Minnesota Timberwolves: Rumor Mill

[Lipoli390]

- Patrick Beverley, Taurean Prince, 2022 first-round pick, 2024 first-round pick, 2026 first-round pick, and a 2023 first-round swap

- Malik Beasley, Taurean Prince, 2022 first-round pick, 2024 first-round pick, and a 2023 first-round swap

- Patrick Beverley, Malik Beasley, 2022 first-round pick, 2024 first-round pick, and a 2023 first-round swap

- Patrick Beverley, Taurean Prince, Jaden McDaniels, 2022 first-round pick, and 2024 first-round pick

- Malik Beasley, Taurean Prince, Jaden McDaniels, 2022 first-round pick, 2023 first-round swap

- Patrick Beverley, Malik Beasley, Jaden McDaniels, 2022 first-round pick, 2024 first-round pick, and a 2023 first-round swap

Something along these lines is what it will take for Minnesota, I think. Ultimately, I think I'd pull the trigger on all of these deals for Ben Simmons, but I think there's a possibility that the offers never get to that level. How aggressive of a bidding war there will be remains to be seen. I think Sacramento has a limit as to what they will offer, and they're the biggest threat to land Simmons in my view. San Antonio is another one, but I think they're a couple moves away from being ready to acquire Simmons and contend.

I generally agree with your take here, Cam. But I think it would take one of the four Beasley packages you listed. And I think Sacramento could beat any of those packages by offering Haliburton and Hield along with the same number of future picks with comparable protection. I think the Kings would do that because I think they're even more motivated than the Wolves to make a big move this offseason. Of course, if they offer Fox, then game over with Simmons definitely on his way to Sacramento. The Wolves, however, are definitely in the running.

I think the best deal from a Wolves' perspective among those you listed would be Beasley and Prince plus the two first round picks and the 2023 pick swap. I'm assuming those picks are top 3 or 4 protected or possibly unprotected. I'd do the Beasley/Beverley package, but reluctantly because Beverley brings a feisty toughness that this team really needs. It's something that Simmons doesn't provide even though he's obviously a terrific defender.

If I were Rosas I wouldn't do any of the packages that include McDaniels. I might be in the minority on this and some would say it's dumb to have McDaniels stand in the way of getting Simmons, but it would be too much for me to give up both Beasley and McDaniels while also giving up all those picks.

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

Is Jaden McDaniels ever going to be the player Ben Simmons is right now? That means an All-NBA, multiple All-Star, and Defensive Player of the Year contender. Is he ever going to be close? Will he ever make a single All-Star team?

If you answer yes to those questions, then you absolutely don't make him available for any trade let alone one for Simmons. He'd be untouchable along with Karl-Anthony Towns and Anthony Edwards. But how realistic is it that he ever reaches those expectations? I'd say that they're not realistic at all, but that's just my opinion. I think he's a really nice piece, but Wolves fans tend to overvalue him based on what his perceived potential is versus what his production actually is and will be.

I think you do everything in your power to keep McDaniels, but you don't lose out on Simmons because of an unwillingness to trade him.

I expect the Sacramento Kings to feel similarly about Tyrese Haliburton, for what it's worth, and even he's shown more ability to this point than McDaniels. I expect both will be made available, but that's when both teams max out.

[Lipoli390]

Is Jaden McDaniels ever going to be the player Ben Simmons is right now? That means an All-NBA, multiple All-Star, and Defensive Player of the Year contender. Is he ever going to be close? Will he ever make a single All-Star team?

If you answer yes to those questions, then you absolutely don't make him available for any trade let alone one for Simmons. He'd be untouchable along with Karl-Anthony Towns and Anthony Edwards. But how realistic is it that he ever reaches those expectations? I'd say that they're not realistic at all, but that's just my opinion. I think he's a really nice piece, but Wolves fans tend to overvalue him based on what his perceived potential is versus what his production actually is and will be.

I think you do everything in your power to keep McDaniels, but you don't lose out on Simmons because of an unwillingness to trade him.

I expect the Sacramento Kings to feel similarly about Tyrese Haliburton, for what it's worth, and even he's shown more ability to this point than McDaniels. I expect both will be made available, but that's when both teams max out.

I don't think he'll ever be the player Simmons is right now. But I think he'll be a 1st-team all-defensive player and excellent three-point shooter who will make his teammates better and blend well with highly ball-dominant players like KAT, DLO and Ant. I think he has the chance to become an all-star if he can shore up his ballhandling the way Paul George did. But I'm not prepared to bank on that yet. All those things plus his inexpensive contract on a team that already has two max players makes me reluctant to include him in a deal that would also includes Beasley and multiple lightly-protected or unprotected 1st round picks. But I also see the other side of the argument, which I would guess is the majority view on this board.

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

Lip, I think Gersson Rosas shares your view of Jaden McDaniels and will do everything in his power to make a deal without including him. That's the vibe that I pick up from everything I've heard and read this summer. I would not be surprised if Rosas gave up more first-round picks if it meant keeping McDaniels in his pocket. That's how highly I think Rosas views him as well as McDaniels being a pick that most of the basketball world has revered. It's good for Rosas to hold on to McDaniels at almost all costs for multiple reasons, but if it was the singular piece required to get Ben Simmons and create a fearsome foursome, then I think he'd do it albeit somewhat reluctantly.

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

What assets are Philadelphia getting in return that you think Portland would prefer for Damian Lillard? What assets are Philadelphia getting in return that you think Washington would prefer for Bradley Beal?

That's what I keep coming back to. Those teams are not going to want a Fred VanVleet, Harrison Barnes, or Buddy Hield in return. But they might want Malik Beasley and a bundle of first-round picks. Or Jaden McDaniels and first-round picks. At least that gets you further in those future trade talks. That's what I think needs to be weighed more heavily than the Sixers trying to win a championship with a less talented team than the one they just assembled with Ben Simmons.

[Monster]

Lip, I think Gersson Rosas shares your view of Jaden McDaniels and will do everything in his power to make a deal without including him. That's the vibe that I pick up from everything I've heard and read this summer. I would not be surprised if Rosas gave up more first-round picks if it meant keeping McDaniels in his pocket. That's how highly I think Rosas views him as well as McDaniels being a pick that most of the basketball world has revered. It's good for Rosas to hold on to McDaniels at almost all costs for multiple reasons, but if it was the singular piece required to get Ben Simmons and create a fearsome foursome, then I think he'd do it albeit somewhat reluctantly.

I do not want to trade McDaniels but that's partly because I felt like he would be more of a piece of the trade than a significant piece. Now if he is basically a guy that allows the Wolves to keep Russell Edwards Towns and Add Simmons...that is compelling.

[Monster]

What assets are Philadelphia getting in return that you think Portland would prefer for Damian Lillard? What assets are Philadelphia getting in return that you think Washington would prefer for Bradley Beal?

That's what I keep coming back to. Those teams are not going to want a Fred VanVleet, Harrison Barnes, or Buddy Hield in return. But they might want Malik Beasley and a bundle of first-round picks. Or Jaden McDaniels and first-round picks. At least that gets you further in those future trade talks. That's what I think needs to be weighed more heavily than the Sixers trying to win a championship with a less talented team than the one they just assembled with Ben Simmons.

Yeah I'm starting to think that is what is going to interest Morey so that makes McDaniels being included in a Simmons deal something that we should be prepared for.

I also wonder if there is a team/s out there that values Bolmaro and he could be included...although that would be what 30 days after he signed his deal? I'm not suggesting Bolmaro is a big piece of any deal but I might prefer to send him out instead of a future pick especially if we already have added Simmons. I say that and I'm one of the biggest fans of Bolmaro here

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

Sam Amick of The Athletic:

According to a source with knowledge of their situation, the Kings spoke to the Sixers weeks ago and made it clear that both De'Aaron Fox and Tyrese Haliburton would not be included in a possible Simmons deal. That stance, the source said, has not and will not change and the internal expectation is that the core of their roster will remain the same heading into training camp later this month. There are no current conversations between the two teams and, barring a drastic change in demands, it appears the Kings are an unlikely landing spot for Simmons.

If there is a Kings deal to be had eventually, Kings guard Buddy Hield and forward Marvin Bagley III have been widely seen as the most likely players to be included. Per the source, the Kings and Sixers have not talked about Simmons since the conversations weeks ago.

Link: https://theathletic.com/2803587/2021/09/01/source-ben-simmons-trade-price-is-currently-too-steep-for-the-kings/?source=user_shared_article

This certainly seems like a pretty significant report. Maybe Sacramento is truly prepared not to include Tyrese Haliburton. In that case, the Kings really are an unlikely landing spot for Ben Simmons. That's great news for Minnesota and it's yet another sign pointing towards the Sixers having very little leverage. What bidding war can the Wolves not win if the Kings remain firm on not including Haliburton? I don't see one.

[KG4Ever]

Sam Amick of The Athletic:

According to a source with knowledge of their situation, the Kings spoke to the Sixers weeks ago and made it clear that both De'Aaron Fox and Tyrese Haliburton would not be included in a possible Simmons deal. That stance, the source said, has not and will not change and the internal expectation is that the core of their roster will remain the same heading into training camp later this month. There are no current conversations between the two teams and, barring a drastic change in demands, it appears the Kings are an unlikely landing spot for Simmons.

If there is a Kings deal to be had eventually, Kings guard Buddy Hield and forward Marvin Bagley III have been widely seen as the most likely players to be included. Per the source, the Kings and Sixers have not talked about Simmons since the conversations weeks ago.

Link: https://theathletic.com/2803587/2021/09/01/source-ben-simmons-trade-price-is-currently-too-steep-for-the-kings/?source=user_shared_article

This certainly seems like a pretty significant report. Maybe Sacramento is truly prepared not to include Tyrese Haliburton. In that case, the Kings really are an unlikely landing spot for Ben Simmons. That's great news for Minnesota and it's yet another sign pointing towards the Sixers having very little leverage. What bidding war can the Wolves not win if the Kings remain firm on not including Haliburton? I don't see one.

Great News?? Let's not get ahead of ourselves. I'm not sure a trade for Simmons will turn out to be even "good news". I don't like the idea of trading McDaniels to get him and if you add two or three first rounders/swaps to the mix, I might hate the trade.

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

Great News?? Let's not get ahead of ourselves. You can't evaluate a trade without knowing what the Wolves would have to give up. I don't like the idea of trading McDaniels to get him and if you add two or three first rounders/swaps to the mix, I might hate the trade.

I don't follow your thinking whatsoever and nobody's ahead of themselves here. If Sacramento does not include Tyrese Haliburton, then that is great news as it likely takes out a potential suitor (and another bidder) for Ben Simmons. That means there's one less team that could potentially drive up the price for him. Does that make sense? Should I explain that in another way? Please let me know so there's no confusion.

As for the price it'll take to actually acquire Simmons, I think it'll be far less than what most expect it to be. If Jaden McDaniels is a casualty in the process, then so be it, but I'm not so sure that Gerrson Rosas is going to let that happen without exploring every possible avenue available in order to get Simmons and keep McDaniels. In that case, you better expect a package with three first-round picks involved.