Minnesota Sports Forum

CoolBreeze44 wrote:I would counter that by saying Ricky's shot was just under developed. Not many NBA players have the hand eye coordination he does. It makes sense to me that with intensive attention to his shot/mechanics/repetition, he would improve more than some players.

He's in Year 4.

If it was underdeveloped, Glen Taylor deserves a lot more heat for the Mickey Mouse organization he oversees.

AbeVigodaLive wrote:
I think it will improve. It almost has to at this point, right?

But based on 2 months of "a lot of shooting?" Or, simply because it's different? You do realize that NBA players shoot hundreds of jumpers every day, right? It's not like guys like Bobby Hurley, Jacque Vaughn, Kevin Ollie didn't try to improve their jump shots either. EVERY player tries to get better. Heck, Tristan Thompson switched hands! They all work on faster releases, more arc, follow through, et al.

Just because WE want Rubio to be a better shooter doesn't mean it's going to be that easy. Yes. It could get better. But NBA history also tells us that if it was easy... every other poor shooter would have improved too.

To answer your question, no. My point was that he pretty much has a new shot, better mechanics, more arch, etc, etc and has now had around 2 months where he couldn't play or do most things on the court so he had even MORE time to shoot. The key being getting more and more reps with his new shot, improving that muscle memory and making it even more less likely to revert to old ways.

Say what you will about the organization. But anybody who shoots with his feet close together, without his right ahead of his left, with that slow release, and with no lift, definitely had an underdeveloped shot. It doesn't look that way now. Time will tell what if any improvement it yields.

CoolBreeze44 wrote:Say what you will about the organization. But anybody who shoots with his feet close together, without his right ahead of his left, with that slow release, and with no lift, definitely had an underdeveloped shot. It doesn't look that way now. Time will tell what if any improvement it yields.

That's fine. And what I'm saying is that a hundreds-of-million-dollar organization that allowed that to continue for 3+ seasons deserves A TON of criticism then.

Did they not notice it? Did they not care? Did Rubio resist change?

AbeVigodaLive wrote:

CoolBreeze44 wrote:Say what you will about the organization. But anybody who shoots with his feet close together, without his right ahead of his left, with that slow release, and with no lift, definitely had an underdeveloped shot. It doesn't look that way now. Time will tell what if any improvement it yields.

That's fine. And what I'm saying is that a hundreds-of-million-dollar organization that allowed that to continue for 3+ seasons deserves A TON of criticism then.

Did they not notice it? Did they not care? Did Rubio resist change?

There's definitely a story here, because the change in Ricky's shot is so noticeable. We'll never know who deserves the blame, but logic tells me that it's most likely Ricky himself. Say what you want about the Wolves' organization, and they certainly deserve blame for a lot of things, but an assortment of good basketball people have watched Ricky's pre-Pemberthy shot and recognized it was a problem...just as we did. And I would be astonished if they didn't work with Ricky on his shot or strongly recommend that he work with a shooting coach to revise his shot. But change is difficult for a guy who has had some success at the pro level for over 8 years, and it's logical to think Ricky would balk at such a dramatic change in his shot. Regardless of who is to blame for the tardiness in addressing this key flaw in his game, I'm delighted at the results, and think it will really enhance the Wolves' chance for success.

longstrangetrip wrote:
There's definitely a story here, because the change in Ricky's shot is so noticeable. We'll never know who deserves the blame, but logic tells me that it's most likely Ricky himself. Say what you want about the Wolves' organization, and they certainly deserve blame for a lot of things, but an assortment of good basketball people have watched Ricky's pre-Pemberthy shot and recognized it was a problem...just as we did. And I would be astonished if they didn't work with Ricky on his shot or strongly recommend that he work with a shooting coach to revise his shot. But change is difficult for a guy who has had some success at the pro level for over 8 years, and it's logical to think Ricky would balk at such a dramatic change in his shot. Regardless of who is to blame for the tardiness in addressing this key flaw in his game, I'm delighted at the results, and think it will really enhance the Wolves' chance for success.

I was thinking along those lines as well. I imagine it's even harder for a guy like Rubio who plays for his country during the summer and always seems to be doing something. I"d imagine it's pretty hard to change shot mechanics during a season and probably requires shutting down from playing competitively for a bit which is something I don't recall him doing much. I can't explain why there wasn't much change when he was down with the ACL. Maybe he was too focused on getting the knee back and stronger than ever? idk.

One thing to note. Ricky just has to go from a terrible shooter to an average one to make that much more of an impact. We are talking about a sub 40% shooter just needing to get to around 45% to be a great guard in this league. He doesn't have to become a sniper. He just needs an 18 footer to keep the defense honest. He's already shown some improvement in the two areas keeping him from being an all-star, the ability to hit a jump shot somewhat consistently and a more aggressive scorers mentality to get him up to around 15 PPG. If he can keep up those two areas of his game and continue to defend and dish out assists the way he can then he will be an all-star caliber player.

I have no doubt Ricky's shooting will improve from where it's been before this season. In fact, it had already improved as evidenced by his shooting percentages late last season and the beginning of this one. Before his ankle injury he was hitting 42% of his FG attempts. I expect even more improvement based on several things: (1) all the work he's put in with a top shootng coach last summer and during his ankle rehab; (2) the obvious substantial improvement in his shooting mechanics; (3) his career 80% free throw shooting; and (4) his exceptional hand-eye coordination and depth perception that we see reflected in his pinpoint passing.

I have to agree with Abe that the organization deserves criticism for failure to focus in a big way on improving Ricky's shooting, including hooking him up much sooner with a high quality shooting coach. I doubt Ricky resisted. Based on what I've heard and what we've all seen, Ricky has always been easy to coach and willing to do anything to improve and help the organization field a winning team. The more we learn and reflect the more we see the level of incompetence of the Kahn regime. It wasn't just squandered draft opportunities. It was Brandon Roy, the Batum debacle, trading a first round pick just to get rid of Wes Johnson...the list goes on.

Flip has made some mistakes and he'll make more I'm sure. Mistakes go with the territory. But he has clearly raised the competence level of this organization in a big way. As a result, we have much brighter days ahead of us as Wolves fans and Ricky's improved shooting is only part of that.

khans2k5 wrote:One thing to note. Ricky just has to go from a terrible shooter to an average one to make that much more of an impact. We are talking about a sub 40% shooter just needing to get to around 45% to be a great guard in this league. He doesn't have to become a sniper. He just needs an 18 footer to keep the defense honest. He's already shown some improvement in the two areas keeping him from being an all-star, the ability to hit a jump shot somewhat consistently and a more aggressive scorers mentality to get him up to around 15 PPG. If he can keep up those two areas of his game and continue to defend and dish out assists the way he can then he will be an all-star caliber player.

Agreed. He just needs to keep teams honest.

But, I think some might be underestimating how easy it can be done. Can you find many guys in NBA history who went 3 years (or even 2 years) as a really lousy shooter (sub 40%) before turning it around and shooting around 45%?

7% is a big jump.



[note: i know steve nash had a dreadful season shooting early in his career. but it was only one season off the bench and obviously an anomaly considering shooting was one of his strengths back to his college days.]

lipoli390 wrote:I have no doubt Ricky's shooting will improve from where it's been before this season. In fact, it had already improved as evidenced by his shooting percentages late last season and the beginning of this one. Before his ankle injury he as hitting 42% of his FG attempts. I expect even more improvement base on several things: (1) all the work he's put in with a top shootng coach last summer and during his ankle rehab; (2) the obvious substantial improvement in his shooting mechanics; (3) his career 80%free throw shooting; and (4) his exceptional hand-eye coordination and depth perception that we see reflected in his pinpoint passing.

I have to agree with Abe that the organization deserves criticism for failure to focus in a big way on improving Ricky's shooting, including hooking him up much sooner with a high quality shooting coach. I doubt Ricky resisted. Based on what I've heard and what we've all seen, Ricky has always been easy to coach and willing to do anything to improve and help the organization field a winning team. The more we learn and reflect the more we see the level of incompetence of the Kahn regime. It wasn't just squandered draft opportunities. It was Brandon Roy, the Batum debacle, trading a first round pick just to get rid of Wes Johnson...the list goes on.

Flip has made some mistakes and he'll make more I'm sure. Mistakes go with the territory. But he has clearly raised the competence level of this organization in a big way. As a result, we have much brighter days ahead of us as Wolves fans and Ricky's improved shooting is only part of that.

I agree with Lip about Saunders at least being competent.

I was consistent with my Kahn criticism almost from Day One. Even when at first I didn't like him for being a pretentious jerk who talked down to people and the guy who ate his ear wax when he didn't realize the tv camera was on him during a telecast.

I said he was the worst GM in recent NBA history. I stand by that and I think history will only cement it. Horrible hire by Taylor.


[note: as a bonus, the wolves have also hired arguably the two worst nba coaches of all time... sidney lowe and kurt rambis. so... there's that.]