Dlo out of the last preseason games GDT

[JasonIsDaMan [enjin:7981157]]

I didn't watch the game, and I don't have time to read all 18 pages, so I apologize if the subject was already covered, but JO was a MINUS TWENTY-NINE in SEVENTEEN MINUTES!?!?!? I know that he was matched up with Luka-from-the-2nd-floor when they were on the court at the same time, but if that's accurate, that doesn't bode well for MIN's D for this coming season.

[AbeVigodaLive]

I agree that Dallas really outplayed our "starters" at the beginning of the game...it was difficult to watch on my ESPN gamecast because Dallas just wouldn't miss. But I would argue that Ryan didn't start the guys most of us would have started, so it's not surprising some of our "bench" players shined when they came in. The Wolves were without one of their max players tonight. Layman starting at PF is a joke...he simply cannot rebound or defend his position, and notably begin to play well at SF after Ryan brought in Juancho so Layman could move to his natural position. And if anyone on this board thinks Okogie is going to our starting SF, they are clearly in the minority. So at least 3 of our guys on the court against Dallas' starting lineup will likely not start many games this season- only KAT and either Ricky or Beasley were true starters tonight.

I recognize that this is largely a critical board and that's fine- God knows this franchise has given us much to be critical about. But I'm confused as to how many negative conclusions were formed after the Memphis losses, while this impressive preseason win is deemed by some to be meaningless. Isn't there a little inconsistency there?

All of the games (from a W/L) take are meaningless.

If you think Dallas will be playing Tyrell Terry, Josh Green, Tyler Bay or Nate Hinton in any game within 10 points all season long... then you can get excited about the win.

Otherwise, it's just a meaningless exhibition game. Some Wolves players looked better, so that's a plus. Hopefully, it translates for the regular season.

But I think most would agree that Dallas looks to be a much better team than Minnesota this season and was up by 15 relatively easy and sat down all the rotation guys. It's just what it is... Luka makes Dallas a very good team.


[Note: Dallas separated from the Wolves late in the 2nd and into the 3rd quarter...]

[AbeVigodaLive]

Finney-Smith, Hardaway, and Richardson (starters) and Kleber (early off the bench) made 14-19 of 3's. That pretty much explains the +/- difference and why our starters got beat. And at least half of those 3's were very well contested.

So this wasn't a situation where our starters were throwing the ball away or constantly getting beat off the dribble. Carlisle and Dallas is just one of these teams that can take a bunch of middling guys, one star, and squeeze a bunch of wins out of them. I'd love to see what he could do with our roster.

Carlisle seems to be a demanding, but very good coach.

Even though Luka dominates the ball... for obvious reasons... I'm impressed at how well it moved. Even though Dallas hit a few contested shots... there were still many open looks. But I don't know if those were from Wolves breakdowns or just a good scheme/players by Dallas. There's only so much today's NBA defenses can do vs. a good team with the right mix of good players who know what they're doing.

[FNG]

AVL, I agree that preseason wins are relatively meaningless, as are the losses. My point was that it seems this board seems to draw a lot of negative conclusions from losses, but then explains away a win. But I'm new here, so I admit my my perception may be incorrect.

I think we all are fairly certain that Dallas is a better team than the Wolves- Nate Silver has them winning 7 more games than us this season, which seems about right. But I don't think we can draw that conclusion from this game. I agree that Carlyle is not going to finish close games with Bay, Tyler, Green and Hinton, but is Saunders going to finish close games with Reid, Vanderbilt, McDaniels, Hagans and Culver? 2 or 3 of those guys will not even make the team. Kudos to Saunders for getting some likely G-League players to play hard and beat a Carlyle-coached team. If he can have the same impact on KAT on both sides of the ball consistently this season, this board's optimism with respect to the Vegas win projection will be warranted

None of us can draw conclusions from one game, especially a preseason. But we can see indicators of what the current status of this team is. Here's all I draw from this game (based on reading this thread, looking at the box score, and my own personal prejudices):

1) This team is quite deep, and it's difficult to project what the final roster will be- our G-League team could be quite good.

2) Dallas' starting lineup is much better than the odd starting lineup Ryan put out there last night. I predict, or at least hope, 3 guys who started last night will not start most of our games this year.

[AbeVigodaLive]

One thing I did like... and it's always easier at the beginning of the season to pull off... but a good sign, nonetheless...

... The Wolves bench was engaged regardless of who was in the game or sitting. I hope to see it continue, if nothing else, it makes the game in empty arenas more fun. We'll see though. It might be tough with so many guys vying for the same positions/shots/acclaim/eventually money... and/or if the Wins aren't there.

[FNG]

A couple questions I have for those who actually watched the game: While Doncic had a nice facilitating game and seemed to provide his teammates with a lot of easy 3-point looks, the rest of his stats were unimpressive- 6 for 18 shooting and only 5 rebounds. I love the photo in my online Strib this morning of 19-year-old Anthony Edwards muscling Luca into a turnover, and I also read in Robson's twitter that Okogie was also effective man-on-man against Luka. After years of watching skinny guys like Wiggins and Dieng get pushed around, it's fun to have some guys with some muscle who like to mix it up a little. I will gladly add RHJ and Ed Davis to that mix.

Here are my questions. Who did Ryan have mostly defending Luka? How do you evaluate each of the main defenders man-to-man against Luka? And finally, did Luka just have a poor shooting game, or was our defense a significant factor?

[AbeVigodaLive]

A couple questions I have for those who actually watched the game: While Doncic had a nice facilitating game and seemed to provide his teammates with a lot of easy 3-point looks, the rest of his stats were unimpressive- 6 for 18 shooting and only 5 rebounds. I love the photo in my online Strib this morning of 19-year-old Anthony Edwards muscling Luca into a turnover, and I also read in Robson's twitter that Okogie was also effective man-on-man against Luka. After years of watching skinny guys like Wiggins and Dieng get pushed around, it's fun to have some guys with some muscle who like to mix it up a little. I will gladly add RHJ and Ed Davis to that mix.

Here are my questions. Who did Ryan have mostly defending Luka? How do you evaluate each of the main defenders man-to-man against Luka? And finally, did Luka just have a poor shooting game, or was our defense a significant factor?

Edwards showed promise of hope. The Dallas announcing crew that he could be one of the few guys capable of matching Luka's size/strength. Okogie is who he is at this point. At one point, Beasley was guarding Luka and started jawing with him... the Wolves bench seemed to enjoy it. There was a lot of energy going... and then Towns picked up his 5th foul moments later... and that was that.

[Lipoli390]

Finney-Smith, Hardaway, and Richardson (starters) and Kleber (early off the bench) made 14-19 of 3's. That pretty much explains the +/- difference and why our starters got beat. And at least half of those 3's were very well contested.

So this wasn't a situation where our starters were throwing the ball away or constantly getting beat off the dribble. Carlisle and Dallas is just one of these teams that can take a bunch of middling guys, one star, and squeeze a bunch of wins out of them. I'd love to see what he could do with our roster.

Yes. Carlisle is one of the best head coaches in the NBA. It would be exciting to have a coach of his caliber leading the Wolves.

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

Doncic is a career 32% 3-pt shooter, which isn't horrible, but getting him to take 3's is WAAAAY better than allowing him into the lane, where he is usually a maestro at either finishing himself or hitting a better shooter than him with a kick out after the defense collapses.

The key is to go under screens with him - no reason to chase him over a screen and allow him to get a guy on his backside as he attacks the paint. This is how he wrecks opposing defenses. Okogie guarded him the most in the first half and did about as well as anyone could hope for. Otherwise, it was a mix of guys like Beasley, Edwards, and Layman (off switches). Beasley did surprisingly well too.

Again, I thought our defense played its best last night of the 3 preseason games. There were three main rotation guys on Dallas that just couldn't miss from 3 and sometimes you just tip your cap.

[AbeVigodaLive]

Doncic is a career 32% 3-pt shooter, which isn't horrible, but getting him to take 3's is WAAAAY better than allowing him into the lane, where he is usually a maestro at either finishing himself or hitting a better shooter than him with a kick out after the defense collapses.

The key is to go under screens with him - no reason to chase him over a screen and allow him to get a guy on his backside as he attacks the paint. This is how he wrecks opposing defenses. Okogie guarded him the most in the first half and did about as well as anyone could hope for. Otherwise, it was a mix of guys like Beasley, Edwards, and Layman (off switches). Beasley did surprisingly well too.

Again, I thought our defense played its best last night of the 3 preseason games. There were three main rotation guys on Dallas that just couldn't miss from 3 and sometimes you just tip your cap.

32% is pretty bad though. And he actually was worse last season.

Right now, he's been able to avoid the Giannis/Simmons criticism because he's taking them (9 per game).

But because he's the current golden boy... he also gets to avoid the Russell Westbrook criticism for not making them. Until he proves he can hit them consistently... yeah... keep going under and hope the numbers play out in your favor.