Minnesota Sports Forum

A couple things on the last few posts. In fairness to Myles Turner I didn't pay close attention to all his injuries but it's possible if the Pacers were playing games that matter he may have been able to play a few games towards the end of the season. Regardless I wouldn't give up much for him since unfortunately it's hard to know if he will stay healthy. He could be extended and if Turner would be willing to be signed at a relatively cheap price maybe the Pacers do that because they could trade him later. I would not be surprised if they moved him this summer and they will get at least one worthwhile asset (first round pick) for him.

If either of Russell or Naz were moved I would assume we would get at least a rotation player back. Those guys are worthwhile players. Honestly I think even Okogie is a worthwhile player on the right team. He will probably sign the vet min somewhere to be a still relatively young energy defensive wing player and that would be fine for a team that needs depth there. The Wolves are super heavy on perimeter players it's the frontcourt they need more help.

Are we sure Nathan Knight isn't the next worthwhile big? The Wolves need to add another guy also and one of the things Miami has done well over the years is finding some vet guys that they kinda rehabbed and increased their value. Taurean Prince played well overall this season staying healthy. Good teams find ways to get worthwhile productive players from various means. I think the Wolves have shown some signs of being able to do this especially with Finch as the coach. We need another perimeter player to step up and we need to add at least one frontcourt player to the mix that has at least proven production even in a limited role. Maybe the Wolves success at finding worthwhile players in various ways is a bit of a mirage or Rosas was the guy that drove that but if it's remotely real we are in good shape. Hopefully we can avoid the mistakes Miami did for a few years overpaying solid players. I really want Prince to stay but even though I really like him I'm not sure I would give him full mid-level money.

I still think we should consider drafting Kofi Coburn in the 2nd round if we're just looking for a rebounding rim protector.

Today's NBA requires different lineups for different situations.

Koburn is a liability in switching situations but can absolutely hold the middle in a zone and can be an interior match-up nightmare when teams choose to go small on us

monsterpile wrote:A couple things on the last few posts. In fairness to Myles Turner I didn't pay close attention to all his injuries but it's possible if the Pacers were playing games that matter he may have been able to play a few games towards the end of the season. Regardless I wouldn't give up much for him since unfortunately it's hard to know if he will stay healthy. He could be extended and if Turner would be willing to be signed at a relatively cheap price maybe the Pacers do that because they could trade him later. I would not be surprised if they moved him this summer and they will get at least one worthwhile asset (first round pick) for him.

If either of Russell or Naz were moved I would assume we would get at least a rotation player back. Those guys are worthwhile players. Honestly I think even Okogie is a worthwhile player on the right team. He will probably sign the vet min somewhere to be a still relatively young energy defensive wing player and that would be fine for a team that needs depth there. The Wolves are super heavy on perimeter players it's the frontcourt they need more help.

Are we sure Nathan Knight isn't the next worthwhile big? The Wolves need to add another guy also and one of the things Miami has done well over the years is finding some vet guys that they kinda rehabbed and increased their value. Taurean Prince played well overall this season staying healthy. Good teams find ways to get worthwhile productive players from various means. I think the Wolves have shown some signs of being able to do this especially with Finch as the coach. We need another perimeter player to step up and we need to add at least one frontcourt player to the mix that has at least proven production even in a limited role. Maybe the Wolves success at finding worthwhile players in various ways is a bit of a mirage or Rosas was the guy that drove that but if it's remotely real we are in good shape. Hopefully we can avoid the mistakes Miami did for a few years overpaying solid players. I really want Prince to stay but even though I really like him I'm not sure I would give him full mid-level money.

I wouldn't give up a 1st-round pick for Myles. I'd consider swapping Beasley and and 2nd-round pick for him, but I'd even be reluctant to do that. He simply can't stay healthy. It's always one thing or another with him. I just don't see the need to give up valuable assets for another big who has trouble staying on the court in light of the quality bigs available as free agents.

I don't see Nathan Knight as an upgrade over Vando as our starting big next to KAT. He showed flashes, but nothing that puts him on par with Hartenstein or Jalen Smith, much less Nurkic.

I'd like to keep Prince, although his inability to stay healthy is an issue. We have Bird rights with him, so we won't have to use our MLE to re-sign him. Is he worth MLE-level money (i.e., $10M per year)? Hard to know what his market value will be. He came here on the tail end of a $13M per year deal. I don't see him getting that kind of money in the open market now. I'd put his value at no more than around $8M per year on a 3-4 year deal.

WildWolf2813 wrote:

Q-was-here wrote:Are

WildWolf2813 wrote:The team should really rely on scouting and unearth 2 more productive bigs. If the Miami Heat can find Yurtseven and Strus and Vincent, then why can't this team go back to trying to find more gems to round out the rotation?

Just because they got something out of Reid and McLaughlin doesn't mean it ends with them. They have to keep looking, especially with this team nearing the end of their deals with Reid and Nowell.


I'm gonna wave the Petr Cornelie flag.

17.8 ppg
12.8 rpg
36.7% from 3 on 6 attempts a night
2.9 assists
a steal and a block per night


He's 6'11'', 220. Can we really act like we couldn't use someone with this resume? He's just blocked off by the bigs in Denver.

Well, we're not Miami. They have an unbelievably strong culture and continuity. They are basically the Spurs of the East.

So sure, we can certainly try to pick up guys like this to backfill the fringes of our roster (Okogie, Layman, etc.) and may be someone really pans out, but we are talking about trying to upgrade our starting lineup. Is Petr Cornelie really going to be Option A for us? We don't even know if he can beat Vando or Naz out for a spot in the rotation!

KG4Ever and others have created a pretty good list of names. There are a plethora of bigs out there that should be affordable AND proven.

Sounds like something to emulate. This team needs to keep finding those guys who can become rotation level players.

As of now, assuming we want Russell and Reid gone, we have, what, SEVEN rotation players? The depth of this team needs to be addressed. I mean we were praying from February on that we'd somehow get Greg Monroe back. This team can't rebound and you know it's gonna cost extra to find those guys, so how painful could it really be to add players who need opportunity, regardless of whether it pans out? Taurean Prince barely played in the postseason and we might have to give him MLE money to stay. We paid Jake Layman $10 mil for 102 games of nothing. We drafted Josh Okogie to forget how to make threes. I've said for years we have to make use of the G-League when we can. It's not to find a superstar, but if we can't assume a young player in G-League can't help our rebounding woes, then they're gonna pay so much more money to perhaps still not address rebounding, especially in this free agent class

Spots 7-17 on this roster are still up for grabs. If this FA class sucks, might as well pursue some guys who only need opportunity rather than more development.

One more thing: we would love someone like Isaiah Hartenstein. Well, what was Hartenstein before this past season? A guy with insane G-League stats who couldn't get tick in Denver, couldn't get much opportunity in Cleveland and couldn't sniff a job until early in training camp with the Clippers. I'm not saying Cornelie is the next Hartenstein, but wouldn't it be awesome to get that guy as he ascends as opposed to paying the full freight like we wanna do with Hartenstein this summer?

It's not one or the other in my mind. We should absolutely continue to find guys like JMac and Naz. But at the same time, we should look for free agents with proven track records who would likely be an upgrade over Vando. As for Hartenstein, I don't think he'd cost a lot. First, he's making the minimum now, and although he performed well for the Clippers, he didn't blow anyone away with his play. Second, the recent salaries of bigs around the League are generally low. Finally, there are a lot of free agent bigs on the market this summer, so supply and demand favors buyers (teams) over sellers (players).

If we let Layman and Okogie walk and bring back Prince for a reasonable salary, we'll have the full MLE - about $10M a year to start - to sign a big without hitting the luxury tax threshold.

lipoli390 wrote:

monsterpile wrote:A couple things on the last few posts. In fairness to Myles Turner I didn't pay close attention to all his injuries but it's possible if the Pacers were playing games that matter he may have been able to play a few games towards the end of the season. Regardless I wouldn't give up much for him since unfortunately it's hard to know if he will stay healthy. He could be extended and if Turner would be willing to be signed at a relatively cheap price maybe the Pacers do that because they could trade him later. I would not be surprised if they moved him this summer and they will get at least one worthwhile asset (first round pick) for him.

If either of Russell or Naz were moved I would assume we would get at least a rotation player back. Those guys are worthwhile players. Honestly I think even Okogie is a worthwhile player on the right team. He will probably sign the vet min somewhere to be a still relatively young energy defensive wing player and that would be fine for a team that needs depth there. The Wolves are super heavy on perimeter players it's the frontcourt they need more help.

Are we sure Nathan Knight isn't the next worthwhile big? The Wolves need to add another guy also and one of the things Miami has done well over the years is finding some vet guys that they kinda rehabbed and increased their value. Taurean Prince played well overall this season staying healthy. Good teams find ways to get worthwhile productive players from various means. I think the Wolves have shown some signs of being able to do this especially with Finch as the coach. We need another perimeter player to step up and we need to add at least one frontcourt player to the mix that has at least proven production even in a limited role. Maybe the Wolves success at finding worthwhile players in various ways is a bit of a mirage or Rosas was the guy that drove that but if it's remotely real we are in good shape. Hopefully we can avoid the mistakes Miami did for a few years overpaying solid players. I really want Prince to stay but even though I really like him I'm not sure I would give him full mid-level money.

I wouldn't give up a 1st-round pick for Myles. I'd consider swapping Beasley and and 2nd-round pick for him, but I'd even be reluctant to do that. He simply can't stay healthy. It's always one thing or another with him. I just don't see the need to give up valuable assets for another big who has trouble staying on the court in light of the quality bigs available as free agents.

I don't see Nathan Knight as an upgrade over Vando as our starting big next to KAT. He showed flashes, but nothing that puts him on par with Hartenstein or Jalen Smith, much less Nurkic.

I'd like to keep Prince, although his inability to stay healthy is an issue. We have Bird rights with him, so we won't have to use our MLE to re-sign him. Is he worth MLE-level money (i.e., $10M per year)? Hard to know what his market value will be. He came here on the tail end of a $13M per year deal. I don't see him getting that kind of money in the open market now. I'd put his value at no more than around $8M per year on a 3-4 year deal.

It's around a year later and while both of us valued Beasley much higher then and we talked about this swap a lot...I think we can agree right now for the Wolves he is a bench player that can be moved because Nowell (a guy both of us like a lot) stepped forward and looks ready to take on a bigger role. If we could swap Beasley (not exactly and iron man either) and a later 2nd for Turner I would do that. It balances out the roster and if it doesn't work out that's cool let Turner walk and keep looking. Beasley might be gone a year from now too. I think both of us agree that it's highly unlikely that the Pacers would do that deal. I mean if they could find someone who gave them value for Buddy in another deal then maybe it would make sense for them...maybe a lot of sense but yeah I don't see it right now. Both guys value has dropped in my mind although like ai have said before I think Beasley might be more of a winning player than he was. I just don't know how much value he has right now. I'm not trying to dump him but I'd do a deal that brings back a player that can actually play.

I'm in no way suggesting Knight is an upgrade from Vanderbilt. I'm suggesting he might be a guy that could end up being a useful NBA bench big. That's not a high bar but it's a player the Wolves could have used last season although Knight had a couple games he got the job done when his name was called. I absolutely agree he hasn't shown enough to put him over the players you mentioned. One thing Knight has over Vanderbilt is he is actually a threat to score and he also plays and actually has a different type of physicality. I'm not saying he is actually a big time physical presence but he plays with more of an edge and physicality than anyone else (well that's not quite fair to Towns) and ok that's not a high bar plus has the physical makeup (bigger Body) to actually do that. If you like guys like Tyler Cook or Alize Johnson, Knight is a bigger version of those guys. I'm not suggesting Knight is the answer more of thinking he could be what Hartenstein was for the Clippers (or maybe even what Naz is now) a quality rotation guy that can play some worthwhile minutes at times and help a decent amount of time. I'm look in at him as possible part of the pipeline while adding at least one other guy like a Hartenstein Smith or someone even more proven possibly a legit vet. Some of what we do with Knight may depend on what happens in the draft.

Unless some team thinks Prince is the answer to their need as a decent start at SF or top bench player it seems unlikely he gets much more than what you suggested PF around 8 million and that's kinda where I am at also. As I have mentioned previously I might be willing to pay him a little more on a 1 year deal just to be able to have lots of flexibility next offseason. I think my preference would be to get him signed to a deal that makes him an asset to the Wolves both on the floor and possibly in a deal. I kinda hate saying that about guys and their contracts but it's the reality of pro sports. I do think Prince as a vet and as a player may have had a bigger impact beyond the basic production on the court. He can be a role player but he also has some ability to handle the ball and make plays. I think his scoring ability was kinda nice. I doubt he is gonna shoot as well from 2 next year as this year but it's also possible he shoots better from 3 so yeah. I hope he sticks around but sometimes a team makes an offer and you gotta move on. It would be easier to let him go if they drafted a guy that was a SF that looked like he could play some minutes right away. I'm still saying they pick BPA though but just sayin.

Monster -- We're on the same page when it comes to Beasley. I might be OK swapping Beasley and a 2nd-rounder for Myles Turner. But I would not give up Beasley and our #19 pick for him for all the reasons I discussed. I see Myles playing 40-50 games at most and not helping us a lot on the boards. And he could cost $18M which would eat into the money we'd otherwise have to use the full MLE under the luxury tax threshold. I just don't see that as worth giving up meaningful assets. I like the idea of signing Jalen Smith or Hartenstein for less than $10M and not giving up any assets to get them. And I'd rather have Nurkic with his injury risks than Turner because Nurkic is a superb rebounder and I think we could sign him as a FA without giving up assets in a trade. I'm fine trading Beasley, but we don't have to trade him to upgrade our PF or C position next to KAT. We use him in another deal.

lipoli390 wrote:Monster -- We're on the same page when it comes to Beasley. I might be OK swapping Beasley and a 2nd-rounder for Myles Turner. But I would not give up Beasley and our #19 pick for him for all the reasons I discussed. I see Myles playing 40-50 games at most and not helping us a lot on the boards. And he could cost $18M which would eat into the money we'd otherwise have to use the full MLE under the luxury tax threshold. I just don't see that as worth giving up meaningful assets. I like the idea of signing Jalen Smith or Hartenstein for less than $10M and not giving up any assets to get them. And I'd rather have Nurkic with his injury risks than Turner because Nurkic is a superb rebounder and I think we could sign him as a FA without giving up assets in a trade. I'm fine trading Beasley, but we don't have to trade him to upgrade our PF or C position next to KAT. We use him in another deal.

Did Hartenstein really do enough this last year to propel him into mid-level territory? Personally I don't think he did. It was one game but when he played in the playoff game I was like...eh. If I wasn't sort of a fan of his I may have missed he was even in the game. Again it's 1 game I happened to see but yeah. I think he is more in the 5 million range and that's partly because Inthink teams are going to look at him as a pure center not a PF. I'm really not sure if Jalen Smith is a PF or if he is a center. I kinda doubt anyone is gonna pay much more than 5 million for him either. Maybe I'm wrong and those guys are worth it but I kinda have a hard time being like yes let's pay those guys to be the key pickup of the offseason. If I'm paying the full midlevel or close I want someone that's more proven.

Also as the draft becomes nearer I'll have to get something really good for #19 included in the package unless we also get a lower 1st round pick or higher 2nd like Orlando would be able to supply.

1 name I haven't seen mentioned is Richaun Holmes. I think he would be an excellent fit next to towns.
He has that nifty floater game that we saw Brandon Clarke burned us with in the playoffs. He can score around the basket and shoot respectably on the perimeter.
Defensively, he can guard centers and pf. He is definitely more mobile than Nurkic or Turner and I would say more mobile than KAT himself. I would prefer him over Turner and Nurkic as a target.
We only have beasley;s contract that would make a trade possible and I would be okay with a 1 on 1 swap.

worldK wrote:1 name I haven't seen mentioned is Richaun Holmes. I think he would be an excellent fit next to towns.
He has that nifty floater game that we saw Brandon Clarke burned us with in the playoffs. He can score around the basket and shoot respectably on the perimeter.
Defensively, he can guard centers and pf. He is definitely more mobile than Nurkic or Turner and I would say more mobile than KAT himself. I would prefer him over Turner and Nurkic as a target.
We only have beasley;s contract that would make a trade possible and I would be okay with a 1 on 1 swap.

Yup, good call. We've brought his name up a couple years now off and on.

Again, any GM worth his salt should be able to obtain a solid big via trade or free agency this summer. Add Holmes to the list of targets.