Wolves Free Agent & Trade Thread

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2022/07/wolves-notes-gobert-towns-durant-murray.htmlNotes from Hoops Rumors:

- Sources tell Krawczynski that Gobert has expressed excitement about playing with the Timberwolves and that Towns was especially supportive of the move.

- According to Krawczynski, Wolves sources were pessimistic throughout the process that an agreement would actually be reached, and a deal looked to be "in peril" as of Friday morning.

- Minnesota was prepared to shift its focus to other targets like Myles Turner or Clint Capela before the Gobert talks gained traction again later on Friday when Utah agreed to do a deal without McDaniels included.

- Before striking a deal for Gobert, the Wolves made "several calls" to the Nets about Kevin Durant, sources tell Krawczynski. However, Minnesota was unwilling to give up Edwards or Towns for Durant, so those talks didn't go far.

- The Timberwolves were also in the mix for Dejounte Murray and could have outbid the Hawks for him, but the fact that they didn't shows that they valued Gobert more, observes Krawczynski.

[Q-is-here]

The whole Dejounte Murray vs. Rudy Gobert choice is a fascinating one to break down and debate. There has to be some folks cringing at the thought we could have had Murray for a deal that was more than what Atlanta paid, but less than what we paid for Rudy. I can definitely see the merits of our big move being Murray instead of Gobert.

[Lipoli390]

The whole Dejounte Murray vs. Rudy Gobert choice is a fascinating one to break down and debate. There has to be some folks cringing at the thought we could have had Murray for a deal that was more than what Atlanta paid, but less than what we paid for Rudy. I can definitely see the merits of our big move being Murray instead of Gobert.

I didn't want to give up three picks for Murray, but in retrospect, now that we know what the Wolves we're willing to give up for Gobert, I would have been very happy with a deal for Murray. Here are the benefits of that deal over the Gobert deal:

1. We would have given up three picks rather than four

2. The 2023 pick could have been partially protected (Hawk's 2023 pick via Hornets is top 16 protected)

3. We'd still have Beverley, Kessler and Bolmaro (it's clear the Spurs had no interest in players)

4. Murray is 25 & aligns much better with the age of our key players (Ant, McDaniels and KAT)

5. Murray has two years left on an approximately 17M per year contract, which would have given the Wolves more financial flexibility over the next two years than we'll have with Gobert's hefty contract.

6. The defense of Murray would allow us to deal Beverly to someone else for value without seriously compromising our perimeter defense.

7. There were a lot of good bigs available in free agency and via trades to help upgrade that spot.

It would have likely been Beasley plus three picks, maybe slightly less protected for 2023 to outbid Atlanta. Or it could have been DLO, in which case we cold have gotten McDermott back to match salaries. I could see Atlanta being interning in dealing Capela for a package that included Beverley given Atlanta's win-now focus and desperate need to short up their backcourt defense and provide another ball-handler to take some pressure off Trae Young.

But it's all academic now, although it's always fun to discuss what ifs on a message board. That's what we do. :)

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

The whole Dejounte Murray vs. Rudy Gobert choice is a fascinating one to break down and debate. There has to be some folks cringing at the thought we could have had Murray for a deal that was more than what Atlanta paid, but less than what we paid for Rudy. I can definitely see the merits of our big move being Murray instead of Gobert.

Personally, I don't see how Dejounte Murray would have made this team as good or better than Rudy Gobert likely will. The appeal with Gobert is that he can effect so much of what happens on the floor without the basketball. That's just not the case with Murray as he's at his very best when he can dominate touches, similar to how Russell Westbrook worked in Oklahoma City after Kevin Durant left. That's not a knock on him. It's just an observation in regards to his fit on a team that already has two high usage offensive centerpieces. Not to mention, there are real concerns regarding Murray's efficiency and durability that can't be ignored.

Simply, Gobert makes the Timberwolves a 50-60 win team with championship aspirations. Murray makes this team a 48-50 win team that threatens to advance to the second round. That's the difference as I see it and expending additional resources to make that happen -- as opposed to the alternative -- is worth it.

[60WinTim]

I do the Gobert trade every time. It is the most impactful change we can make to the roster, that benefits the team in so many ways. It is the only trade that gets you a star, not just potential.

[Q-is-here]

The whole Dejounte Murray vs. Rudy Gobert choice is a fascinating one to break down and debate. There has to be some folks cringing at the thought we could have had Murray for a deal that was more than what Atlanta paid, but less than what we paid for Rudy. I can definitely see the merits of our big move being Murray instead of Gobert.

Personally, I don't see how Dejounte Murray would have made this team as good or better than Rudy Gobert likely will. The appeal with Gobert is that he can effect so much of what happens on the floor without the basketball. That's just not the case with Murray as he's at his very best when he can dominate touches, similar to how Russell Westbrook worked in Oklahoma City after Kevin Durant left. That's not a knock on him. It's just an observation in regards to his fit on a team that already has two high usage offensive centerpieces. Not to mention, there are real concerns regarding Murray's efficiency and durability that can't be ignored.

Simply, Gobert makes the Timberwolves a 50-60 win team with championship aspirations. Murray makes this team a 48-50 win team that threatens to advance to the second round. That's the difference as I see it and expending additional resources to make that happen -- as opposed to the alternative -- is worth it.

Cam, he's an elite rebounder from the guard position, something that would have really helped us. He also is a very good defender and passer - gets a ton of steals. So while he average 20+ for the Spurs, I think he could have taken a much reduced scoring load with the Wolves and still been effective.

On the downside, you bring up a good point in terms of his durability and inefficiency as a scorer.

[Q-is-here]

I do the Gobert trade every time. It is the most impactful change we can make to the roster, that benefits the team in so many ways. It is the only trade that gets you a star, not just potential.

Gets us a star with zero redundancies with our other two stars. Folks that don't care to look carefully would question why on earth we need two Centers. And it's partially true that they are somewhat redundant positionally. But they are absolutely not redundant functionally. Ant, KAT, and Gobert are all very different players in terms of the functions they perform well.

[Coolbreeze44]

Well put Q

[Monster]

I do the Gobert trade every time. It is the most impactful change we can make to the roster, that benefits the team in so many ways. It is the only trade that gets you a star, not just potential.

Gets us a star with zero redundancies with our other two stars. Folks that don't care to look carefully would question why on earth we need two Centers. And it's partially true that they are somewhat redundant positionally. But they are absolutely not redundant functionally. Ant, KAT, and Gobert are all very different players in terms of the functions they perform well.

Towns dropped his 3 point shooting volume last year which ai think was fine since he was also driving to the basket. With Gobert playing next to him a healthy chunk I hope he is bombing threes next year at the rate he was in previous seasons or maybe more. Poor Shaq and Chunk are gonna be besides themselves. Lol I absolutely can't wait to see MN guards playing with Gobert screening for them. They are gonna get a lot of easy looks off him they didn't get last year and some easy assists.

[Lipoli390]

The whole Dejounte Murray vs. Rudy Gobert choice is a fascinating one to break down and debate. There has to be some folks cringing at the thought we could have had Murray for a deal that was more than what Atlanta paid, but less than what we paid for Rudy. I can definitely see the merits of our big move being Murray instead of Gobert.

Personally, I don't see how Dejounte Murray would have made this team as good or better than Rudy Gobert likely will. The appeal with Gobert is that he can effect so much of what happens on the floor without the basketball. That's just not the case with Murray as he's at his very best when he can dominate touches, similar to how Russell Westbrook worked in Oklahoma City after Kevin Durant left. That's not a knock on him. It's just an observation in regards to his fit on a team that already has two high usage offensive centerpieces. Not to mention, there are real concerns regarding Murray's efficiency and durability that can't be ignored.

Simply, Gobert makes the Timberwolves a 50-60 win team with championship aspirations. Murray makes this team a 48-50 win team that threatens to advance to the second round. That's the difference as I see it and expending additional resources to make that happen -- as opposed to the alternative -- is worth it.

Cam, he's an elite rebounder from the guard position, something that would have really helped us. He also is a very good defender and passer - gets a ton of steals. So while he average 20+ for the Spurs, I think he could have taken a much reduced scoring load with the Wolves and still been effective.

On the downside, you bring up a good point in terms of his durability and inefficiency as a scorer.

There's no durability issue with Murray compared to Gobert. Murray was out with an ACL for one season. In his three seasons since then, he played 66, 67 and 68 games, averaging over 30 minutes a game. In comparison, Gobert played 68, 71 and 66 games on about the same minutes per game.

I agree he has a shooting efficiency issue. But note that his eFG% was the same as DLO's last season. Yet Murray averaged 9.2 assists, 8.2 rebounds and 2.0 steals per game. Those are elite PG stats.

Is Gobert a bigger upgrade that Murray? Yes. But Murray would have been a huge upgrade as well. And importantly, the Wolves would still have Beverley and other players/assets they had to give up to get Gobert. You can't look at the two alternatives without factoring in the assets we would have retained.