very valuable player, but in no way is he a perfect fit in a lineup that looks to start Tobias Harris and Joel Embiid. Not to mention they lost J.J. Reddick and Jimmy Butler to other suitors. You think they win the East. I think they took a big step back.

I don't know, Cam. Horford is a career 37% three-point shooter as well as a very good rebounder and passer. He's an excellent defender, a great teammate who makes his teammates better. I think he fits well next to Embiid and gives the Sixers someone who can step in as the main big when Embiid is out. And we all know, Embiid will be out a lot of games. No doubt the Sixers will miss Redick, but Horford's 3-point shooting helps take some of the sting (just some) away. Horford will improve the team's rebounding as well. So I think the Sixers would be a better team with Butler and Redick instead of Horford? Yes. But I don't think the drop off is huge and a lot depends on who else the Sixers sign and how well their young guys play. I also think Harris will play better next season than he did after being traded to the Sixers. So we'll see. I'd much rather be the Sixers than the Wolves or Knicks among others. :)

One thing the Sixers lack right now is a guy that can get his on the perimeter anytime. Will Richardson with more talent and spacing be part of the answer? Ben Simmons step forward with complimentary pieces surrounding him and a more clear role? Maybe all the pieces just fit well together and they just thrive? I'm sure they will do very well in the regular season but the playoffs is a bit of a question in terms of star power. That type looks like it could have a very nice dynamic though. Also ai saw a report that Horford on got 4 years 96 million. That's more palatable.

Good take, Monster. Assuming the Butler deal actually happens, the one missing piece might be the lack of a perimeter player who can score reliably from the perimeter. However, Tobias is a terrific perimeter shooter off the ball and no one is better than Simmons at driving and creating for others. Tobias isn't bad scoring with the ball eithere. Simmons is also elite at creating for himself going to the hoop. Richardson can certainly create for himself off the dribble on the perimeter. He's no Jimmy Butler on either end of the court, but he's good and could turn out to be very good surrounded by much better players than he's been playing with in Miami. Having Tobias from training camp will allow the Sixers to integrate him far better into the team's schemes. The problem the Sixers have is a problem I wish the Wolves had. We'd all be drooling if we had Simmons, Embiid, Tobias Harris, Al Horford, Josh Richardson, Zhaire Smith and Matisse Thybule - all coached by Brown.

Apparently Whiteside is getting moved to portland for leonard and harkless.

Man, Kawhi to the Lakers is picking up alot of steam.

Kawhi, AD, and Lebron