Minnesota Sports Forum

I would love to get peoples opinions on guys we feel that are projected to go after the lottery that look like solid picks.

I've spent a little time watching some video on Markkanen after Slim's posts. Here where I am on the guy.

1. Ok so his strength is shooting. First of all do you really believe the guy is a terrific shooter? watching video of him both shooting 3's and pull ups I think he can be a really good shooter. He looks more like a Gordon Hayward than a big when he is shooting. Now If you aren't convinced he si going to be a really good shooter...damn well then yikes becasue thats REALLY what he brings.

2. Can he do anything other than shoot? DX mentions he pretty much only drives Left if I remember right. I do think he has a good enough handle and is athletic enough plus he is pretty big that he can be more than just a guy that runs around or stand around and gets open for 3's. How good can he be there? idk. That's certainly up for discussion. Post game? next to zero. they showed teams switching PGs onto him and he couldn't take advantage seemingly having almost no clue what to do. I'm ok if he isn't a low post monster, but you can't let a college PG guard you if you are a 7' guy.

3. Physically regardless of how long his wingspan if the guy can really shoot the ball he will be a pretty nice player. he doesn't play strong though. he moves well enough offensively but he looks really overmatched defending when people come at him. He seems to put forth effort but man there were some possessions they highlights he just looked really bad whether it was guys driving or posting him up.

4. Which brings us to defense and rebounding. I don't see much to be encouraged about except he did make a number of hustle plays in some of the highlight reels I saw. Its not like the kid is lazy but he lacks awareness struggles physically and gets tossed around. Jordon Bell went past him one time basically like he was an orange cone.

5. Potential. So how much can this guy improve in other areas? idk Slim says the kid works hard. Thats good to hear. I just don't know how much to project this guy as it does feel like he has to do more than just rain jumpers on people. Its not fair to compare him to Kyle Wiltjer and Lauri has already had a nice season as a Freshman and is probably a longer overall player, but there are some similarities. Personally I'm still not a fan of picking Markkanen but I like him a little more now than before but I still would rather aim higher or something. If we ended up with him it would be easy to get excited about his shooting however and he is still young although he turns 20 in a few days so he isn't super young.

kekgeek1 wrote:

Q12543 wrote:

TeamRicky wrote:We need to draft the best "do shit" guy and not draft a shooting specialist. There are plenty of guys who were great shooters in college that were disappointments in the pros. Off the top of my head: Derrick Williams (shot over 50%), Adam Morrison, Jimmer Fredette, McDermott, Stauskas are some guys that were or have been flops.

Kawhi Leonard wasn't much of a shooter in college, but he was a really good do shit guy who improved his outside shooting in the pros. That's the route that I want to go.

Yup, agree once again Ricky (we must be wearing the same outfit......plaid, right?).

To be fair and I agree with you guys. But curry and klay Thompson where great shooters and they turned out fine.

And comparing Derrick Williams and Issac in college they both did the do shit stats. Derrick a few more rebs, same in Stls and asts and isaac a few more blocks. Both could put the ball on the ground and are both SF/PF tweeners one for height (Williams) and one for bulk (Issac).

I like Isaac a lot and don't like maarkann, but there are examples both ways to fit the narative we want

But it's not just about the narrative. There have actually been studies that correlate NCAA stats to NBA stats and they typically find that things like rebounds, assists, steals, turnovers, and blocks have the higher correlation than the shooting/scoring stats (with probably the exception of free throw percentage, which I think is pretty reliable).

Now of course that doesn't mean anything is certain, as we can find plenty of exceptions both ways. But the odds are simply better the "do shit" stats (or lack thereof) translate more reliably.

Edit: By the way, Dunn is the perfect example, as he was really damn good in the rebound, assists, steals, and blocks department - areas he was pretty good at in college too. But his shooting/scoring absolutely did not translate.

kekgeek1 wrote:

Q12543 wrote:

TeamRicky wrote:We need to draft the best "do shit" guy and not draft a shooting specialist. There are plenty of guys who were great shooters in college that were disappointments in the pros. Off the top of my head: Derrick Williams (shot over 50%), Adam Morrison, Jimmer Fredette, McDermott, Stauskas are some guys that were or have been flops.

Kawhi Leonard wasn't much of a shooter in college, but he was a really good do shit guy who improved his outside shooting in the pros. That's the route that I want to go.

Yup, agree once again Ricky (we must be wearing the same outfit......plaid, right?).

To be fair and I agree with you guys. But curry and klay Thompson where great shooters and they turned out fine.

And comparing Derrick Williams and Issac in college they both did the do shit stats. Derrick a few more rebs, same in Stls and asts and isaac a few more blocks. Both could put the ball on the ground and are both SF/PF tweeners one for height (Williams) and one for bulk (Issac).

I like Isaac a lot and don't like maarkann, but there are examples both ways to fit the narative we want

I don't think comparing Derrick Williams shooting to Markkanen is remotely fair. just watch both guys I'll give the shooting title to Lauri right now. It's not even close.

I don't think comparing do shit stats for Derrick Williams and Isaac makes sense either. In their freshman years in fewer minutes Isaac had around double the blocks, steals and assists AND had more rebounds. Plus Isaac was better form 3 and from the FT line. Its not like Williams exploded in those categories his 2nd year either. Q brought all that up at the time. especially blocks and steals were very meh for a guy so big an athletic.

monsterpile wrote:I've spent a little time watching some video on Markkanen after Slim's posts. Here where I am on the guy.

1. Ok so his strength is shooting. First of all do you really believe the guy is a terrific shooter? watching video of him both shooting 3's and pull ups I think he can be a really good shooter. He looks more like a Gordon Hayward than a big when he is shooting. Now If you aren't convinced he si going to be a really good shooter...damn well then yikes becasue thats REALLY what he brings.

2. Can he do anything other than shoot? DX mentions he pretty much only drives Left if I remember right. I do think he has a good enough handle and is athletic enough plus he is pretty big that he can be more than just a guy that runs around or stand around and gets open for 3's. How good can he be there? idk. That's certainly up for discussion. Post game? next to zero. they showed teams switching PGs onto him and he couldn't take advantage seemingly having almost no clue what to do. I'm ok if he isn't a low post monster, but you can't let a college PG guard you if you are a 7' guy.

3. Physically regardless of how long his wingspan if the guy can really shoot the ball he will be a pretty nice player. he doesn't play strong though. he moves well enough offensively but he looks really overmatched defending when people come at him. He seems to put forth effort but man there were some possessions they highlights he just looked really bad whether it was guys driving or posting him up.

4. Which brings us to defense and rebounding. I don't see much to be encouraged about except he did make a number of hustle plays in some of the highlight reels I saw. Its not like the kid is lazy but he lacks awareness struggles physically and gets tossed around. Jordon Bell went past him one time basically like he was an orange cone.

5. Potential. So how much can this guy improve in other areas? idk Slim says the kid works hard. Thats good to hear. I just don't know how much to project this guy as it does feel like he has to do more than just rain jumpers on people. Its not fair to compare him to Kyle Wiltjer and Lauri has already had a nice season as a Freshman and is probably a longer overall player, but there are some similarities. Personally I'm still not a fan of picking Markkanen but I like him a little more now than before but I still would rather aim higher or something. If we ended up with him it would be easy to get excited about his shooting however and he is still young although he turns 20 in a few days so he isn't super young.

Great share Monster! Totally agree

So Isaac was the only top prospect that I hadn't really seen much of and I don't know if it's recency bias but man it would be a dream scenario if he actually falls to 6, in fact I would have a hard time not taking him if we move up to 3 and Fultz and Jackson are gone

my mini big board at this point would probably be

1-Fultz
2-Jackson
3-Isaac
4-Markkanen
5-Ball

BloopOracle wrote:So Isaac was the only top prospect that I hadn't really seen much of and I don't know if it's recency bias but man it would be a dream scenario if he actually falls to 6, in fact I would have a hard time not taking him if we move up to 3 and Fultz and Jackson are gone

my mini big board at this point would probably be

1-Fultz
2-Jackson
3-Isaac
4-Markkanen
5-Ball

Bloop, our top 3 guys are similar. Our only difference is that I'd substitute Tatum for Markkanen.

Q12543 wrote:

TeamRicky wrote:We need to draft the best "do shit" guy and not draft a shooting specialist. There are plenty of guys who were great shooters in college that were disappointments in the pros. Off the top of my head: Derrick Williams (shot over 50%), Adam Morrison, Jimmer Fredette, McDermott, Stauskas are some guys that were or have been flops.

Kawhi Leonard wasn't much of a shooter in college, but he was a really good do shit guy who improved his outside shooting in the pros. That's the route that I want to go.

Yup, agree once again Ricky (we must be wearing the same outfit......plaid, right?).

I like Markkanen initialy but i have to admit the board has soured me on him. I like a lot of guys in this draft better now, including Collins.

By the way, plaid is my favorite color.

CoolBreeze44 wrote:

Q12543 wrote:

TeamRicky wrote:We need to draft the best "do shit" guy and not draft a shooting specialist. There are plenty of guys who were great shooters in college that were disappointments in the pros. Off the top of my head: Derrick Williams (shot over 50%), Adam Morrison, Jimmer Fredette, McDermott, Stauskas are some guys that were or have been flops.

Kawhi Leonard wasn't much of a shooter in college, but he was a really good do shit guy who improved his outside shooting in the pros. That's the route that I want to go.

Yup, agree once again Ricky (we must be wearing the same outfit......plaid, right?).

I like Markkanen initialy but i have to admit the board has soured me on him. I like a lot of guys in this draft better now, including Collins.

By the way, plaid is my favorite color.

I love plaid also. If so can remember I may use "plaid is my favorite color" because so do like it a lot and I have been stumped by that question for years. It's too relative.

bleedspeed177 wrote:I would love to get peoples opinions on guys we feel that are projected to go after the lottery that look like solid picks.

This is a good question. I'll bring up a guy nobody really has talked about. DX has him at #18 so I don't know if I would take him that high but Luke Kennard at some point is a good value. The guy can shoot and he can handle the ball and make plays to some extent. He seems like a guy that knows how to play.

I would be interested if anyone has some more fringe guys that are late 2nd round guys or maybe even undrafted guys they're there plus like to see here or just think will be successful. I think Frank Mason is gonna make a roster for somebody.