Your 2018-2019 Timberwolves!!!

[Wolvesfan21]

I see our PG situation differently. I think Rose is now the starter, and provided good health will be for the foreseeable future. I see Teague seeing that handwriting and not opting in next year. So at least until we acquire another PG, we need Tyus as the backup. Thibs is stupid enough to play Rose 35 minutes per night, so he probably won't stay healthy. But I really see him being the starter until health takes him out of the lineup. A lineup of Rose, Wig, Covington, Saric, and Towns is pretty damn good in my opinion.

My problem with Rose is that he too often is looking for his own shot in traffic and not passing out to the open 3 point shooter. Then of course he throws up a wild shot looking for the foul that doesn't get called. I love Roses aggressiveness and hustle, he just isn't a good assist PG imo.

[TheFuture]

LST - Good job painting an optimistic picture of the post-Butler Wolves. Unfortunately, as you already ackowledged, your picture of the Wolves making the playoffs is a work of fantasy. The Wolves won't even satisfy your first criterion because Glen isn't going to fire Thibodeau. This deal was meant to satisfy Thibodeau's win-now mentality. Of course, with Thibodeau as head coach, I don't see this win-now approach resulting in enough wins for a playoff appearance this season. This organization should have focused the Butler deal on 3 years from now, not this season or even next.

How is this a win-now deal compared to keeping butler? Or trading for Richardson and Whiteside/whomever you said you wanted. This move is a great balance of remaining competitive going forward, getting younger, getting surefire NBA players, one of which is locked in to a great deal, while we retain rights on the other.

The three years from now approach was over with the initial Butler trade. Can't go back to that.

Not sure what else you desired/expected..

[TheFuture]

I am down right disgusted with he his O and D. I am tired of watching him running back to the baseline rather than picking up an opponent, which results in a wide open 3 in transition. I am tired of him forcing shots that he has no business taking. Phoenix was rumored to be offering up their 2nd rounder for him. I would jump at that right now.

2nd rounder for who? Tyus?

Why would you even consider that? We could do much worse for a backup pg.

[Lipoli390]

LST - Good job painting an optimistic picture of the post-Butler Wolves. Unfortunately, as you already ackowledged, your picture of the Wolves making the playoffs is a work of fantasy. The Wolves won't even satisfy your first criterion because Glen isn't going to fire Thibodeau. This deal was meant to satisfy Thibodeau's win-now mentality. Of course, with Thibodeau as head coach, I don't see this win-now approach resulting in enough wins for a playoff appearance this season. This organization should have focused the Butler deal on 3 years from now, not this season or even next.

How is this a win-now deal compared to keeping butler? Or trading for Richardson and Whiteside/whomever you said you wanted. This move is a great balance of remaining competitive going forward, getting younger, getting surefire NBA players, one of which is locked in to a great deal, while we retain rights on the other.

The three years from now approach was over with the initial Butler trade. Can't go back to that.

Not sure what else you desired/expected..

I wasn't comparing the deal to the alternative of keeping Butler. Obviously, keeping Butler was untenable. Trading Butler for Covington and Saric was a win-now alternative to the untenable alternative win-now strategy of keeping Butler.

Why is the trade primarily a win-now move? For three reasons. First, Covington is Butler's age with no further upside. Second, we get no draft picks or young prospects other than Saric. Third, the upside value of Saric is significantly limited in my view inasmuch as (1) he's a good, not great player, (2) given his level of athleticism, skill set and performance to date, he doesn't appear to have all-star level potential, and (3) even if he has high upside, the fact that he has only one year left on his contract after this season creates a significant risk that he won't stay long enough for the Wolves to benefit from that upside. So the upside part of this deal is limited entirely to one asset, Saric, and that asset has limited upside for the reasons I enumerated above. Even if you don't think this was primarily a win-now deal, I question the fit of these two players with our young cornerstones.

I hope I'm wrong, but I think this was a bad deal for the Wolves. Sadly I have the same feeling about this deal that I had about other decisions by this organization when they were made, including signing Darko, drafting Flynn instead of Curry or DeRozan, passing on McCollum, drafting Bazz instead of Giannis, hiring Thibodeau, drafting Dunn instead of Hield or Murray, drafting Patton instead of Collins or Anunoby, signing Teague instead of Darren Collison, etc. This has the same feel to it, although not quite as bad as how I felt about most of those past decisions I've listed without the benefit of hindsight. I understand there are those who disagree with me. That's fine. I sure hope they're right and I'm wrong.

But as Woj reported in the article I just posted, Thibodeau screwed this up and Glen Taylor allowed him to screw it up. It's the same old story for this franchise.

[mjs34]

I am down right disgusted with he his O and D. I am tired of watching him running back to the baseline rather than picking up an opponent, which results in a wide open 3 in transition. I am tired of him forcing shots that he has no business taking. Phoenix was rumored to be offering up their 2nd rounder for him. I would jump at that right now.

2nd rounder for who? Tyus?

Why would you even consider that? We could do much worse for a backup pg.

What is it that Tyus does above average? Nothing!

He is a RFA and his QO is over 3.5 mil, which I don't want to pay. We need to stop overvaluing our players because they have a nice smile or are hometown guys. We can pickup a backup in the summer for the minimum level. That is what lottery teams do.

[WildWolf2813]

I am down right disgusted with he his O and D. I am tired of watching him running back to the baseline rather than picking up an opponent, which results in a wide open 3 in transition. I am tired of him forcing shots that he has no business taking. Phoenix was rumored to be offering up their 2nd rounder for him. I would jump at that right now.

2nd rounder for who? Tyus?

Why would you even consider that? We could do much worse for a backup pg.

What is it that Tyus does above average? Nothing!

He is a RFA and his QO is over 3.5 mil, which I don't want to pay. We need to stop overvaluing our players because they have a nice smile or are hometown guys. We can pickup a backup in the summer for the minimum level. That is what lottery teams do.

Tyus wanted out at the same time Jimmy wanted out. I just think he'd rather go somewhere else where he isn't being lied to about his role.

That said he's been crap this season too.

I think fans are attached to Tyus because if they can't the hometown kid, who can they keep? At least that's the mentality.

[TheFuture]

I am down right disgusted with he his O and D. I am tired of watching him running back to the baseline rather than picking up an opponent, which results in a wide open 3 in transition. I am tired of him forcing shots that he has no business taking. Phoenix was rumored to be offering up their 2nd rounder for him. I would jump at that right now.

2nd rounder for who? Tyus?

Why would you even consider that? We could do much worse for a backup pg.

What is it that Tyus does above average? Nothing!

He is a RFA and his QO is over 3.5 mil, which I don't want to pay. We need to stop overvaluing our players because they have a nice smile or are hometown guys. We can pickup a backup in the summer for the minimum level. That is what lottery teams do.

Tyus wanted out at the same time Jimmy wanted out. I just think he'd rather go somewhere else where he isn't being lied to about his role.

That said he's been crap this season too.

I think fans are attached to Tyus because if they can't the hometown kid, who can they keep? At least that's the mentality.

We have played 1/8th of the season.

Tyus is not great, but he can play mistake free ball.

We could do worse.

A 2nd rounder is worth nothing.

[TheFuture]

LST - Good job painting an optimistic picture of the post-Butler Wolves. Unfortunately, as you already ackowledged, your picture of the Wolves making the playoffs is a work of fantasy. The Wolves won't even satisfy your first criterion because Glen isn't going to fire Thibodeau. This deal was meant to satisfy Thibodeau's win-now mentality. Of course, with Thibodeau as head coach, I don't see this win-now approach resulting in enough wins for a playoff appearance this season. This organization should have focused the Butler deal on 3 years from now, not this season or even next.

How is this a win-now deal compared to keeping butler? Or trading for Richardson and Whiteside/whomever you said you wanted. This move is a great balance of remaining competitive going forward, getting younger, getting surefire NBA players, one of which is locked in to a great deal, while we retain rights on the other.

The three years from now approach was over with the initial Butler trade. Can't go back to that.

Not sure what else you desired/expected..

I wasn't comparing the deal to the alternative of keeping Butler. Obviously, keeping Butler was untenable. Trading Butler for Covington and Saric was a win-now alternative to the untenable alternative win-now strategy of keeping Butler.

Why is the trade primarily a win-now move? For three reasons. First, Covington is Butler's age with no further upside. Second, we get no draft picks or young prospects other than Saric. Third, the upside value of Saric is significantly limited in my view inasmuch as (1) he's a good, not great player, (2) given his level of athleticism, skill set and performance to date, he doesn't appear to have all-star level potential, and (3) even if he has high upside, the fact that he has only one year left on his contract after this season creates a significant risk that he won't stay long enough for the Wolves to benefit from that upside. So the upside part of this deal is limited entirely to one asset, Saric, and that asset has limited upside for the reasons I enumerated above. Even if you don't think this was primarily a win-now deal, I question the fit of these two players with our young cornerstones.

I hope I'm wrong, but I think this was a bad deal for the Wolves. Sadly I have the same feeling about this deal that I had about other decisions by this organization when they were made, including signing Darko, drafting Flynn instead of Curry or DeRozan, passing on McCollum, drafting Bazz instead of Giannis, hiring Thibodeau, drafting Dunn instead of Hield or Murray, drafting Patton instead of Collins or Anunoby, signing Teague instead of Darren Collison, etc. This has the same feel to it, although not quite as bad as how I felt about most of those past decisions I've listed without the benefit of hindsight. I understand there are those who disagree with me. That's fine. I sure hope they're right and I'm wrong.

But as Woj reported in the article I just posted, Thibodeau screwed this up and Glen Taylor allowed him to screw it up. It's the same old story for this franchise.

Covington is younger than butler, and will cost around 30 mil less over the next 3-4 years,per year.

Saric isn't special, but he can play ball and spread the floor. He can leave, but only if we allow that to happen. We hold his rights.

Both players are a great fit for this team, as it allows us to truly see what we have in KAT and Wiggins. The ball is 100% in their court now. That needed to happen.

I agree we have made terrible decisions over the years, but this isnt one. Its better than both the reported Houston and Miami deals.

Hands were tied because of Butler. Be glad we made out decently.

[Monster]

I am down right disgusted with he his O and D. I am tired of watching him running back to the baseline rather than picking up an opponent, which results in a wide open 3 in transition. I am tired of him forcing shots that he has no business taking. Phoenix was rumored to be offering up their 2nd rounder for him. I would jump at that right now.

2nd rounder for who? Tyus?

Why would you even consider that? We could do much worse for a backup pg.

What is it that Tyus does above average? Nothing!

He is a RFA and his QO is over 3.5 mil, which I don't want to pay. We need to stop overvaluing our players because they have a nice smile or are hometown guys. We can pickup a backup in the summer for the minimum level. That is what lottery teams do.

Tyus wanted out at the same time Jimmy wanted out. I just think he'd rather go somewhere else where he isn't being lied to about his role.

That said he's been crap this season too.

I think fans are attached to Tyus because if they can't the hometown kid, who can they keep? At least that's the mentality.

We have played 1/8th of the season.

Tyus is not great, but he can play mistake free ball.

We could do worse.

A 2nd rounder is worth nothing.

I'm one of Tyus biggest fans and I also have recognized his flaws. The guy plays some PG and has increased his shot attempts and...nearly never turns the ball over 1 turnover per 36 minutes. The guy has put up impressive advanced stats. Are those real? Not as high as they make him but the idea that he sucks because he isn't shooting the ball well this year isn't fair either. He basically averages twice as many steals as turnovers...for a backup PG.

if Tyus isn't actually good then you let him go at the end of the season and that's fine. If he is just a backup we probably sign him for a decent offer since he is a RFA. If he is actually good then we can keep him. If all we are getting is a 2nd rounder (ok maybe the Suns 2nd rounder if they are gonna suck bad) I'm not up for that. The Local angle is nice but I personally think the guy knows how to play basketball he could be from Antarctica for all I care.

[longstrangetrip [enjin:6600564]]

I think Saric is a great potential compliment to KAT. He's a good passer, nice length, he fights. Thibs better fucking play him.

I think he will replace Tolliver in the rotation and split PF duties with Taj. I think Saric is a nice player, but defensively he and KAT are going to be pretty bad.

Yeah, those are my thoughts too. I sense Thibs is going to continue to start Taj at PF, and I don't necessarily disagree with that. You could hide Saric's defense next to Embiid, but not next to KAT. But still I like Dario's offensive game so much I still want him to get the 30+MPG he was getting in Philly. I see him as our first guy off the bench replacing Taj in the 1st quarter, and then staying in the game to get some minutes at SF.
Tolliver is the rotation loser in the new scheme and should only get minutes if there are injuries. And if Dario gets some wing minutes, Okogie might also lose some playing time. I don't have a problem with that as it gives the kid more time to learn the NBA game rather than just being thrown in there.