Minnesota Sports Forum

How does trading down in a weak draft better our chances of getting the picks right?
Considering the Wolves inability to get the most out of it's players abilities shouldn't you just take the player that's the most talented already?

PorkChop wrote:How does trading down in a weak draft better our chances of getting the picks right?
Considering the Wolves inability to get the most out of it's players abilities shouldn't you just take the player that's the most talented already?

The fact that this is apparently a really flat draft without any surefire studs the Wolves can screw up at any position from #1 on down, so why pay the #1 salary when you can pay a lower salary for your screw up? ;)

CoolBreeze44 wrote:I really don't think Edwards will be the pick. I think Ball is more likely. And even though I would settle for Wiseman, I think if we keep the pick we will take Ball.

Cool - If we're predicting what the Wolves will do, then I'm honestly have no idea. Last year Rosas took Culver and traded up to get him. That move perplexes me and makes it even harder to gauge what he might do this the go-around.

Rosas said their philosophy is to take the best player available without regard to team need. He said it's a League of stars and that the more stars on your team the better. But then he also talked on our season ticket holder call about getting players who fit "their system." Put those comments together and perhaps we should expect him to take the best player available for the Wolves system. I'm still not sure who that would be and I'm not even sure what he means by "their system."

I'd say that Ball, Edwards and Wiseman are the three with the most obvious star potential. So if Rosas is all about talent and acquiring stars, then I'd say his targets will be Ball, Edwards and Wiseman. If by system, Rosas means positionless basketball at a fast pace with lots of 3-point shots (run and gun), then Edwards and Ball would be his two most likely targets at #1. I can't figure out at this point which one of those two the Wolves would be most inclined to take. Then again, the Wolves front office might be spooked by the motor issues associated with all three and take someone else.

My gut tells me the Wolves will trade down and take Toppin. He was the best offensive player in college basketball last season. He fits the fast-paced positionless style Rosas apparently wants to play. And analysts don't appear to associated motor issues with him the way they do Ball and Edwards. I wouldn't like the choice, but that's my tentative prediction at this point.

lipoli390 wrote:

CoolBreeze44 wrote:I really don't think Edwards will be the pick. I think Ball is more likely. And even though I would settle for Wiseman, I think if we keep the pick we will take Ball.

Cool - If we're predicting what the Wolves will do, then I'm honestly have no idea. Last year Rosas took Culver and traded up to get him. That move perplexes me and makes it even harder to gauge what he might do this the go-around.

Rosas said their philosophy is to take the best player available without regard to team need. He said it's a League of stars and that the more stars on your team the better. But then he also talked on our season ticket holder call about getting players who fit "their system." Put those comments together and perhaps we should expect him to take the best player available for the Wolves system. I'm still not sure who that would be and I'm not even sure what he means by "their system."

I'd say that Ball, Edwards and Wiseman are the three with the most obvious star potential. So if Rosas is all about talent and acquiring stars, then I'd say his targets will be Ball, Edwards and Wiseman. If by system, Rosas means positionless basketball at a fast pace with lots of 3-point shots (run and gun), then Edwards and Ball would be his two most likely targets at #1. I can't figure out at this point which one of those two the Wolves would be most inclined to take. Then again, the Wolves front office might be spooked by the motor issues associated with all three and take someone else.

My gut tells me the Wolves will trade down and take Toppin. He was the best offensive player in college basketball last season. He fits the fast-paced positionless style Rosas apparently wants to play. And analysts don't appear to associated motor issues with him the way they do Ball and Edwards. I wouldn't like the choice, but that's my tentative prediction at this point.

Lip, I think in the end they will like the ceiling with Ball as well as his drive to be the best player he can. Again it's not what I would do, just my gut feel on the way we could be leaning.

If the Wolves select LaMelo Ball, and if Ball ends up becoming what even the most optimistic fans of his think he'll be, then who here thinks this kid would hang around in Minnesota anyways? Not to say that we should think like that, but with a Ball family member we probably need to entertain that part of the equation. And yes, I'm aware of how difficult it is for players to leave a place after their first contract, but I put nothing past that family to go to whatever extremes to get what they want.

As I reflect on it, I'm thinking that Cool is probably right about the Wolves taking Ball if they keep the pick. And I agree with Cam that even if Ball becomes everything his proponents say he'll be, he'll want out of Minnesota and his family will create a fiasco to force a trade. That's another reason to pass on Ball. I know there are some who say the Wolves shouldn't consider a player's hostility to playing in Minnesota because of weather, market size or other factors, but it's a reality. That doesn't mean the Wolves should automatically pass on prospects who say they don't want to come here. But that needs to be a consideration. In this case, the Ball family makes things even more problematic.

Camden wrote:If the Wolves select LaMelo Ball, and if Ball ends up becoming what even the most optimistic fans of his think he'll be, then who here thinks this kid would hang around in Minnesota anyways? Not to say that we should think like that, but with a Ball family member we probably need to entertain that part of the equation. And yes, I'm aware of how difficult it is for players to leave a place after their first contract, but I put nothing past that family to go to whatever extremes to get what they want.

If you're gonna think that way, you might as well sell the pick.

If they're really against coming to Minnesota, they'll let that be known now knowing how this team reacts to stuff like that. Besides, if this team keeps losing, nobody will wanna stay unless they're a born loser. This is a franchise where THREE, count em, THREE players have had tenures of longer than 7 years with this franchise (KG, Mitchell, and West). We've had good guys, sketchy guys, talented guys, not so talented guys, hometown guys, guys from halfway across the globe. None of them have wound up staying. You just can't keep worrying about that. By bringing that baggage with them, everyone is gonna look at the Wolves and their situation and rightfully stay away.

WildWolf2813 wrote:

Camden wrote:If the Wolves select LaMelo Ball, and if Ball ends up becoming what even the most optimistic fans of his think he'll be, then who here thinks this kid would hang around in Minnesota anyways? Not to say that we should think like that, but with a Ball family member we probably need to entertain that part of the equation. And yes, I'm aware of how difficult it is for players to leave a place after their first contract, but I put nothing past that family to go to whatever extremes to get what they want.

If you're gonna think that way, you might as well sell the pick.

If they're really against coming to Minnesota, they'll let that be known now knowing how this team reacts to stuff like that. Besides, if this team keeps losing, nobody will wanna stay unless they're a born loser. This is a franchise where THREE, count em, THREE players have had tenures of longer than 7 years with this franchise (KG, Mitchell, and West). We've had good guys, sketchy guys, talented guys, not so talented guys, hometown guys, guys from halfway across the globe. None of them have wound up staying. You just can't keep worrying about that. By bringing that baggage with them, everyone is gonna look at the Wolves and their situation and rightfully stay away.

I never said it's the main component to any decision being made, but it's irresponsible to not factor in a prospect's potential loyalty in the future.

lipoli390 wrote:

WildWolf2813 wrote:I'm a trade back guy in this instance. The guys I really like in this draft are guys like Killian Hayes, Devin Vassell, Aaron Nesmith, Patrick Williams, even Tyrese Maxey (that Kentucky pedigree is as close as you can get to safe). I like those guys more than guys like Anthony Edwards and Deni Avidja. I'm just as invested in the 17th and 33rd picks and I don't see this star player becoming available and if that player becomes available later, depending on how this team performs, they'll get clingy like they always do.

Personally I'd operate as if Towns and Russell are both getting dealt in 2 years. I say that because I'm pessimistic over their pairing and I don't want this team to feel as if they need to pass on a really good player because they're not the best fit alongside either. I wanna have a building block just in case things don't go the way Rosas thinks they will.

If they have to stay at 1, I'd probably have to take Toppin, but I'm working those phones aggressively. A lot of good backup guards can be had at 17, which makes me really want Obi Toppin instead. He reminds me a lot of Antawn Jamison.

Wild - I agree that trading down is the best option. And although I think we have the personnel with some tweaks to make the playoffs, I'm not sure we can count on KAT and Russell to eventually make us a championship contender. Therefore, we need to continue to add young high-upside talent in this year's draft especially since we'll likely have no draft picks next year. I'm not high on Maxey, but I love Patrick Williams. I think Williams might have the highest upside of any player in this year's draft. He's my "Kawhi Leonard" in this draft. :). Unfortunately, it looks like Willams has climbed up on draft boards to the point were we probably can't get him at #17. So we'd have to maneuver to get him unless we just take him at #1, which I think would be an overreach. I'm also a big Vassell fan. I'm not sure about Hayes or Nesmith.

If it were up to me, I would not take Toppin. From what I've read and seen, he looks like a one-way player and that's the last thing this team needs. I think he'll be a force on the offensive end and fun to watch, but I think there are better choices for the Wolves like Okongwu, Vassell, Avdija, Haliburton and even Patrick Williams.

Lip- take a look at the list of Kentucky Wildcats in the league. There's maybe 28 or 29 of them. Maybe 3 or 4 of them haven't panned out. That Kentucky /Calipari pedigree is damn near bulletproof. A guy like Maxey is much more likely to succeed than fail.

Camden wrote:

WildWolf2813 wrote:

Camden wrote:If the Wolves select LaMelo Ball, and if Ball ends up becoming what even the most optimistic fans of his think he'll be, then who here thinks this kid would hang around in Minnesota anyways? Not to say that we should think like that, but with a Ball family member we probably need to entertain that part of the equation. And yes, I'm aware of how difficult it is for players to leave a place after their first contract, but I put nothing past that family to go to whatever extremes to get what they want.

If you're gonna think that way, you might as well sell the pick.

If they're really against coming to Minnesota, they'll let that be known now knowing how this team reacts to stuff like that. Besides, if this team keeps losing, nobody will wanna stay unless they're a born loser. This is a franchise where THREE, count em, THREE players have had tenures of longer than 7 years with this franchise (KG, Mitchell, and West). We've had good guys, sketchy guys, talented guys, not so talented guys, hometown guys, guys from halfway across the globe. None of them have wound up staying. You just can't keep worrying about that. By bringing that baggage with them, everyone is gonna look at the Wolves and their situation and rightfully stay away.

I never said it's the main component to any decision being made, but it's irresponsible to not factor in a prospect's potential loyalty in the future.

I can't worry about their potential loyalty. These players have agents who can try to angle them out of damn near any situation if they want to. They don't have to wait. You can't worry about people's feelings going forward. This franchise has done a masterful job of chasing people away who otherwise were willing to be here and build something. If this franchise does what they're supposed to do and the players do what they're supposed to do, they'll stick around. Not everybody is Stephon Marbury, and as I said in his documentary thread, what he did continues to haunt this team.