Minnesota Sports Forum

khans2k5 wrote:

TeamRicky wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:Win the lottery and draft Fultz. I think in the new NBA you need a PG. Curry, Westbrook, Harden (defacto PG), CP3, Conley, Lillard, Irving, IT, Lowry, Wall. I would guess the Spurs will be the only team to advance without a really good PG. I think we have the wing and the big and we just need the PG and Fultz just seems to be a solid all-around player. Sign Gibson and Tucker to 2 year deals in the 12-15 range. I would give Ricky one more year to place hold and then if he reverts back to his old form see if you can trade him.

Rotation:
Ricky/Fultz/Tyus
Lavine/Dunn
Wiggins/Tucker
Gibson/Belly
Towns/G/Cole

Long-term:
Fultz/Dunn/Tyus
Dunn/Lavine
Wiggins
Belly
Towns/G

Find a 3/4 combo guy for small ball and there's your team. 9 man rotation.

We don't need another point guard. We got Ricky, Dunn and Tyus. We are in better shape than most teams at point guard. No point guard we could draft will be as good as Ricky for at least three years and there is no certainty Fultz will be even be better than Dunn longer term.

On the other hand, we do need a wing who can play both ways. Wiggins and LaVine suck at defense. Trade the pick for Butler, Porter, George or Covington or draft Jackson, Isaac or Tatum.

You don't draft for need when you are this close to the top of the draft. You draft BPA. Fultz is the best player in this draft. He has the size, shooting and skill to play both PG and SG. He can finish and pass with both hands. He attacks and has great body control. He's a guy who actually uses his dribble penetration to make plays for others. Look at the PG's in these playoffs. Ricky is worse than every single player I named. You really want to go into the playoffs with the 10th best PG every year while 7 of the 8 teams that advance are led by great PG's? We aren't set at PG. Ricky is middle of the pack in a league full of star PG's, Dunn has a lot of tightening up to do with his handle and shot and Tyus is a backup at best because of his size issues. You talk about Isaac like he's already great, but he's a twig and years away from being strong enough to be a productive player in this league. I don't care about contributions from a rookie next year. I care about what our team looks like long-term and Fultz at the PG spot is just going to be more valuable than Ricky because he can make plays for others and score the ball in every way you can think of. All the guys you mention are great prospects. There's a reason Fultz is higher than all of them. He's the complete PG offensively and has tools that under Thibs could make him a really good defender as well.

TheFuture wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:Win the lottery and draft Fultz. I think in the new NBA you need a PG. Curry, Westbrook, Harden (defacto PG), CP3, Conley, Lillard, Irving, IT, Lowry, Wall. I would guess the Spurs will be the only team to advance without a really good PG. I think we have the wing and the big and we just need the PG and Fultz just seems to be a solid all-around player. Sign Gibson and Tucker to 2 year deals in the 12-15 range. I would give Ricky one more year to place hold and then if he reverts back to his old form see if you can trade him.

Rotation:
Ricky/Fultz/Tyus
Lavine/Dunn
Wiggins/Tucker
Gibson/Belly
Towns/G/Cole

Long-term:
Fultz/Dunn/Tyus
Dunn/Lavine
Wiggins
Belly
Towns/G

Find a 3/4 combo guy for small ball and there's your team. 9 man rotation.

After watching these playoffs I've realized ( outside of scoring at pg but we have debated that here plenty) the last thing we need to spend a large chunk of $ on is a true PF like Gibson. We need one or two combo forwards and a 2/3 who are respectable from 3 and are agile enough to switch on D.

If we need to play big I trust a rotation of Towns, Gorgui, Bjelicia, and Aldrich. I don't trust any rotation we can throw out there for small ball, though either Towns or Gorgui can be the 5 in either style.

I was high on Patterson, but he's not been terribly noticeable for Toronto, definitely moved down a tier for me. Ingles on the other hand is playing phenomenal.

My tiers:

1) Jamychal Green, Iguodala, and Joe Ingles
2) Ibaka and Millsap (tier 2 because 30 mil scares me)
3) James Johnson, Tucker, Sefolosha
4) Patterson, Bojan Bogdanovic, Redick, Korver
5) Carter, Allen, Mirotic, Illyasova

TeamRicky wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:

TeamRicky wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:Win the lottery and draft Fultz. I think in the new NBA you need a PG. Curry, Westbrook, Harden (defacto PG), CP3, Conley, Lillard, Irving, IT, Lowry, Wall. I would guess the Spurs will be the only team to advance without a really good PG. I think we have the wing and the big and we just need the PG and Fultz just seems to be a solid all-around player. Sign Gibson and Tucker to 2 year deals in the 12-15 range. I would give Ricky one more year to place hold and then if he reverts back to his old form see if you can trade him.

Rotation:
Ricky/Fultz/Tyus
Lavine/Dunn
Wiggins/Tucker
Gibson/Belly
Towns/G/Cole

Long-term:
Fultz/Dunn/Tyus
Dunn/Lavine
Wiggins
Belly
Towns/G

Find a 3/4 combo guy for small ball and there's your team. 9 man rotation.

We don't need another point guard. We got Ricky, Dunn and Tyus. We are in better shape than most teams at point guard. No point guard we could draft will be as good as Ricky for at least three years and there is no certainty Fultz will be even be better than Dunn longer term.

On the other hand, we do need a wing who can play both ways. Wiggins and LaVine suck at defense. Trade the pick for Butler, Porter, George or Covington or draft Jackson, Isaac or Tatum.

You don't draft for need when you are this close to the top of the draft. You draft BPA. Fultz is the best player in this draft. He has the size, shooting and skill to play both PG and SG. He can finish and pass with both hands. He attacks and has great body control. He's a guy who actually uses his dribble penetration to make plays for others. Look at the PG's in these playoffs. Ricky is worse than every single player I named. You really want to go into the playoffs with the 10th best PG every year while 7 of the 8 teams that advance are led by great PG's? We aren't set at PG. Ricky is middle of the pack in a league full of star PG's, Dunn has a lot of tightening up to do with his handle and shot and Tyus is a backup at best because of his size issues. You talk about Isaac like he's already great, but he's a twig and years away from being strong enough to be a productive player in this league. I don't care about contributions from a rookie next year. I care about what our team looks like long-term and Fultz at the PG spot is just going to be more valuable than Ricky because he can make plays for others and score the ball in every way you can think of. All the guys you mention are great prospects. There's a reason Fultz is higher than all of them. He's the complete PG offensively and has tools that under Thibs could make him a really good defender as well.

I just happen to disagree with you. Fulltz is not a clear BPA. I doubt he'll end up being the best player when all is said and done. Remember when Kyrie Irving was the consensus #1 pick and guess what, two wing players from the same draft have been better players: Kawhi Leonard and Klay Thompson.

I do want the BPA and I think the guys I like may end up being just as good if not better than Fulltz. But you also draft who will help the team the most. We don't need another volume scorer and Ricky is one of the elite passers in the game right now. And I think Ricky IS better than some of the guys you named. I think pretty much everybody you named is OLDER than Ricky and Ricky has consistently had better plus/minus stats than several of the guys you named. Curry and Westbrook (Sorry Harden is still a SG) are on a different plateau but we can't get them and CP3 is too old for us. A few of the other guys may be better than Ricky now, but Ricky's younger and will get paid a lot less. Keep Ricky and Dunn and address our real needs.

khans2k5 wrote:

TeamRicky wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:

TeamRicky wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:Win the lottery and draft Fultz. I think in the new NBA you need a PG. Curry, Westbrook, Harden (defacto PG), CP3, Conley, Lillard, Irving, IT, Lowry, Wall. I would guess the Spurs will be the only team to advance without a really good PG. I think we have the wing and the big and we just need the PG and Fultz just seems to be a solid all-around player. Sign Gibson and Tucker to 2 year deals in the 12-15 range. I would give Ricky one more year to place hold and then if he reverts back to his old form see if you can trade him.

Rotation:
Ricky/Fultz/Tyus
Lavine/Dunn
Wiggins/Tucker
Gibson/Belly
Towns/G/Cole

Long-term:
Fultz/Dunn/Tyus
Dunn/Lavine
Wiggins
Belly
Towns/G

Find a 3/4 combo guy for small ball and there's your team. 9 man rotation.

We don't need another point guard. We got Ricky, Dunn and Tyus. We are in better shape than most teams at point guard. No point guard we could draft will be as good as Ricky for at least three years and there is no certainty Fultz will be even be better than Dunn longer term.

On the other hand, we do need a wing who can play both ways. Wiggins and LaVine suck at defense. Trade the pick for Butler, Porter, George or Covington or draft Jackson, Isaac or Tatum.

You don't draft for need when you are this close to the top of the draft. You draft BPA. Fultz is the best player in this draft. He has the size, shooting and skill to play both PG and SG. He can finish and pass with both hands. He attacks and has great body control. He's a guy who actually uses his dribble penetration to make plays for others. Look at the PG's in these playoffs. Ricky is worse than every single player I named. You really want to go into the playoffs with the 10th best PG every year while 7 of the 8 teams that advance are led by great PG's? We aren't set at PG. Ricky is middle of the pack in a league full of star PG's, Dunn has a lot of tightening up to do with his handle and shot and Tyus is a backup at best because of his size issues. You talk about Isaac like he's already great, but he's a twig and years away from being strong enough to be a productive player in this league. I don't care about contributions from a rookie next year. I care about what our team looks like long-term and Fultz at the PG spot is just going to be more valuable than Ricky because he can make plays for others and score the ball in every way you can think of. All the guys you mention are great prospects. There's a reason Fultz is higher than all of them. He's the complete PG offensively and has tools that under Thibs could make him a really good defender as well.

I just happen to disagree with you. Fulltz is not a clear BPA. I doubt he'll end up being the best player when all is said and done. Remember when Kyrie Irving was the consensus #1 pick and guess what, two wing players from the same draft have been better players: Kawhi Leonard and Klay Thompson.

I do want the BPA and I think the guys I like may end up being just as good if not better than Fulltz. But you also draft who will help the team the most. We don't need another volume scorer and Ricky is one of the elite passers in the game right now. And I think Ricky IS better than some of the guys you named. I think pretty much everybody you named is OLDER than Ricky and Ricky has consistently had better plus/minus stats than several of the guys you named. Curry and Westbrook (Sorry Harden is still a SG) are on a different plateau but we can't get them and CP3 is too old for us. A few of the other guys may be better than Ricky now, but Ricky's younger and will get paid a lot less. Keep Ricky and Dunn and address our real needs.

They're all in the playoffs and led their teams to the playoffs while Ricky is sitting at home watching. He's just not better than them. If +/- mattered so much why did they all manage to lead their teams to the playoffs while we are on the outside looking in? To me you can't both argue Ricky is better than those guys and he needs his teammates to carry him to the playoffs. He's either on their level and he failed as a lead guard when it came to wins or he's below them because we can't win with him as the lead guard. Youth is not a bonus for Ricky. He's been a pro basketball player for 10 years. He is what he is. He's shown 1 month of play that belongs with the guys on my list when they all did it this whole year.

TeamRicky wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:

TeamRicky wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:

TeamRicky wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:Win the lottery and draft Fultz. I think in the new NBA you need a PG. Curry, Westbrook, Harden (defacto PG), CP3, Conley, Lillard, Irving, IT, Lowry, Wall. I would guess the Spurs will be the only team to advance without a really good PG. I think we have the wing and the big and we just need the PG and Fultz just seems to be a solid all-around player. Sign Gibson and Tucker to 2 year deals in the 12-15 range. I would give Ricky one more year to place hold and then if he reverts back to his old form see if you can trade him.

Rotation:
Ricky/Fultz/Tyus
Lavine/Dunn
Wiggins/Tucker
Gibson/Belly
Towns/G/Cole

Long-term:
Fultz/Dunn/Tyus
Dunn/Lavine
Wiggins
Belly
Towns/G

Find a 3/4 combo guy for small ball and there's your team. 9 man rotation.

We don't need another point guard. We got Ricky, Dunn and Tyus. We are in better shape than most teams at point guard. No point guard we could draft will be as good as Ricky for at least three years and there is no certainty Fultz will be even be better than Dunn longer term.

On the other hand, we do need a wing who can play both ways. Wiggins and LaVine suck at defense. Trade the pick for Butler, Porter, George or Covington or draft Jackson, Isaac or Tatum.

You don't draft for need when you are this close to the top of the draft. You draft BPA. Fultz is the best player in this draft. He has the size, shooting and skill to play both PG and SG. He can finish and pass with both hands. He attacks and has great body control. He's a guy who actually uses his dribble penetration to make plays for others. Look at the PG's in these playoffs. Ricky is worse than every single player I named. You really want to go into the playoffs with the 10th best PG every year while 7 of the 8 teams that advance are led by great PG's? We aren't set at PG. Ricky is middle of the pack in a league full of star PG's, Dunn has a lot of tightening up to do with his handle and shot and Tyus is a backup at best because of his size issues. You talk about Isaac like he's already great, but he's a twig and years away from being strong enough to be a productive player in this league. I don't care about contributions from a rookie next year. I care about what our team looks like long-term and Fultz at the PG spot is just going to be more valuable than Ricky because he can make plays for others and score the ball in every way you can think of. All the guys you mention are great prospects. There's a reason Fultz is higher than all of them. He's the complete PG offensively and has tools that under Thibs could make him a really good defender as well.

I just happen to disagree with you. Fulltz is not a clear BPA. I doubt he'll end up being the best player when all is said and done. Remember when Kyrie Irving was the consensus #1 pick and guess what, two wing players from the same draft have been better players: Kawhi Leonard and Klay Thompson.

I do want the BPA and I think the guys I like may end up being just as good if not better than Fulltz. But you also draft who will help the team the most. We don't need another volume scorer and Ricky is one of the elite passers in the game right now. And I think Ricky IS better than some of the guys you named. I think pretty much everybody you named is OLDER than Ricky and Ricky has consistently had better plus/minus stats than several of the guys you named. Curry and Westbrook (Sorry Harden is still a SG) are on a different plateau but we can't get them and CP3 is too old for us. A few of the other guys may be better than Ricky now, but Ricky's younger and will get paid a lot less. Keep Ricky and Dunn and address our real needs.

They're all in the playoffs and led their teams to the playoffs while Ricky is sitting at home watching. He's just not better than them. If +/- mattered so much why did they all manage to lead their teams to the playoffs while we are on the outside looking in? To me you can't both argue Ricky is better than those guys and he needs his teammates to carry him to the playoffs. He's either on their level and he failed as a lead guard when it came to wins or he's below them because we can't win with him as the lead guard. Youth is not a bonus for Ricky. He's been a pro basketball player for 10 years. He is what he is. He's shown 1 month of play that belongs with the guys on my list when they all did it this whole year.

Because the playoff teams have better, more experienced talent surrounding the point guard and perhaps better coaching. Its silly to pin the team's second best plus/minus player as the reason we are losing. Ricky is still young and getting better. Point guard is a very difficult position and most point guards don't blossom til they hit their mid 20s. Look at Jason Kidd and Steve Nash's trajectory. How many NBA point guards can you name that are younger and clearly better than Ricky? I'd really like to know.

BloopOracle wrote:I feel like prime John Stockton could be in this draft and TeamRicky would want to pass on him because.....well because he's team Ricky lol

khans2k5 wrote:

TeamRicky wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:

TeamRicky wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:

TeamRicky wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:Win the lottery and draft Fultz. I think in the new NBA you need a PG. Curry, Westbrook, Harden (defacto PG), CP3, Conley, Lillard, Irving, IT, Lowry, Wall. I would guess the Spurs will be the only team to advance without a really good PG. I think we have the wing and the big and we just need the PG and Fultz just seems to be a solid all-around player. Sign Gibson and Tucker to 2 year deals in the 12-15 range. I would give Ricky one more year to place hold and then if he reverts back to his old form see if you can trade him.

Rotation:
Ricky/Fultz/Tyus
Lavine/Dunn
Wiggins/Tucker
Gibson/Belly
Towns/G/Cole

Long-term:
Fultz/Dunn/Tyus
Dunn/Lavine
Wiggins
Belly
Towns/G

Find a 3/4 combo guy for small ball and there's your team. 9 man rotation.

We don't need another point guard. We got Ricky, Dunn and Tyus. We are in better shape than most teams at point guard. No point guard we could draft will be as good as Ricky for at least three years and there is no certainty Fultz will be even be better than Dunn longer term.

On the other hand, we do need a wing who can play both ways. Wiggins and LaVine suck at defense. Trade the pick for Butler, Porter, George or Covington or draft Jackson, Isaac or Tatum.

You don't draft for need when you are this close to the top of the draft. You draft BPA. Fultz is the best player in this draft. He has the size, shooting and skill to play both PG and SG. He can finish and pass with both hands. He attacks and has great body control. He's a guy who actually uses his dribble penetration to make plays for others. Look at the PG's in these playoffs. Ricky is worse than every single player I named. You really want to go into the playoffs with the 10th best PG every year while 7 of the 8 teams that advance are led by great PG's? We aren't set at PG. Ricky is middle of the pack in a league full of star PG's, Dunn has a lot of tightening up to do with his handle and shot and Tyus is a backup at best because of his size issues. You talk about Isaac like he's already great, but he's a twig and years away from being strong enough to be a productive player in this league. I don't care about contributions from a rookie next year. I care about what our team looks like long-term and Fultz at the PG spot is just going to be more valuable than Ricky because he can make plays for others and score the ball in every way you can think of. All the guys you mention are great prospects. There's a reason Fultz is higher than all of them. He's the complete PG offensively and has tools that under Thibs could make him a really good defender as well.

I just happen to disagree with you. Fulltz is not a clear BPA. I doubt he'll end up being the best player when all is said and done. Remember when Kyrie Irving was the consensus #1 pick and guess what, two wing players from the same draft have been better players: Kawhi Leonard and Klay Thompson.

I do want the BPA and I think the guys I like may end up being just as good if not better than Fulltz. But you also draft who will help the team the most. We don't need another volume scorer and Ricky is one of the elite passers in the game right now. And I think Ricky IS better than some of the guys you named. I think pretty much everybody you named is OLDER than Ricky and Ricky has consistently had better plus/minus stats than several of the guys you named. Curry and Westbrook (Sorry Harden is still a SG) are on a different plateau but we can't get them and CP3 is too old for us. A few of the other guys may be better than Ricky now, but Ricky's younger and will get paid a lot less. Keep Ricky and Dunn and address our real needs.

They're all in the playoffs and led their teams to the playoffs while Ricky is sitting at home watching. He's just not better than them. If +/- mattered so much why did they all manage to lead their teams to the playoffs while we are on the outside looking in? To me you can't both argue Ricky is better than those guys and he needs his teammates to carry him to the playoffs. He's either on their level and he failed as a lead guard when it came to wins or he's below them because we can't win with him as the lead guard. Youth is not a bonus for Ricky. He's been a pro basketball player for 10 years. He is what he is. He's shown 1 month of play that belongs with the guys on my list when they all did it this whole year.

Because the playoff teams have better, more experienced talent surrounding the point guard and perhaps better coaching. Its silly to pin the team's second best plus/minus player as the reason we are losing. Ricky is still young and getting better. Point guard is a very difficult position and most point guards don't blossom til they hit their mid 20s. Look at Jason Kidd and Steve Nash's trajectory. How many NBA point guards can you name that are younger and clearly better than Ricky? I'd really like to know.

Ricky 26
Lillard 26
Irving 25
Walker 26
Wall 26

Only CP3, Lowry and Dragic are over 30 so most of the top guards in the league are only a 2-3 year gap and that gap is all in prime playing years so Ricky is not young enough where you can reasonably expect a big jump in performance and they are all still gonna be in their prime and better than him for the length of Ricky's cheaper contract.