Camden wrote:I don't want three rookies on the roster next year, but I do want Flip to use each pick to do something that helps the future of our basketball team. Whether that's drafting three rookies for next year, drafting two rookies and a Euro stash, drafting one guy for next year and two Euro stash players, or using both 2nds to trade up for someone. Make use of each asset. Selling them for cash is what losing teams do. Winning teams utilize every asset possible.
Cam -- I agree with you completely on this!!! You nailed it in your last two sentences: "Selling them for cash is what losing teams do. Winning teams utilize every asset possible". I've been disgusted with this organization's repeated squandering of assets for years. We have no reason to belive the organization is any better or smarter now, but we can still hope.
Camden wrote:I don't want three rookies on the roster next year, but I do want Flip to use each pick to do something that helps the future of our basketball team. Whether that's drafting three rookies for next year, drafting two rookies and a Euro stash, drafting one guy for next year and two Euro stash players, or using both 2nds to trade up for someone. Make use of each asset. Selling them for cash is what losing teams do. Winning teams utilize every asset possible.
Cam -- I agree with you completely on this!!! You nailed it in your last two sentences: "Selling them for cash is what losing teams do. Winning teams utilize every asset possible". I've been disgusted with this organization's repeated squandering of assets for years. We have no reason to belive the organization is any better or smarter now, but we can still hope.
Ok, cam and lip (and others)...you guys have turned me around on this issue of selling second round picks. I have been defending Glen and diminishing the importance of this, but your posts and this article changed my mind.
http://upsidemotor.com/2014/07/01/second-round-sell-outs-selling-nba-draft-picks-bad/
This article not only explains why selling picks is a bad move, but also shows what an outlier the wolves are in this practice...truly embarrassing to be the league leader in selling, especially in light of our terrible record the past decade. This needs to stop now.
Camden wrote:I don't want three rookies on the roster next year, but I do want Flip to use each pick to do something that helps the future of our basketball team. Whether that's drafting three rookies for next year, drafting two rookies and a Euro stash, drafting one guy for next year and two Euro stash players, or using both 2nds to trade up for someone. Make use of each asset. Selling them for cash is what losing teams do. Winning teams utilize every asset possible.
Cam -- I agree with you completely on this!!! You nailed it in your last two sentences: "Selling them for cash is what losing teams do. Winning teams utilize every asset possible". I've been disgusted with this organization's repeated squandering of assets for years. We have no reason to belive the organization is any better or smarter now, but we can still hope.
Ok, cam and lip (and others)...you guys have turned me around on this issue of selling second round picks. I have been defending Glen and diminishing the importance of this, but your posts and this article changed my mind.
http://upsidemotor.com/2014/07/01/second-round-sell-outs-selling-nba-draft-picks-bad/
This article not only explains why selling picks is a bad move, but also shows what an outlier the wolves are in this practice...truly embarrassing to be the league leader in selling, especially in light of our terrible record the past decade. This needs to stop now.
Its a good article. I would be a little curious to know the top team in terms of shear amount of 2nd round picks owned during the draft in that time period. It seems like the Wolves have had at least two 2nd rounders and at least a couple years 3 in that time period. I'm not totally excusing the selling of them but let's say the Wolves by far owned the most 2nd round picks in that time it would make selling look less bad. The bottom line continues to be finding talent and doing everything possible to build a team. Using those 2nd rounders have even more value now if you have your own d-league team because you can keep their rights while developing them which is something this writer could have mentioned to make his point even stronger. My biggest beef with Flip and Glen is not having a d-league franchise. It's only money and some logistics. Get it done. It should be in the works right now but I have heard nothing about it.
Most on this board (and in the world) are fairly certain Flip is going to select Towns with the first pick, so the real drama on Thursday night might be in the second round where we have #31 and #36. There are conflicting reports on whether Flip plans to keep both picks or whether we will have room (or want) three rookies on the roster. But having said that, there are many players slated to go in the second round who are quite intriguing. In other years, I haven't found much to get excited about after the first round, but this year is different. And we have seen how successful teams (e.g. the Spurs) successfully use later picks.
I'm bumping this thread to keep track of guys we like at 31 and 36, and I'm also reposting the 538.com rankings as a means to look for value. I'm a big fan of 538...remember, they used statistical analysis to forecast the Warriors would win the 2015 title last fall, and not many other pundits (maybe none?) were picking them.
Dakari Johnson: DX has him 39th, but 538 has him 6th! As Q has said so many times, the Wolves don't have a real center on their roster other than the oft-injured Pek, and Johnson is a real center who could contribute immediately. He had a difficult time getting on the court playing behind so many lottery picks his two years at Kentucky, but his 40 minute numbers of 15.7 PPG, 11.4 RPG and 2.3 BPG are solid. Plus, like Towns, he's a very high character guy.
Cliff Alexander: I've posted a lot about how undervalued he is. Slated to go 40th and ranked 16th by 538.
Christian Wood: 41st on DX, 17th in 538. Good stats and size...hard to figure out why his draft position is so low.
Michael Frazier: 37th on DX, 19th on 538. I remember his as a sweet-shooting SG his sophomore year at Florida, but I lost track of him last year because his team was under the radar. Cam, what's the story on him?
TJ McConnell: A PG who has been discussed a lot here who would be a nice back up for Rubio. I like Deion Wright even more as a backup PG, but he is projected to go before 31 in most mocks.
Another guy who is not ranked as highly on 538, but who Cam brought up a couple months ago as a potential 2nd round steal is Tyler Harvey, a SG from Eastern Washington who led the country in scoring while shooting 46/41/86. You can never have too many shooters, and even though Harvey played in a smaller conference, his numbers are even better when he played against tournament teams.
That's about as impressive a list of guys who should be available in the second round as I can remember. Last year, for instance, I was never very excited about GR3, a guy that many believed to be a steal in round 2. I'm hoping Flip drafts 2 of the guys talked about here and gives them a chance in Summer League to make the roster.
I want to see #31 and Bjelica packaged to get up as high as possible. Flip is throwing out the rhetoric that he doesn't think he can get in the top 18 with that package. I'm not so sure that isnt some smokescreening by him.
CoolBreeze44 wrote:I want to see #31 and Bjelica packaged to get up as high as possible. Flip is throwing out the rhetoric that he doesn't think he can get in the top 18 with that package. I'm not so sure that isnt some smokescreening by him.
CoolBreeze44 wrote:I want to see #31 and Bjelica packaged to get up as high as possible. Flip is throwing out the rhetoric that he doesn't think he can get in the top 18 with that package. I'm not so sure that isnt some smokescreening by him.
I get what you are saying but I'll throw this out there just for some discussion. Have we ever heard Flip talk or hint about trading Bjelica? I wasn't sure how Flip valued him but after his comments yesterday on the Zone I think he said enough I think Flip does think he is a useful player and can play which there seemed to be some evidence to the contrary before that. Flip was being coy so I am certainly not saying Flip isn't considering dealing him or really likes the guy alot or anything but Flip said he is going to be aggressive in looking to make the the better and Flip isn't looking to just go all young in the rebuild he is commited to having some vets. Bjelica is still going to be a rookie but he isn't a young guy and probably has some likeliness to help the team sooner than a draft pick. That may appeal to both Flip the GM and Flip the coach to keep him and have him on the team next year.
Of course there are a couple issues that keeps Bjelicia from being a no-brainer. Lots of options at Bjelica's position. Flip said he could play some SF which is crowded also in addition to PF. Money. Signing Bjelica could limit them from adding much of anything else in FA even if it's minor additions.
On the other hand as Flip laid out how Martin's contract will seem cheap in the future with the cap going up and so Bjelica making 5 million a year from now may seem like a lot less than it is right now. There are some moving parts (dealing a player or 2 might open up a spot or some salary options or add talent) on the Wolves and those 2nd rounders and Bjelica are obviously some of them and likely Bud is one too. A number of us wonder if Bennett is another guy that could be moved. When was the last time Flip mentioned Bennett's name? Maybe Flip liked Bjelica enough he thinks adding him to some deals is giving up too much to move up a few spots. Just speculating.
My speculation is that Flip is making the best guess on how far he can get up in the draft the real draft trade talk hasn't likely started yet or has just started the last couple days.
CoolBreeze44 wrote:I want to see #31 and Bjelica packaged to get up as high as possible. Flip is throwing out the rhetoric that he doesn't think he can get in the top 18 with that package. I'm not so sure that isnt some smokescreening by him.
Maybe, but I tend to agree with him. This draft seems exceptionally deep and flat to me, and someone you pick at 31 might easily turn out to be a better player than someone you pick at 18. Look at PF for instance. Cliff Alexander is projected to be a second rounder and Bobby Portis is slotted in the mid to upper teens. This makes sense based on their college experience, but not necessarily on their natural ability and upside. The separation isn't distinct enough for me to consider packaging, UNLESS Flip has enough knowledge of Bjelica that he knows he will never be a player for us. In that case, I would be happy to package one of our seconds and Bjelica for an earlier pick.
Otherwise, I would prefer Flip draft two players at 31 and 36 and evaluate them both along with Towns in Summer League, perhaps with Bjelica too...see if any or all of them can beat out Robbie Hummel or Justin Hamilton. If I'm counting correctly, we only have 11 players locked up for next year, assuming we sign KG, so there's actually room for Bjelica and all three draft picks. I understand 4 rookies is not an ideal situation, but if we stay healthy, 2-3 of them would be in street clothes anyway. Use all the picks, evaluate them during Summer League, and turn to free agency if it's clear a draft pick isn't going to cut it.
