Windhorst: Sam Mitchell won't be returning

[AbeVigodaLive]

If you just limit yourself to Cam's thoughts on Thibodeau, I'm not sure you're getting the whole picture. In an attempt to stay fair and balanced:

http://nba.nbcsports.com/2015/05/28/report-at-least-3-bulls-starters-ripped-tom-thibodeau-during-exit-interview/

Not sure how much I believe this. Seems like Paxson leaked that to save face. Hard to fire a coach with the production Thibs had without taking some heat for it. Easier to do if you leak a rumor about "at least three starters" wanting him gone. Can you even think of which three starters that would be? Maybe Rose? Maybe Dunleavy? I don't know why either of them would, but I just can't see Butler, Noah, Gasol or Gibson speaking bad about him. Probably not even true.

"That's all that needed to be said -- expectations were high, and Thibodeau didn't meet them from a pure performance standpoint. But instead, the organization feels the need to justify its decision by belittling Thibodeau on his way out the door, when he has exhibited nothing but class publicly throughout this process."

That link was still worth posting, though, so thanks for that.

TeamRicky mentioned Rose, too. That would be an about-face if it was.

Seems like Thibodeau went out of his way for his oft-injured star. Could it be argued that for all his pushing of his players... he didn't push that guy enough? A quick Google search comes up only with a first page of pro-Thibodeau quotes from Derrick Rose.

Furthermore, was any of the negative stuff with his players substantiated... ever? All I ever read was a bunch of "might" and "some don't endorse his return"... how many NBA coaches are beloved by every player on the team 1 - 12+? Plus, that was before he was fired. Were there any comments after the firing when the players had nothing to lose by speaking out? Considering how petty the Bulls were by "leaking" that information and how Thibodeau seemed to stay above it all... how is he the one taking the heat for it a year later?

This isn't to throw all my eggs in Thibodeau's basket. I think he's an excellent coach, but the dual role stuff gives me pause. More importantly, I think the Wolves are finally at a place where there are other good options, too.

We all have our favorites. And each guy can be heralded (Thibs' W/L record). Van Gundy's intelligence and affability. But if they aren't your guy... each can be picked on (Thibs' surliness or playing guys too long), Van Gundy being out of the league for nearly a decade and no playoff wins in 17 years). Go down the line to Joerger. Brooks. Ollie. That Atlanta guy. Et al.

Just like our favorite players, we pick-and-choose what stats (qualities) are most important. That's what makes these discussions more interesting though. I'm just glad that the Wolves have legit quality options...

[longstrangetrip [enjin:6600564]]

Robson tweets a great question: Suppose the Wolves had made a coaching change at the all-star break. Assuming the Wolves still played close to .500 basketball after the change, how would we be evaluating the new coach now? It's a rhetorical question, because I think Brit knows the answer is we'd be planning a parade for him! By the end of the year, the Wolves showed they were a .500 team with Mitchell coaching. If he truly were as ineffective a coach as he is depicted here, and assuming our young players continue to develop at the rate they did this year and we add new pieces through the draft and free agency, shouldn't we expect them take a big step beyond the last half of this year and be much better than .500 next year? I hope this isn't overly optimistic. but it seems to me that a 10-game improvement over the .500 pace the last half of the year is a reasonable expectation. I for one would be happy with a 51-31 record next year.

[longstrangetrip [enjin:6600564]]

I don't the think Glen has made up his mind on who to hire as head coach. Nor do I think he's already decided that it will be one of the two obvious candidates we've been discussing - Thibs and JVG. I'm certain that KF's role is two-fold.

First, Glen likely hired KF to develop a list of candidates beyond the obvious two or three everyone's talking about. Once Glen took this step to go outside the country club, it makes sense that he'd want to make sure he leaves no stone unturned, understanding that the best candidate may not be one of two or three obvious choices.

Second, Glen likely expects KF to provide an analysis of the candidates, comparing them to one another, describing each one's style and fit for the Wolves personnel and organizational culture. The analysis may or may not include advice on who to hire.

If it were me, I'd focus on Thibs, JVG, and Kevin Ollie. I'd interview all three and do a lot of behind the scenes, off the record digging on each. If I had to make a choice knowing what I know now, I'd go with JVG. Like Thibs he has a proven record of success as an NBA head coach, albeit not as recent. Both are excellent defensive coaches. Both are demanding and very smart. But in the end, I give the edge to JVG based on his personality -- his positive energy, his charisma and impressive communication skills.

Overall, I think JVG would wear better with mangement, the media, the community and, most importantly, the young players on this team. He has a great sense of humor and a positive, likable personality. In contrast, Thibs seems to have an overall negative vibe and an edge that would get old pretty quick -- probably around the time our young guys are up for their first post-rookie contracts. Not a good situation. I also like that JVG has a touch of humility that Thibs doesn't appear to have. For example, I liked hearing JVG say that if he coaches again he needs to improve as an offensive coach and he talked about bringing in assistants to help him in that area. Moreover, I like that Flip wanted JVG to coach this team. JVG and Izzo were the only two who Flip considered good enough and the right fit to coach this team. That matters because this is Flip's team. The success or failure of this team will turn on the progress and success of the guys he drafted- Wiggins, LaVine, Towns, Dieng and Bazz.

I do see the argument for Thibs. The guy can coach. But for this team in this community and for a long-term vision, I think JVG would be the much better choice. JVG would likely end up with the dual role as would Thibs as a necessary component of getting them here. I'm fine with that because I trust that JVG is a team player and he's humble enough to know he'd need a first rate front office staff that he could lean on.

If not JVG, then I'd probably take a different course and hire Kevin Ollie. What I like about Ollie is that he's smart -- the common thread that seems to run through all the best NBA head coaches.

This is a good take. There's so much to like about Thibs' defensive and win/loss success, but his personality just seems to rub people the wrong way sometimes. 10 coaches in 11 years tells us that Glen is not shy about pulling the trigger on a coaching change, and we can't afford to hire a guy that is liable to give him an excuse to pull the trigger again. This talented core needs a coach that is going to be with the team at least as long as we control their contracts, and KF needs to identify candidates that are most likely to both fit the local culture and win...I'm confident there are plenty of choices out there that can do both.

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

Interesting how Lip gave JVG credit for admitting he needs some help offensively, but completely ignores how Thibs visited plenty of NBA teams and coaches to learn from them and add things to his own playbook. He visited Steve Kerr, George Karl, Stan Van Gundy, Brad Stevens... But he has no humility.

The perception of Thibs as a person has been wrong ever since Chicago fired him and talked shit about him as he went out the door. If Thibs is such a dickhead, why didn't he badmouth the organization/FO?

[longstrangetrip [enjin:6600564]]

Interesting how Lip gave JVG credit for admitting he needs some help offensively, but completely ignores how Thibs visited plenty of NBA teams and coaches to learn from them and add things to his own playbook. He visited Steve Kerr, George Karl, Stan Van Gundy, Brad Stevens... But he has no humility.

The perception of Thibs as a person has been wrong ever since Chicago fired him and talked shit about him as he went out the door. If Thibs is such a dickhead, why didn't he badmouth the organization/FO?

I certainly wouldn't describe Thibs as a dickhead, Cam. I think most though would describe him as crusty, stubborn and rather set in his ways. Coincidently, those are also words that might be used to describe the recently fired Wolves' coach, although he also left the organization in style. Thibs' players alledgedly took some shots at him in exit interviews before he was let go (although, in fairness, there are no comments on the record)...I'm interested in seeing if Wolves players will also be similarly critical of Sam now that he is gone. The one guy who might is Zach Lavine, because Sam seemed to be harder on him than any other T-Wolf. We'll have to wait and see.

Cam, I think the difference in your take vs, many on this board is that you categorically deny the possibility that the reports of negative comments about Thibs from Bulls' players might be true. Your narrative that management made them up to save face could be true, but they seem to be quite specific in nature (for instance, the report that 3 starters said they would be avoiding the Bulls' training center during the offseason if Thibs were there). Difficult for me to believe thst Bulls' management would go to such specific extremes to discredit an ex-coach. Regardless of what the truth is, we can expect that KF and Glen will be pressing Bulls' management for as much information as they can get about Thibs before making any decision.

[BloopOracle]

I have to side with Cam on this, I disagree with Thibs being set in his ways and being a negative droning influence after awhile. Look how hard his players played for him in Chicago, even through those devastating injuries. To fight year after year even after losing your best player speaks volumes about his motivation tactics. I also don't see why he is viewed as someone who is stuck in his ways. He is widely regarded as the best defensive coach in teh NBA so I"m not sure what the problem is there concerning his methods. On offense he was constantly yelling at his player to push the pace but they didn't have the personal for that. When Rose went down his switched his offense to run through Noah and it worked beautifully. I'm also having a very hard time finding interviews where Thibs is combative with the media.

[Coolbreeze44]

Robson tweets a great question: Suppose the Wolves had made a coaching change at the all-star break. Assuming the Wolves still played close to .500 basketball after the change, how would we be evaluating the new coach now? It's a rhetorical question, because I think Brit knows the answer is we'd be planning a parade for him! By the end of the year, the Wolves showed they were a .500 team with Mitchell coaching. If he truly were as ineffective a coach as he is depicted here, and assuming our young players continue to develop at the rate they did this year and we add new pieces through the draft and free agency, shouldn't we expect them take a big step beyond the last half of this year and be much better than .500 next year? I hope this isn't overly optimistic. but it seems to me that a 10-game improvement over the .500 pace the last half of the year is a reasonable expectation. I for one would be happy with a 51-31 record next year.

I was thinking about expectations for next season and your post kind of backs up what I was thinking. The goal next year should be 50 wins and we should at least aspire to land in the top 4 of the West. I'm sure that sounds ambitious to some, but it's time to raise our expectations for this group. Of course some things are going to need to take place this offseason: 1) Hire a dynamic coach 2) Make good use of our top draft pick 3) Sign one or two key young veteran pieces to fill out the rotation.

Ambitious indeed, but I don't want to hear talk about incremental improvement for next year. It's time for Tim's forecast to be more reality than fantasy.

[60WinTim]

60 wins it is! ;-)

[Coolbreeze44]

I have to side with Cam on this, I disagree with Thibs being set in his ways and being a negative droning influence after awhile. Look how hard his players played for him in Chicago, even through those devastating injuries. To fight year after year even after losing your best player speaks volumes about his motivation tactics. I also don't see why he is viewed as someone who is stuck in his ways. He is widely regarded as the best defensive coach in teh NBA so I"m not sure what the problem is there concerning his methods. On offense he was constantly yelling at his player to push the pace but they didn't have the personal for that. When Rose went down his switched his offense to run through Noah and it worked beautifully. I'm also having a very hard time finding interviews where Thibs is combative with the media.

The problem with Thibodeau isn't that he can't coach, is too set in his ways, or can't motivate. The problem is he doesn't play well in the sandbox with others, and his methods wear out their welcome. There is way too much of this written and spoken for their not to be some truth to it. I think it's a mistake to just dismiss it and assume that things would be much better and different here. Leopards can't change their spots. The question really becomes are his strengths great enough to overcome his weaknesses, and what's his fit with the Timberwolves at this point in time.

[BloopOracle]

I have to side with Cam on this, I disagree with Thibs being set in his ways and being a negative droning influence after awhile. Look how hard his players played for him in Chicago, even through those devastating injuries. To fight year after year even after losing your best player speaks volumes about his motivation tactics. I also don't see why he is viewed as someone who is stuck in his ways. He is widely regarded as the best defensive coach in teh NBA so I"m not sure what the problem is there concerning his methods. On offense he was constantly yelling at his player to push the pace but they didn't have the personal for that. When Rose went down his switched his offense to run through Noah and it worked beautifully. I'm also having a very hard time finding interviews where Thibs is combative with the media.

The problem with Thibodeau isn't that he can't coach, is too set in his ways, or can't motivate. The problem is he doesn't play well in the sandbox with others, and his methods wear out their welcome. There is way too much of this written and spoken for their not to be some truth to it. I think it's a mistake to just dismiss it and assume that things would be much better and different here. Leopards can't change their spots. The question really becomes are his strengths great enough to overcome his weaknesses, and what's his fit with the Timberwolves at this point in time.

to be fair the Bulls front office have been credit hungry for decades, they were pushing phil jackson out the door DURING the Bulls second three-peat. There is plenty written about Thibs falling out with the Bulls but the blame was being placed on both sides. Being as the Bulls have done this for decades and Thibs isn't the first coach to mysteriously have problems with the BUlls front office evem while winning I'm going to give the benefit of the doubt to Tom.