Minnesota Sports Forum

Mikkeman wrote:

monsterpile wrote:
To me this post reads that Biyombo is gonna be as good or better than Ben Wallace which I'm not sure it was your intent. I assume it's more for a comparison of where Biyombo COULD get to but that's a really good outlook. If that played out 20 million would be a bargain as Ben Wallace was one of the best defensive players I have seen in my lifetime (he could switch off on almost anyone and make their life difficult) and was as close as I may ever see to being a superstar that never scored 10ppg. Just sayin. :)

Yes, I probably chose my words little carelessly in comparison to Ben Wallace. I meant that Biyombo has plenty of potential and time to get same level than Wallace was. He is also already productive, so when some team signs him to big contract it is not just based on what he could potentially be but also what he already is.

I personally think that Biyombo won't ever be as good rebounder than Wallace was in his prime. But he will be probably clearly better offensive player. I can see him developing similar offensive game than DeAndre Jordan or Tyson Chandler. Since he has also been slowly improving his free throw shooting, he might be even playable in the end of games.

Agreed

longstrangetrip wrote:[

Monster, I don't know that it is preposterous to suggest Biyombo could approach Wallace as a player. Here are their comparative stats at age 23:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&y1=2016&p1=biyombi01&y2=1998&p2=wallabe01&p3=&p4=&p5=&p6=

Biyombo is better in almost every category...scoring, shooting, rebounding and blocks. Now, Biyombo had more NBA experience at 23 than Wallace, so let's compare the two in their respective 5th seasons:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?
request=1&sum=0&y1=2016&p1=biyombi01&y2=2001&p2=wallabe01&p3=&p4=&p5=&p6=

Even though Wallace is three years older in this comparison, the stats are comparable with Biyombo looking a little better.

Shot-blocking and altering centers are a rare breed in the NBA...that's why Biyombo is going to get paid big next year.

Mikkeman clarified his post above buy I'll reply to your post also because I get to talk about Ben Wallace more. Lol

Nope that's not what I said. I have no problem with comparing Biyombo to Ben Wallace statistically (nobody saw him becoming the player he was either) it's the EXPECTATION that he will get to be that type of player. Big Ben's value went pretty far beyond stats especially since he had to actually guard true centers like Shaq while also basically being able to do a lot of the stuff defensively that Draymond Green does now. I just don't think that's a fair EXPECTATION both because it's not fair to cheapen what Wallace was by basically saying that's so relatively easy to attain or that Biyombo has that high of a ceiling to attain. Maybe I just value Ben Wallace higher than most. He was a truly special player in my mind. I am not sure we have seen a defensive center as good as him since he was in his prime. Does that make sense?

I hope we sign the guy on the cheap with a team option for a second year that becomes the next Biyombo.

I still would like to give Christian Woods an opportunity here if the 76ers move on from him.

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Christian-Wood-7182/

SameOldNudityDrew wrote:Rumors Noah wants to leave Bulls. Not surprising. Would be a good fit here. If he could get mostly or even partway back to old form, he'd be a good pickup, IMO.

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/242018/Joakim-Noah-Telling-Teammates-Hes-Leaving-Bulls-Doesnt-Trust-Front-Office

Generally after 31/32 players steadily decline, they don't rebound into early prime years. If Noah costs me 10 and Biyombo 15, i'll take Biyombo knowing he'll at least keep his production level he's had the last 3 years and hoping he improves over the next 4.

khans2k5 wrote:I have no interest in Noah. We really can't afford another big who gets riddled with injuries. We need reliable bodies in the rotation. We already have a guy in Pek who is solid when healthy, but struggles to stay healthy. We really shouldn't be adding a second player like that to our roster.

Add KG to that mix. We have 2 Bigs in that position, adding a 3rd would be a mistake.

I have cooled on the Noah train. His injury history, age and declining production scare me coupled with the fact that I don't think he's taking a huge paycut to reunite with Thibs. If he wants to come here for 6M or less, I'd welcome him here, but I'm expecting he'll want 10M plus, and so there are better options. I'm definitely on the Cole Aldrich train as he does all the dirty work (he's an excellent screener, hustles, plays pretty good defense, blocks shots and grabs rebounds and shoots efficiently).

bleedspeed177 wrote:I hope we sign the guy on the cheap with a team option for a second year that becomes the next Biyombo.

Yep That's basically what I have been thinking. I'll go a step further. Why not lock up the guy for 3 years fairly cheap with a deal like Ed Davis got from the Blazers?

Wow. This went off the rails fast. Forget the $20m per year for a second. How do we get "younger better Ben Wallace who is totally going to keep getting better" to start ahead Jonas Friggin' Valanciunas? And can we please have a bunch of posts about how the Raptors are run by a bunch of idiots who for some reason hired Dwayne Casey instead of Kurt Rambis? And maybe a few about how they totally had Johnny Flynn rated higher than Derozan? Thanking you in advance. And who knows? Maybe TOR signs Biyombo and MIN can "settle" for Valanciunas in a salary dump.

I never compared Wallace's PER to Biyomo's. I simply said that Biyombo's PER SPLIT (-.9) is very average. And I stand by that comment.

If a basketball team is good, it is because they played good basketball. You can play good basketball by either doing good things, or not letting your opponent do good things. You can't do neither of those things and still be good. Giving lots of money to a guy who really hasn't because you think he will is not bright. And simply saying that a move is not the least brightest doesn't then make it bright.

Can you win a champioship with Biyombo as your 3rd best post? Well, since TOR is 6 games away, I am going to say yes. Can you win with him as a starter? If you have 4 absolute studs surrounding him, I'm sure you can. But if you are paying him $20m, and you have to pay the others $25m, thats a $120m starting lineup for a team that doesn't even draw as well as The Wild. Is that really going to happen?

Mikkeman wrote:

JasonIsDaMan wrote:

SameOldNudityDrew wrote:Rumors Noah wants to leave Bulls. Not surprising. Would be a good fit here. If he could get mostly or even partway back to old form, he'd be a good pickup, IMO.

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/242018/Joakim-Noah-Telling-Teammates-Hes-Leaving-Bulls-Doesnt-Trust-Front-Office

Would be a GREAT fit in MIN. Don't overpay, save the biggest deal for Gasol, but great fit.

Why you would want Noah even tough his PER splits are pretty awful (-3.3) and it seems that his game is diminishing rapidly. Last year he still had -0.5 PER splits and year before that +5.9. It is not probable that he would be able to turn that trend. In top of that he is injury prone.

I would want him at the propper price, and I would chose Gasol over him.

"Prone" is a strong word. He has played 64 or more games in 7 of 9 seasons. Last year was a bad year, no argument. But he has a track record, so why would he not be able to "turn that trend"?

And why would you call me out and not the person who originally posted it? Did you agree until you found out I did?