Minnesota Sports Forum

Why is everyone so fixated on Drummond? I am extremely skeptical that Detroit would part with him.

Camden wrote:

Hicks123 wrote:

kekgeek1 wrote:I agree with Cam in this argument, I hate having players like Drummond who can't make a free throw to save their lives. I can't see a guy who is in our core being a guy who makes less than 40% of his FT attempts

I agree as well....but wait a second here. So Drummond can't improve his FT% at 21, but Rubio is going to become both a better shooter and scorer at the age of 24 with like 8 professional seasons under his belt? Just trying to get some perspective here.

I truly get that particular argument. I do, really, but there's one major difference in situations and players.

Rubio seems to care about improving. There's effort being put forth. How much effort is Drummond putting forth? Shooting under 40% at the line tells me not very much effort. Zero progress at the line to date. Actually, and I'm not looking at the numbers, but I think he regressed this year in that area! So much for a strong work ethic. I've never seen someone that bad at the line actually get worse by putting a lot of time into it.

Cam, this is ridiculous, and I think you know it.

But if you say so, let's take a look at Rubio.
Rubio FG% year 1 - 36%
Rubio FG% year 4 - 37%

Rubio 3P% year 1 - 34%
Rubio 3P% year 4 - 30%

Rubio FT% year 1 - 80%
Rubio FT% year 4 - 80%

Rubio steals year 1 - 2.2
Rubio steals year 4 - 1.9

Rubio assists year 1 - 8.2
Rubio assists year 4 - 8.6 (I remember many on here saying he would be a 12+ assist guy by now)

Wow, this guy is a joke! In 4 years he has virtually stayed exactly the same or gotten worse in all categories listed! This is what we get over 4 years? Has this guy ever seen a gym? Or played basketball outside a game? Evidently not, or he would have drastically increased these numbers. Must not put forth the effort. Must not care.

But I also agree with other poster...I don't see Detroit dealing Drummond....it was just the scenario that was brought up.

Hicks123 wrote:

kekgeek1 wrote:I agree with Cam in this argument, I hate having players like Drummond who can't make a free throw to save their lives. I can't see a guy who is in our core being a guy who makes less than 40% of his FT attempts

I agree as well....but wait a second here. So Drummond can't improve his FT% at 21, but Rubio is going to become both a better shooter and scorer at the age of 24 with like 8 professional seasons under his belt? Just trying to get some perspective here.

Valid point once again I don't dislike Drummond, but at the end of the games the wolves would have 2 guys who are no threat to score on the court in Rubio and Drummond. Then he will have to get the max in a year when he is a RFA the year the cap going up so more money to Drummond. I will take my chances with towns or Okafor for 4 years of rookie salary then one year of Drummond on the rookie scale then the max.

Hicks123 wrote:

Camden wrote:

Hicks123 wrote:

kekgeek1 wrote:I agree with Cam in this argument, I hate having players like Drummond who can't make a free throw to save their lives. I can't see a guy who is in our core being a guy who makes less than 40% of his FT attempts

I agree as well....but wait a second here. So Drummond can't improve his FT% at 21, but Rubio is going to become both a better shooter and scorer at the age of 24 with like 8 professional seasons under his belt? Just trying to get some perspective here.

I truly get that particular argument. I do, really, but there's one major difference in situations and players.

Rubio seems to care about improving. There's effort being put forth. How much effort is Drummond putting forth? Shooting under 40% at the line tells me not very much effort. Zero progress at the line to date. Actually, and I'm not looking at the numbers, but I think he regressed this year in that area! So much for a strong work ethic. I've never seen someone that bad at the line actually get worse by putting a lot of time into it.

Cam, this is ridiculous, and I think you know it.

But if you say so, let's take a look at Rubio.
Rubio FG% year 1 - 36%
Rubio FG% year 4 - 37%

Rubio 3P% year 1 - 34%
Rubio 3P% year 4 - 30%

Rubio FT% year 1 - 80%
Rubio FT% year 4 - 80%

Rubio steals year 1 - 2.2
Rubio steals year 4 - 1.9

Rubio assists year 1 - 8.2
Rubio assists year 4 - 8.6 (I remember many on here saying he would be a 12+ assist guy by now)

Wow, this guy is a joke! In 4 years he has virtually stayed exactly the same or gotten worse in all categories listed! This is what we get over 4 years? Has this guy ever seen a gym? Or played basketball outside a game? Evidently not, or he would have drastically increased these numbers. Must not put forth the effort. Must not care.

But I also agree with other poster...I don't see Detroit dealing Drummond....it was just the scenario that was brought up.

I am with you I don't agree with Cam point at all. Even though I am on the side of the argument with him. That is not fair to Drummond.

I doubt Detroit would trade Drummond but if we had the opportunity to get him that would be fantastic. He'd be the defensive anchor we'd need.

I can't understand people's obsession with FT%. Yes they are important and if the team misses a lot they probably won't win but FT's are an attribute just like ball handling, rebounding, etc. We'd like everyone to be perfect but that's just not reality. Say we had someone like Drummond on our team, currently making 1.7 FT's per game at 39%, let's just say that's doubled to 78% he'd only be adding 1.7 points to the team. That means he makes one block or causes one missed layup and he's already doing better than his extra 1.7 points he's missing out on at the FT line. Do you guys really believe that having that huge defensive upgrade isn't worth 1 less made shot per game for our opponent?

Okay, sure, but the question wasn't Drummond vs our current team. It was Drummond vs Top overall pick. I'd rather have Towns.

TRKO wrote:Let's not overlook Drummond's ceiling too. He isn't done improving. He also has a floor much higher than both. I would take the 21 year old big doing it in the pros at a nice level over Okafor who doesn't play great defense and Towns who has been a part time college player.

The thing that bothers me in Drummond is that he has not improved during his first three years but actually got worse. Here are some key advanced stats:

12-13: TS% .578 on/off +3.9 PER: 21.6
13-14: TS% .599 on/off -0.7 PER: 22.6
14-15: TS% .499 on/off -2.2 PER: 20.3

Drummond offensive game has went from reliable level to almost Pek like bad and for a guy who is as big as Drummond, he seems to be pretty lost in defense since opponents are scoring more effectively when he is on the floor. Here are also some scoring averages against Detroit for different centers from this year:

Gortat: 18.0 pts 61.9 FG%
Pek: 23.0 pts 55.2 FG%
Valanciunas: 22.7 pts 70.7 FG%
Hibbert: 16.3 pts 62.5 FG%
Mason Plumlee: 15.0 pts 76.9 FG%

I remember that Dwight Howard was also pretty clueless in defense in beginning of his career but at least he was improving each season. Same stats for Dwight from three first seasons:

04-05: TS% .571 on/off -2.9 PER: 17.2
05-06: TS% .565 on/off +5.2 PER: 19.3
06-07: TS% .619 on/off +1.3 PER: 21.1

Last year I was thinking that Drummond might even be able surpass Dwight in future since he was clearly better than Dwight during same age but now it is starting to look unlikely.