Minnesota Sports Forum

Camden wrote:

bleedspeed177 wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:I also don't see why Cleveland wants Martin because he and Irving would be an all-time bad defensive pairing at the guard spots. Anybody could get to the basket at will against those two. They would get obliterated and the offensive production wouldn't be high enough in my opinion to make up for the defensive shortcomings.

I think they would love to have him and help fix the culture they have. They have good defenders at Center and SF.

Thompson's not a poor defender either...

This is what I mean Kahns. You've seen CLE a whole TWO times this year, one of which was one of Blonde Ricky's better games, and you've decided you know them back and forth. I have looked everywhere I can on the net and have yet to find anyone ACTUALLY PAID to cover the NBA say he is "ALL TIME BAD" at defense.

Everyone on this board knows Martin is a liability defensively. Read this article of which the opening subject line is "Kyrie Irving's defense has been called out by reporters, coaches, and fans all season long. Is it really that bad?": http://www.fearthesword.com/2013/2/13/3983444/in-defense-of-kyrie-irvings-defense. I'll take their word over yours any day considering they actually cover the team. That's two bad defenders on a team ranked tied for 26th in the NBA in blocks per game (by the way, we are dead last in the category by a fairly significant margin given the fact that the differential between us and 29 is the same as between 11 and 29). So explain to me how that is not a recipe for disaster defensively for the team ranked 20th in defensive efficiency prior to adding the sieve that is Martin? You only have to watch them two times to know how bad they are defensively. When someone has to be hidden on defense, which Irving has been and Martin should be, what are you going to do when they are both on the court at the same time? All I have to do is watch analysis on ESPN and TNT to know these things. You act like I am making this stuff up when I actually pay attention to the league outside of MN. I watch games that don't involve MN. I pay attention to other situations around the league to see if there is a way the Wolves can benefit off of them. Meanwhile you keep posting attacks back at me with nothing to back it up, but your opinion. Get some documentation that doesn't say Irving and Martin are bad defenders and then maybe I'll care what you have to say.

Jared Dudley?

Apparently the Clippers feel they have enough wings and are looking for depth at the PF/C spot. Could a DC for Dudley swap work?

It's too bad we don't still have D Will. A D Will for Dudley trade would have been better for us than LRMAM. I don't think DC is enough to get Dudley. DC doesn't really push the needle for them and the salaries don't work for a straight up trade. It'd be cool if they would take LRMAM for Dudley if they thought LRMAM could be their defense against small ball 4's. Otherwise Ronny would be the only other guy I could imagine them wanting and the salaries don't work for a straight up with him either. Plus I like Ronny as a mentor for Dieng. I'd probably give them LRMAM and Ronny for Dudley and Bullock. It would give us some much needed shooting and we'd get a guy in Bullock who would be a long-term asset which everybody on here wants us to get from trades and hopefully he can be a SG who can stretch the floor behind Martin. I realize he has struggled this year, but just about every rookie in this class has struggled this year as expected. I liked him on draft night and think he is the kind of combo wing that could be useful to a playoff team in a few years once he gets the 3pt line down. Maybe they throw in BJ Mullens just so we get some depth at C back for this year (he is an expiring making less than a million). The I'd look to trade Corey and stick Dudley in the starting lineup to give us 3 shooters on the floor and hopefully open up the court a little more.

khans2k5 wrote:Everyone on this board knows Martin is a liability defensively. Read this article of which the opening subject line is "Kyrie Irving's defense has been called out by reporters, coaches, and fans all season long. Is it really that bad?": http://www.fearthesword.com/2013/2/13/3983444/in-defense-of-kyrie-irvings-defense. I'll take their word over yours any day considering they actually cover the team. That's two bad defenders on a team ranked tied for 26th in the NBA in blocks per game (by the way, we are dead last in the category by a fairly significant margin given the fact that the differential between us and 29 is the same as between 11 and 29). So explain to me how that is not a recipe for disaster defensively for the team ranked 20th in defensive efficiency prior to adding the sieve that is Martin? You only have to watch them two times to know how bad they are defensively. When someone has to be hidden on defense, which Irving has been and Martin should be, what are you going to do when they are both on the court at the same time? All I have to do is watch analysis on ESPN and TNT to know these things. You act like I am making this stuff up when I actually pay attention to the league outside of MN. I watch games that don't involve MN. I pay attention to other situations around the league to see if there is a way the Wolves can benefit off of them. Meanwhile you keep posting attacks back at me with nothing to back it up, but your opinion. Get some documentation that doesn't say Irving and Martin are bad defenders and then maybe I'll care what you have to say.

Just a few things
1. I hit the link you posted and got a 404 error. Which is ironic, because if someone asked me "describe Khans from the Wolves board in two words or less", 404 error sounds about right.

2. "Called into question" is, once again, NOT "ALL TIME BAD". I am going to try to give you an example you can understand (but I'm not confident): if you combine his conventional rating and his ESPN-conceived QBR, Christian Ponder was about the 25th best quarterback this year. Can you win a championship with that? Well, since they didn't, let's so no. But I don't care how many drunks at the Legion tell you different, he is not even the worst THIS YEAR, much less EVER. GET IT!?!?!

3. Really? So that's what I'm missing on the allegedly-entertaining TNT NBA show? Charles Barkley calling people "bad defenders"? Well, I guess I'll continue to watch anything else. Funny story about ESPN's "coverage" of CLE: When Flip first took the Wolves job, Zgoda asked him if he had been following the Wolves, and Flip said "They only had me follow 5 teams, and MIN wasn't one of them". GEE, YOU THINK CLEVELAND WAS!!?!??!

4. Boy, it must be tough choosing between all those nationally televised CLE games and doing homework and/or reading. I guess the picture is starting to come together.

All you have to do is google Kyring Irving Defense and the article I tried linking is the first result. Also, there is no metric for measuring all-time bad defensive pairings that I know of, so for all we know they could be if they played together. There is nothing out there that says either of them are even average defenders so to think that them playing together would result in some bad defense is not far fetched. You have nothing backing you up, you don't do any research before you post and you comment on things you know nothing about besides your own opinion. You said yourself that you don't research any of this stuff, so why are you arguing with someone who does. You don't have to watch every game to get knowledge on teams and their players. I actually know how to read and look for support for my arguments before I post my opinions so I don't look stupid like your posts. Flip was an analyst, not a writer. The people on TV don't have to know about every situation in the league, but the writers do the research and write about them all. Those are the people I look at for information on things like this. Any analyst on TNT or ESPN knows more about basketball than most of this board combined because 90% of them were professional basketball players at one point or another. To say Barkley isn't a good analyst is stupid. He may not be great at speaking english, but he does know what he is talking about. You are an ignorant poster who calls out other people who do the research, while you attack them with nothing to back you up but your opinion. If you don't have the knowledge on a situation or the time to research it, then don't bash other people who do put in that time and do the research for the benefit of the rest of this board.

Go after Mayo. Shouldn't cost anymore than Barea+filler.

Rudy Gay would have been perfect.

It's a shame Flip never explored the possibilty.

A Love-Pek-Gay trio would def get us to the playoffs.

Rudy Gay would have been perfect.

It's a shame Flip never explored the possibilty.

A Love-Pek-Gay trio would have def got us to the playoffs.

This is more of an off-season deal, but what about:

GS: Harrison Barnes, Mo Speights, MarShonn Brooks

MIN: Kevin Martin, Luc Mbah a Moute

So your first question is probably what do we do about SG now? We trade the best SG we've ever had after just one year? Hear me out. I would propose that we start Barnes at SF and Brewer at SG (until a better option comes along). Perimeter defense, rebounding and athleticism get a massive boost while shooting/scoring takes a bit of a hit. We get a 21-year old who hasn't touched his potential yet, a scoring big off the bench to replace Cunningham and a one year rental of Brooks. Disclaimer: Brooks doesn't have to be included in the deal, but for $1.2M on an expiring, why not? Think the added athleticism in the lineup would be huge for Ricky too in that we only have above the rim type plays from Corey this year. Barnes gives Rubio that high flying option. Also, Barnes is a better player than he's shown this season. I think the move to the bench really hurt him this year. He was big time for GS last year in the playoffs.

Golden State is all in right now. They made that extremely clear when they signed Iguodala this past off-season. How nice would it be, though, to have a scorer like Martin coming off the bench? Mbah a Moute's included in the deal to be their defensive stopper off the bench like they use Barnes and/or DGreen. I still believe Luc has good value to a playoff team, especially in a seven game series.

MIN:
PG: Rubio/Barea
SG: Brewer/Shved
SF: Barnes/Budinger
PF: Love/Speights
C: Pek/Turiaf

GS:
PG: Curry/Crawford (if re-signed)
SG: Thompson/Martin
SF: Iguodala/Green
PF: Lee/MaM
C: Bogut/Ezeli

Little tweaks could be made like Minnesota dealing Bud or Brewer and then signing Jodie Meeks. Just an idea.