Minnesota Sports Forum

Camden wrote:

CoolBreeze44 wrote:Amazing how this rebuild never came close to peaking and then died. And it all happened in a matter of months under Thibs.

Wolves would be in a fine position right now if your boy Wiggins didn't suck so fucking much. But sure, blame Thibs.

Im with you, in the end it comes down to the development of Wiggins, and well he has gotten worse (only in wolves land). I don't think we are in any different shape if our team looks like.

Rubio
Lavine
Wiggins
Markannen
Towns

That is still a .500 at best team. In the end we haven't developed talent well. We have done really bad at using our assets for a long time. Payne for a 1st, Young for 30 KG games, etc.....

In the end we are here because our young guys weren't good outside of Kat.

I just think it is funny that this board blamed Thibs so much and that we had so much talent and it was Thibs fault because of his coaching style. But Thibs has a .475 winning % this year while Ryan has a winning % of .440.

So in the end talent wasnt there and if Im being realistic I don't think we could have done better than what Thibs did. He acquired a star and we were good with Butler. But Butler is an ass and him and Kat didn't get along, in the end it sucks but I will always respect that trade.

Camden wrote:

CoolBreeze44 wrote:Amazing how this rebuild never came close to peaking and then died. And it all happened in a matter of months under Thibs.

Wolves would be in a fine position right now if your boy Wiggins didn't suck so fucking much. But sure, blame Thibs.

Thibs was head coach and PBO. He could have traded Wiggins while he still had some value, but decided to keep him. Then Thibs decided to give Wiggins a max deal when it was clear that the owner, Glen Taylor, had misgivings. So yes, Wiggins' failure to develop is a big key to the the rebuild never taking hold. But Thibs had ample opportunities to make smart moves and instead made simple or just plain dumb moves. In addition to mishandling Wiggins, Thibs left a long trail of mismanagement in his wake when he left -- the Gorgui contract, signing Taj to a big contract only 9 months after giving Gorgui that contract. Drafting Dunn instead of Hield or Murray. The Butler fiasco. Failing to fire himself from the head coaching position. :) The list goes on.

Thibs came in extolling the virtues of our young roster and then almost immediately began to tear it apart. He had a young core and other assets, but he had no patience. With as many disasters as this franchise has had, the Thibs tenure still manages to stick out.

Frustrating game to watch.

Another example where a tiny guy like Reggie Jackson can continually whack the arms and backs of taller players trying to post him up... but any offensive positioning aggression warrants a foul.

That being said... not a great night for the Wolves. KAT didn't seem to have the same energy he's had. The guards were meh. Saric is easy to miss out there.

kekgeek1 wrote:

Camden wrote:

CoolBreeze44 wrote:Amazing how this rebuild never came close to peaking and then died. And it all happened in a matter of months under Thibs.

Wolves would be in a fine position right now if your boy Wiggins didn't suck so fucking much. But sure, blame Thibs.

Im with you, in the end it comes down to the development of Wiggins, and well he has gotten worse (only in wolves land). I don't think we are in any different shape if our team looks like.

Rubio
Lavine
Wiggins
Markannen
Towns

That is still a .500 at best team. In the end we haven't developed talent well. We have done really bad at using our assets for a long time. Payne for a 1st, Young for 30 KG games, etc.....

In the end we are here because our young guys weren't good outside of Kat.

I just think it is funny that this board blamed Thibs so much and that we had so much talent and it was Thibs fault because of his coaching style. But Thibs has a .475 winning % this year while Ryan has a winning % of .440.

So in the end talent wasnt there and if Im being realistic I don't think we could have done better than what Thibs did. He acquired a star and we were good with Butler. But Butler is an ass and him and Kat didn't get along, in the end it sucks but I will always respect that trade.

So short sighted to just blame everything on Wiggins lack of development! Haha.

kekgeek1 wrote:

Camden wrote:

CoolBreeze44 wrote:Amazing how this rebuild never came close to peaking and then died. And it all happened in a matter of months under Thibs.

Wolves would be in a fine position right now if your boy Wiggins didn't suck so fucking much. But sure, blame Thibs.

Im with you, in the end it comes down to the development of Wiggins, and well he has gotten worse (only in wolves land). I don't think we are in any different shape if our team looks like.

Rubio
Lavine
Wiggins
Markannen
Towns

That is still a .500 at best team. In the end we haven't developed talent well. We have done really bad at using our assets for a long time. Payne for a 1st, Young for 30 KG games, etc.....

In the end we are here because our young guys weren't good outside of Kat.

I just think it is funny that this board blamed Thibs so much and that we had so much talent and it was Thibs fault because of his coaching style. But Thibs has a .475 winning % this year while Ryan has a winning % of .440.

So in the end talent wasnt there and if Im being realistic I don't think we could have done better than what Thibs did. He acquired a star and we were good with Butler. But Butler is an ass and him and Kat didn't get along, in the end it sucks but I will always respect that trade.

I find it funny that you compare records when Saunders has been down at least one starter and sometimes more for his entire stretch as head coach.

This team would likely be sitting around the 8th spot, had Thibs not colossally fucked up the Butler situation. I wonder what would have happened if Thibs had trusted a few more players with minutes through out his tenure. Doesn't player development fall under the purview of the POBO/Head coach???

So does Thibs not know talent? Can't develop players? Can't coach talent? Which is it?

THibs is responsible for either signing or trading for 110 mil of the 121 mil in salaries on this team.

Once Butler was jettisoned, the Wolves were decent under Thibodeau at 15 - 12.

The problem is that Thibodeau was directly responsible for the previous 13 games when Butler was actively sabotaging the season. The Wolves were 4 - 9.

If Thibodeau dumped Butler prior to the season, the Wolves could very well be in the hunt. But going into the season with that fiasco over the team's collective head was grounds for his firing if nothing else.

As a coach... wins and losses... Thibodeau will be considered the Wolves 2nd best coach all-time. That's much more telling than impressive.

AbeVigodaLive wrote:Once Butler was jettisoned, the Wolves were decent under Thibodeau at 15 - 12.

The problem is that Thibodeau was directly responsible for the previous 13 games when Butler was actively sabotaging the season. The Wolves were 4 - 9.

If Thibodeau dumped Butler prior to the season, the Wolves could very well be in the hunt. But going into the season with that fiasco over the team's collective head was grounds for his firing if nothing else.

As a coach... wins and losses... Thibodeau will be considered the Wolves 2nd best coach all-time. That's much more telling than impressive.

Yeah the whole thing is a disappointment. After all the dust has settled the part that really bothers me is that so much of the decision to fire seemed based on Thib's personality according to the reporting I've read. That being said Thibs did lose a lot of games, but ultimately I feel like Roco and Saric is an upgrade to Markanen, Lavine, and Dunn. So there was good and bad in Thibs tenure, but I don't feel like it was a complete disaster on the surface. But certainly not a success and ultimately worth dismissal.

My biggest fear in all of this is that whoever is coming in next will have conditions attached to their hire (keep Ryan as coach, be a pleasant force in the community, etc.) I'm not very enthusiastic about another season of a new GM and a new coach. But it seems to be a regular occurrence with this team.

Andrew Wiggins:

- Out of 133 players with at least 500 FGA this season, he ranks 132nd in TS%.

- Out of 46 players with at least 500 FGA beyond 8 feet, he ranks 45th in FG%.

Him being an embarrassment of a shooter is why he's one of the most inefficient scorers in the league.

Camden0916 wrote:Andrew Wiggins:

- Out of 133 players with at least 500 FGA this season, he ranks 132nd in TS%.

- Out of 46 players with at least 500 FGA beyond 8 feet, he ranks 45th in FG%.

Him being an embarrassment of a shooter is why he's one of the most inefficient scorers in the league.

I saw that also. It's rough and by far the biggest reason why the wolves are where they are today. It's the lack of development from Wiggins. I mean he has gotten worse.