TheGrey08 wrote:One thing I need to state. I agree that the Wolves need to keep Rubio regardless of the price, but shouldn't just accept whatever number his agent throws out. It's their job to try to get him for less than the max. I'm still hoping for 10-12 annually.
I agree, Grey. Ultimately, Flip will have to determine Rubio's market value. I don't think that will be very hard. I think Flip is plugged in enough to know what other organizations might ultimately be willing to pay Ricky. We can already get a sense of the market just looking at some other PG contracts. Apparently Avery Bradley is about to sign a 4-yr/$32 million deal. If he's worth $8 million a year, then I dare say that Ricky will command at least $12 million per year. Rondo is due about $12 million next season and he's no better than Ricky as a shooter/scorer and has attitude and repeating injury issues to boot. Tony Parker gets $12.5 million per year. Kyle Irving just got a 5-year/$90 million deal (that's the max deal averaging $18 million per year. Curry's only getting close to $10 million per year, but he's an aberration in that he signed his deal in the midst of chronic ankle problems that some were thinking might threaten his career. He took less on a long term deal for financial security in light of the circumstances.
Looking at the total market picture, it's hard to envision Ricky signing here for less than $12 million per year, especially when he's likely have opportunties to sign with much better teams with much better chances of winning.
Ugh.. yeah I forgot about that damn Bradley deal. They must be banking on some improvement from him.
I think most fans would be happy with 12. Here's to hoping Lowry accepts Toronto's rumored 4 yr 44 mill offer (which didn't mention whether it would include a 5th year or not).
Lip, TheGrey did a better job of saying what I was trying to say. I think Rubio is good for the team and we need to keep him so in the end we should pay him what it takes. That said I don't think he deserves 12.5 a year and I also don't think the market is saying he deserves it either, that's why I brought up Parker. I'd start at 10 and try to keep him as close to that number as possible.
Newsflash people. Ricky is a RFA. Teams like NY can sign him for whatever they want, but in the end the decision is ours to keep him. Stop talking like another team offering him a big deal means he is gone like we can't do anything about it. We control where he goes unless he opts into the QO, which I guarantee he wouldn't do if he had 4 or 5 for 50 on the table which is very possible. In the end the other teams can offer what they want, but we control his destiny so stop acting like it is the end of the world if another team gives him a big offer. If Love is gone you have nobody else to pay anyway, so why do you care if he makes a couple million more a year to keep a good player on your team who makes the team watchable? Welcome to restricted free agency where the other teams can't do anything about it. Market size and quality of team have no effect on the deal because he doesn't have the final say anyway.
zigzag22 wrote:This debate on paying Rubio is very similar to the debate about whether or not to pay a QB in the NFL. Is Rubio worth some of these max numbers? Probably not, but if you lose him what do we have left? Like, seriously we put our heart and soul into getting Rubio over here and waiting, at this point there is nothing wrong with overpaying a player to stay here for another half decade.
Also, the NBA is on the verge of negotiating a brand new TV deal, and that is going to increase the salary cap significantly over the next few years. Think of that increase in the salary cap as a little extra gravy that we can give to Rubio. Because like I said, without him we are essentially a cold slate with zero future.
Good analogy zigzag, and I agree, and if Rubio improves his shooting, $12 mil will be a steal.
The Rage Monster wrote:I'm a huge Rubio fan so from the standpoint of wanting to keep to watch him play I'd pay him what we need to in order to keep him. However, from the standpoint of paying him what he deserves there is no way he has earned a 4 year $50 million contract. As far as the market goes, Parker makes that much per year and Rubio just isn't the player Parker is.
Why doesn't a 23 year old Rubio deserve to make as much as a 32 year old Parker? Rubio is heading into the prime of his career and Parker's heading into the downside of his. We are paying for projected future production not the past.
To further Ricky's point, the Wolves aren't at a point where they need to figure out how to fit their star players under the cap, we're at the point where we need to make sure we retain the top players that we DO have. The Spurs are a bad comparison for the Wolves because the Spurs trio took less because they wanted to continue what they had built. If Rubio takes less, our front office hasn't yet given him any reason to think that by him taking less it'll make the team a contender.
khans2k5 wrote:Newsflash people. Ricky is a RFA. Teams like NY can sign him for whatever they want, but in the end the decision is ours to keep him. Stop talking like another team offering him a big deal means he is gone like we can't do anything about it. We control where he goes unless he opts into the QO, which I guarantee he wouldn't do if he had 4 or 5 for 50 on the table which is very possible. In the end the other teams can offer what they want, but we control his destiny so stop acting like it is the end of the world if another team gives him a big offer. If Love is gone you have nobody else to pay anyway, so why do you care if he makes a couple million more a year to keep a good player on your team who makes the team watchable? Welcome to restricted free agency where the other teams can't do anything about it. Market size and quality of team have no effect on the deal because he doesn't have the final say anyway.
Khans, what the Wolves SHOULD do is be fair to Rubio and he should be fair to the team as well. If we lowball him and he accepts the QO instead, then we're SOL and have noone to blame but ourselves. Best case if we lowball him? He loses trust in our front office and extends much the same way Love did, and then walks the moment he's ready for his next contract.
Nothing in my post should have signaled that I'm for lowballing him. If anything it was about him potentially making more than people would want because of another team trying to steal him from us. I personally would match anything because I see him as a building block and not just a role player and I think you sign building blocks to whatever it takes to keep them.
I don't think $12+ mil a year is lowballing him. I was simply making the statement that we shouldn't attempt to lowball him. While it should be a negotiation and Flip should be trying to save money, given the position of the team, we can't risk losing him.
Either way, I personally think this would be a good opportunity to use our 5 year option and lock him up before he improves further...because if he does, his salary will be much larger on his next deal because he'll have more years of tenure and $12 mil could be a steal in 4 years if he does improve and the cap increases.
Kahns and Hockey -- I agree completely with both of you. And yes, if the Wolves can't agree with Ricky on an extension by next summer, the Wolves can make him the QF, making him a RFA. That's the Blazers did with Batum and, when the Wolves tried to get him, Portland matched. This franchise is at a point where it can't afford to lose Ricky. So we either pay him now or pay him later. In either case, we'll have to pay him market value and I'm convinced his market value will be at least 4 years $50 million by this time next year. And in the meantime, the Wolves would face further uncertainty and distraction as the media hype grows on Rubio going to LA or New York. Flip needs to nip this in the bud and get an extension done ASAP. That's my view anyway.
