Minnesota Sports Forum

monsterpile wrote:

bleedspeed177 wrote:I still am a Portis fan. I wonder if they would have trade us him instead of the 16th pick.

I was a fan of his innthat draftvand to be honest so far he has been underwhelming but looking at the stats he seemed to come on late last year when he got minutes. That block rate is troubling as it's basically the same as Wiggins.

Exactly. He wouldn't get minutes here and if we really want him go get him for cheap next year as a RFA. Also I would take the chance with Patton over a guy who is at best a 6th big on a good team

SameOldNudityDrew wrote:The Patton pick is kinda weird to me.

With the Butler trade, it makes sense to get a guy who can contribute soon, and ideally at a position of need. Patton is the opposite of that. He's a pretty raw, high upside guy who plays a position where we already have Towns and Dieng.

Maybe he pans out (I'm kinda skeptical), maybe he doesn't. Either way, we probably won't know for 2-3 years.

There were other guys available who might not have the upside, but were ready to contribute sooner, were not such long shots, and/or would have fit a role better for us. I think there were a bunch of forwards who went late in the first round and early second round who could etch out a nice role for themselves in the NBA.

I hope Patton proves me wrong, but that pick just left me scratching my head.

I had the same reaction. You had John Collins there with proven elite college production in ares that translate well to the NBA. You had Giles and Anunoby -- guys who would have probably been top 10 picks if not for prior knee injuries. If we're not counting on the pick, then why not swing for the fences with a guy like Giles or Anunoby. Again, it's a head-scratcher. And I don't trust our scouts because I can't think of a single instance where they've shined -- i.e., no lower first round or second round picks or free agent acquisitions that have been successful. Like you, I sure hope Patton proves me wrong.

lipoli390 wrote:

SameOldNudityDrew wrote:The Patton pick is kinda weird to me.

With the Butler trade, it makes sense to get a guy who can contribute soon, and ideally at a position of need. Patton is the opposite of that. He's a pretty raw, high upside guy who plays a position where we already have Towns and Dieng.

Maybe he pans out (I'm kinda skeptical), maybe he doesn't. Either way, we probably won't know for 2-3 years.

There were other guys available who might not have the upside, but were ready to contribute sooner, were not such long shots, and/or would have fit a role better for us. I think there were a bunch of forwards who went late in the first round and early second round who could etch out a nice role for themselves in the NBA.

I hope Patton proves me wrong, but that pick just left me scratching my head.

I had the same reaction. You had John Collins there with proven elite college production in ares that translate well to the NBA. You had Giles and Anunoby -- guys who would have probably been top 10 picks if not for prior knee injuries. If we're not counting on the pick, then why not swing for the fences with a guy like Giles or Anunoby. Again, it's a head-scratcher. And I don't trust our scouts because I can't think of a single instance where they've shined -- i.e., no lower first round or second round picks or free agent acquisitions that have been successful. Like you, I sure hope Patton proves me wrong.

I was a bit surprised with the pick except Thibs had said he wanted some more shotblocking etc. I think more people would be more excited about the pick if they knew a bit more about Patton.

You named some intruiging guys that were picked after Patton and...that may show just how much they liked him because there were plenty of good options and probably even opportunities to trade down. I've read and listened the last few weeks to a number of folks who have seen Giles a lot over the years. Most agree the upside even if he was healthy was basically a guy more of a Deandre Jordon type that can really rebound and defend than some super star All a round player. Obviously a D Jordan would be nice but I think you get what I mean. OG could be a nice player but there are legit questions with that dude too. The worries about John Collins defending anyone didn't just go away while he was throwing down awesome dunks and shooting 3's in workouts.

Patton is basically a lot of what so many people on this board fell in love with about Zach Collins but with obviously less production per minute. It's a bit amusing if you were completely on board with picking Zach Collins even though he was possibly not a fit with Towns Dieng etc and then don't get this pick. I said the Wolves might do something unexpected with their pick. This pick was about the range Patton was supposed to go but it's possible the Wolves see beyond on Patton. His floor might not be all bad either as a guy that has plenty of length who runs the floor terrifically and has excellent instincts a rolling to the basket off screens and has good hands. Honestly IMO Towns and Dieng don't really excel in that area they try and space out more. Jim Peterson has point that out a number of times and gets kinda frustrated about it.

Also Lip you may be excited to know that according to Real GM all the scouts are new and a couple director of things like Calvin booth are still around but they did a pretty significant clean out when Thibs and Layden came in. Remeber good old Scott Roth was brought on as one of those scouts.

Here is video of most of the Creighton game against Wisconsin.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=W_j6qF51D4A

The main things that jump out at me are:

Patton moves pretty well. He can cover ground pretty good and is light on his feet. This guy really gets up and down the floor.

As a rebounder he finds a guy and is boxing them out. Sometimes his lack of stretch shows up here but he is giving all out effort.

His passing is really impressive. The ball doesn't stick in his hands. He looks really comfortable passing the ball and looks more like a guard of at least a SF than an inexperienced freshman center. If you want a guy that will help a free flowing offense he seems like a guy that will be a part of that.

He had a nice deep post up to a jump hook on Happ and another possession he blew past him for an easy finish at the rim. At worst he played even with Happ but you can easily make a case that he outplayed him overall because Happ had 4 turnovers.

I'm hoping to find a video of him later in the season. I'm curious to see what kind of progression he made or didn't make.

I'm largely on board with the Patton pick. Seems like he has his head screwed on straight, and I love the athleticism and upside. Here's my one concern. I catch a little "Wes Johnson" vibe...you know, big smile, good personality, but perhaps not enough fire. I don't love his rebounding numbers at Creighton, and also note that he had a tendency to release on the defensive boards to run the court rather than stay home for the rebound. Some of this might be because of his growth spurt he still has a wing mentality rather than a center's. Anybody else have these concerns? At any rate, he can change if this is a concern. There's no reason he can't be coached up on defense and rebounding.

Damn it Monster - I am being talked into this kid.

Damn it LST - You have me a little worried, but I think Thibs has a good radar on players that have the right drive.

kekgeek1 wrote:

monsterpile wrote:

bleedspeed177 wrote:I still am a Portis fan. I wonder if they would have trade us him instead of the 16th pick.

I was a fan of his innthat draftvand to be honest so far he has been underwhelming but looking at the stats he seemed to come on late last year when he got minutes. That block rate is troubling as it's basically the same as Wiggins.

Exactly. He wouldn't get minutes here and if we really want him go get him for cheap next year as a RFA. Also I would take the chance with Patton over a guy who is at best a 6th big on a good team

You are both right. When I become GM I will have you both as part of my front office.

longstrangetrip wrote:I'm largely on board with the Patton pick. Seems like he has his head screwed on straight, and I love the athleticism and upside. Here's my one concern. I catch a little "Wes Johnson" vibe...you know, big smile, good personality, but perhaps not enough fire. I don't love his rebounding numbers at Creighton, and also note that he had a tendency to release on the defensive boards to run the court rather than stay home for the rebound. Some of this might be because of his growth spurt he still has a wing mentality rather than a center's. Anybody else have these concerns? At any rate, he can change if this is a concern. There's no reason he can't be coached up on defense and rebounding.

If you watch him play he has plenty of fire in him. All the reports say this kid is absolutely all in on basketball. I read an article about him that basically said the guy would get in a game anywhere any time and had to be encouraged to be careful about not getting himself hurt playing against scrub type competition. He just wanted to ball.

On him releasing early it's likely because one of his best skills is running the floor like Thibs said he puts pressure on the rim. If you want him to stay down and battle with guys he seems pretty willing to do that as nearly every possession he is putting is body on someone. This guy isn't afraid of contact. In the Wisconsin game he dives on the floor for loose balls twice. I don't see him as a space cadet.

I've only watched 2 games but here is how I would summarize Patton when it comes to rebounding.

He isn't as strong as you would like so there are times when he doesn't get the board or has to try and tip it out. Sure that's concerning but he is 20 so he is likely to get stronger. How much? Idk he added like 25 lbs in the last year or something so...

The guy boxes out and that often led to other players getting the ball. He doesn't just chase after rebounds he is fundamentally doing what you are supposed to do. This leads to his team getting rebounds...if his teammates do their job.

He may not be a crazy instinctual rebounder just flying in for rebounds. It's hard to say for sure how much he has or doesn't have this skill because much of the time he is putting a body on someone or is out of the play after contesting on the perimeter. How much will he pursue a rebound out of his area?

In some ways I would compare his rebounding to Dieng. He does a lot of what he is supposed to do and therefore doesn't have high rebound numbers but probably helps the team in that regard. From what I have seen though he puts a body on guys more than Dieng does every single possession of the ball goes up and he is anywhere near the paint. If he doesn't have good enough instincts to pursue rebounds or never gets strong enough then that's what will keep him from being average to below in that area. I don't think it's because he isn't putting forth the effort. I'm really interested in seeing a game later in the season.

Justin Patton workout video which includes a lot of jumpers.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=OQyFyTFH9wA

monsterpile wrote:Justin Patton workout video which includes a lot of jumpers.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=OQyFyTFH9wA

I was preparing to say "but what about his FT shooting". But at the end, he showed that was fixed, too! Cool. ;-)

[BTW: I LOVE the pick! ]