Minnesota Sports Forum

Comparing Wiggins to 3 ball dominant PG's just because they all went #1 totally seems like a valid means of comparison. They play similar roles on their teams so they should put up similar stats which to this point shows how disappointing Wiggins is at this point. That is what I am gathering from most of the comments on this thread at least and it's a poor argument to make. You can't compare him to Griffin either because Griffin had an extra year of college and lost his true rookie year to injury so he had 2 extra years of development over Wiggins. That leaves Davis who was similarly offensively challenged throughout his rookie campaign leading to his sub 14 PPG number. Also Davis was a once in a generational talent coming into the draft and nobody was saying that about Wiggins. AD was getting Duncan comparisons out of the gate. I don't remember Wiggins getting HOF level comparisons. Comparing guys because they went #1 makes no sense if none of them play even a remotely similar role to Wiggins. Does anybody have any comparisons for him from SF's outside of Lebron and Durant because I would venture to guess that out of that crop he would look to be right with the pack, not behind it and in some cases ahead of a good portion of that pack to this point in his career.

Can someone also tell me what Wiggins did offensively at Kansas to warrant expecting him to drop 18 a game in the pro's already? I just think most of your expectations were completely wrong just because he was a number 1 pick. If you followed the draft you would have seen everyone saying the defense will be there from day 1 (which has to be true on some level or Flip wouldn't have given him top wing defending duties right out of the gate) and the offense will come in 2-3 years. Not 20 something games. Lebron wanted Love for a reason. He didn't want to wait 2-3 years for Wiggins to develop and it sounds like most of you are expecting him to be great out of the gate while completely forgetting what the actual scouting report on the guy was coming out of college. Being drafted number 1 doesn't mean the holes in his game were going to just get better instantly. He's right on track with the scouting report so if you had him pegged for more because of a draft position then you're going to be disappointed. I'll go ahead and stick with the scouting report instead expecting him to be something he won't be for another year or 2.

Here you go Khans:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&y1=2015&p1=wiggian01&y2=2011&p2=georgpa01&y3=2015&p3=parkeja01&y4=2012&p4=leonaka01&y5=2013&p5=kiddgmi01&y6=2010&p6=derozde01

All are wings and all played only one or two years of college ball. Again, Wiggins is ranked at the bottom in terms of TS%, WS/48 and PER. And not a single one of these guys was a #1 pick.

Yes, we need to be patient. Yes, he could still be very good. But it's a fact - he is not tracking well against his predecessors.

Camden wrote:CJ fucking Miles.

CJ Miles ALWAYS burns us. What's with that guy? Ron Artest in his prime couldn't stop CJ Miles if Ron Ron were wearing a Wolves jersey!

But yeah, it's true that Wiggins' defense still has a ways to go.

Wiggin's per game avg: 30.7 min, 12.0 pts, 4.0 reb, 1.3 Assts 38% FG 36% 3P
Player B per game avg: 24.8 min, 13.9 pts, 5.4 reb, 1.0 Assts 47% FG 40% 3P
Player C per game avg: 25.4 min, 9.2 pts, 4.1 reb, 1.2 Assts 43% FG 36% 3P

All were recent highly rated SF's. Any guess who they are?

khans2k5 wrote:Comparing Wiggins to 3 ball dominant PG's just because they all went #1 totally seems like a valid means of comparison. They play similar roles on their teams so they should put up similar stats which to this point shows how disappointing Wiggins is at this point. That is what I am gathering from most of the comments on this thread at least and it's a poor argument to make. You can't compare him to Griffin either because Griffin had an extra year of college and lost his true rookie year to injury so he had 2 extra years of development over Wiggins. That leaves Davis who was similarly offensively challenged throughout his rookie campaign leading to his sub 14 PPG number. Also Davis was a once in a generational talent coming into the draft and nobody was saying that about Wiggins. AD was getting Duncan comparisons out of the gate. I don't remember Wiggins getting HOF level comparisons. Comparing guys because they went #1 makes no sense if none of them play even a remotely similar role to Wiggins. Does anybody have any comparisons for him from SF's outside of Lebron and Durant because I would venture to guess that out of that crop he would look to be right with the pack, not behind it and in some cases ahead of a good portion of that pack to this point in his career.

Can someone also tell me what Wiggins did offensively at Kansas to warrant expecting him to drop 18 a game in the pro's already? I just think most of your expectations were completely wrong just because he was a number 1 pick. If you followed the draft you would have seen everyone saying the defense will be there from day 1 (which has to be true on some level or Flip wouldn't have given him top wing defending duties right out of the gate) and the offense will come in 2-3 years. Not 20 something games. Lebron wanted Love for a reason. He didn't want to wait 2-3 years for Wiggins to develop and it sounds like most of you are expecting him to be great out of the gate while completely forgetting what the actual scouting report on the guy was coming out of college. Being drafted number 1 doesn't mean the holes in his game were going to just get better instantly. He's right on track with the scouting report so if you had him pegged for more because of a draft position then you're going to be disappointed. I'll go ahead and stick with the scouting report instead expecting him to be something he won't be for another year or 2.

The point is that the only reason the Wolves trade for Wiggins was palpable to Wolves fans as the team regressed for Massive Rebuild v.11.0 was because the #1 pick was included.

Fair or not... Saunders pulled off a coup by taking one of the league's most disappointing squads and the league's WORST team for the past decade and telling the hinging-on-apathetic-fanbase... we're rebuilding again! He was able to do this because he garnered the one thing we've never had before around here... a #1 pick.

That's pretty cool. It gave the franchise (Taylor) a pass for overseeing the worst franchise in the league for the past decade. Is it fair for Wiggins? Maybe not. But this is a business.

And there are two ways to look at it... yes, Wiggins is different. He's not a ball-dominant guard. Or, an imposing big man. Or, a once-in-a-generation player. Or, or, or. So he could turn recent history on its ear.

But the bottom line remains... with EVERY #1 pick in recent NBA history who became a star, they found ways to make an impact during their rookie seasons. Age be damned. Role be damned. Maybe in hindsight, Wiggins' draft class won't be all that great.

Maybe he's the anomaly (as we've said many many many times already) that he's changing NBA history. I just find it amusing that anybody who even breathes a hint of criticism toward Wiggins (or any fan favorite Wolves player) is shouted down time after time after time on this forum.

Heck, I remember getting lambasted over Michael Beasley and Rashad McCants on this forum for pointing out with stats and stuff that neither guy was anything special. It is what it is on a team-specific message board.

I'll end with the same version of what I and I think EVERYBODY else who has expressed concerns about Wiggins has written... it's too early to know for sure. And we're all hoping he ends up a star. He definitely has the athleticism, so we're going to give him time to get there.

But I don't see why that prevents us from speaking honestly about him being behind the curve right now.

We can use stats and comps to muck up or defend any of our agruments so I'll play along. The Kobe quote has been used on this thread so let's look at his stats.

1st year 7.5 ppg
2nd year 15.4 ppg

Yes, Kobe played fewer minutes than Wiggy but the point is he was brought along slowly. Flip hasn't had that luxury this year with the Wolves to do that with Wiggy. In the words of Aaron Rodgers, R-E-L-A-X.

We can use stats and comps to muck up or defend any of our agruments so I'll play along. The Kobe quote has been used on this thread so let's look at his stats.

1st year 7.5 ppg
2nd year 15.4 ppg

Yes, Kobe played fewer minutes than Wiggy but the point is he was brought along slowly. Flip hasn't had that luxury this year with the Wolves to do that with Wiggy. In the words of Aaron Rodgers, R-E-L-A-X.

BizarroJerry wrote:We can use stats and comps to muck up or defend any of our agruments so I'll play along. The Kobe quote has been used on this thread so let's look at his stats.

1st year 7.5 ppg
2nd year 15.4 ppg

Yes, Kobe played fewer minutes than Wiggy but the point is he was brought along slowly. Flip hasn't had that luxury this year with the Wolves to do that with Wiggy. In the words of Aaron Rodgers, R-E-L-A-X.

Yeah but this was the year we were going to win a championship.

thedoper wrote:

BizarroJerry wrote:We can use stats and comps to muck up or defend any of our agruments so I'll play along. The Kobe quote has been used on this thread so let's look at his stats.

1st year 7.5 ppg
2nd year 15.4 ppg

Yes, Kobe played fewer minutes than Wiggy but the point is he was brought along slowly. Flip hasn't had that luxury this year with the Wolves to do that with Wiggy. In the words of Aaron Rodgers, R-E-L-A-X.

Yeah but this was the year we were going to win a championship.

Also Kobe was straight out of highschool.

If it is too early to know for sure, why does every bad game he has spark a multiple page thread about why he isn't going to be a star? I have yet to read about a red flag that is actually worrisome 20 games into his career. He has already put together a couple very good games. If we get to the end of the year and he slumps the rest of the way then it is a red flag. Not showing enough dominating performances to this point to signify his future potential is all opinion. I've seen enough to not be worried or question him yet. Obviously a lot of you haven't and that is why these threads pop up weekly. All I can say is at this point is it is beating a dead horse until the All-Star break minimum. If you read the article that was posted earlier it said his previous 4 games before his recent slump, he averaged 18 PPG. That is on par with a lot of guys mentioned in this thread so he has it, it just hasn't had the frequency yet most of you seem to have expected.