Around the League

[Monster]

I watched some of that Denver-Houston game last night. What an embarassment of riches Denver has in terms of depth. Their perimeter depth is ridiculous. Gary Harris and Jamal Murray out, no problem. Malik Beasley and Monte Morris are here to save the day. Beasley was picked 19th in 2016 and Morris was a 2nd rounder in 2017. In fact, among all their guard and wing talent, only Murray was a lottery pick (#7).

I'm jealous.

In the entire 30 year draft history of the franchise, the Wolves have hit 2 home runs, KG and KAT. They've hit one triple, Kevin Love. I'd say they've hit two doubles with Wally Z and LaVine. The Dunn pick looks like a sacrifice fly in that it helped bring in Butler. I think the at-bats with Tyus and Okogie are still in progress. So that's 5 extra base hits and 1 sacrifice fly in 30 years. And actually, I think it's 5 total hits because I can't even see any singles in the Wolves draft history. In fact, I think it's fair to say that the rest of the 1st and 2nd round picks during in the Wolves history have been strikeouts or weak infield popups. Some of them like Ebi, Bazz and Patton have been 3-pitch strikeouts. Selling a 1st round pick is automatically a 3-pitch strikeout, but doing it with Gobert available means you hit your head with the bat on your 3rd swing and knocked yourself out.

I'm even higher on the Kevin Love move. If KAT is a HR... so is Love. Remember, conventional wisdom and projections had OJ Mayo there. The Wolves went against that and dropped down for Love and alleged sharpshooter Mike Miller. With KAT, they simply went chalk.

Miller promptly refused to shoot in MN for some inexplicable reason. But he was a good asset at the time.

Yes AND the Wolves got Mike Miller in that deal also PLUS they shed some bad salary and Even some moderately worthwhile vets in Jason collins and Brain Cardinal. Mike miller was part of the pancake to get a pick that netted Rubio (or an even better player with that pick or another one) that's a joke run deal Towns and KG are closer to grand slams (or maybe grand slams in games that are regular season matchups...lol) or 2-3 run homers.

[Lipoli390]

Good post, Lip. I'm not meaning to nitpick or be a wise ass with my addition to your comment, but I think Nikola Pekovic was good enough for a handful of years to be considered a "double" in your analogy -- or maybe a single and stolen base, I don't know. He was a solid, steadying force in the middle of the Wolves lineup that kept bodies off the glass and always made opposing bigs work. I can remember Amar'e Stoudemire talking about his matchup with Dwight Howard and a reporter asked him about going against the strongest center in the league and Stoudemire corrected him by saying Nikola Pekovic is the strongest big in the game. DeMarcus Cousins on a different occasion called him one of the five strongest centers in the game. Take their word for it, those guys were feeling the physicality from Pek night in and night out.

Lastly, Corey Brewer is probably a single when it's all said and done. I know, I'm digging deep here, but he's somehow stuck around in the league for over a decade. He's a legitimate NBA player and while he wasn't ever a core piece, he wasn't a strikeout either.

I accept your proposals as friendly amendments to my analogy. I forgot about both Pek and Corey. I'll give the Wolves a single for Pek. I'd give them a double if not for the fact that D'Andre Jordan was available with that pick and Pek's inability to stay healthy combined with his huge contract. I agree that the Wolves deserve credit for a solid single for Corey Brewer, although he was a pretty high lottery pick.

I was tempted to give the Wolves a home run for Kevin Love as Abe suggests, especially given the conventional wisdom and impetus to take Mayo. But I'm reserving home runs for picks who stay for an extended period without whining and begging to leave. So far that's just KG and KAT.

I realized I overlooked Marbury (technically we drafted Allen, but effectively we were drafting Marbury). He was really good for the short time he was here before flaming out and ending up in China. Considering we could have have Ray Allen, I have a hard time giving the Wolves an extra base hit for the Marbury pick, but I have to give them credit for a single. And I think the Wolves deserve a single for Ellington.

So my final tally for the Wolves 30-year draft history is the following:

- 5 extra base hits, including 2 home runs (KG & KAT), 1 triple (Love) and 2 doubles (Wally & Zach).

- 5 singles (Rubio, Pek, Brewer, Ellington & Marbury)

- 1 sacrifice fly (Dunn)

I looked back and counted all the Wolves 1st and 2nd round picks. If you include the 1st round pick we sold in 2013, the Wolves have had 74 draft picks in their 30-year history. With the one sacrifice fly (Dunn), the Wolves have 11 hits in 73 at bats - a .150 batting average with only 5 extra base hits. Is there any wonder why the Wolves have no championships, only 8 playoff appearances and first round exists in 7 of those 8 in 30 years? Like any other mid-market NBA team, if the Wolves don't draft well they won't do well. The Wolves draft history has been atrocious.

Among the Wolves draft whiffs, here's my hall of shame list:

1. Nudity Ebi
2. Randy Foye (because Brandon Roy was available)
3. Jonny Flynn (because Curry and DeRozan were available and we already drafted Ricky)
4. Bazz (because we could have drafted McCollum, or if no trade, Giannis)
5. Selling the 27th pick for cash when Gobert was available

[Coolbreeze44]

I'd like to get some thoughts on the Bucks chances in the East. They are past being a cute story or pleasant surprise. They are a legit threat to win the conference now. Only team in the league who is top 5 in offense and defense. They have the first prerequisite, a legitimate aircraft carrier in Giannis. They have a modern offense and make a bunch of three's even though they don't have particularly great shooters. They have borderline all stars in Brogdon and Bledsoe. And they have another good, emerging young piece in DJ Wilson. They have a lot of length and they compete at both ends. I'm guessing Philadelphia is going to get by Toronto, the Bucks will outlast Boston, and it will be the 6ers and Bucks for the conference. If that happens the CoolBreeze household is going to be on lockdown. The chance to knock my favorite son Jimmy Butler out of the playoffs would just be too good. What do you guys think?

[Monster]

Good post, Lip. I'm not meaning to nitpick or be a wise ass with my addition to your comment, but I think Nikola Pekovic was good enough for a handful of years to be considered a "double" in your analogy -- or maybe a single and stolen base, I don't know. He was a solid, steadying force in the middle of the Wolves lineup that kept bodies off the glass and always made opposing bigs work. I can remember Amar'e Stoudemire talking about his matchup with Dwight Howard and a reporter asked him about going against the strongest center in the league and Stoudemire corrected him by saying Nikola Pekovic is the strongest big in the game. DeMarcus Cousins on a different occasion called him one of the five strongest centers in the game. Take their word for it, those guys were feeling the physicality from Pek night in and night out.

Lastly, Corey Brewer is probably a single when it's all said and done. I know, I'm digging deep here, but he's somehow stuck around in the league for over a decade. He's a legitimate NBA player and while he wasn't ever a core piece, he wasn't a strikeout either.

I accept your proposals as friendly amendments to my analogy. I forgot about both Pek and Corey. I'll give the Wolves a single for Pek. I'd give them a double if not for the fact that D'Andre Jordan was available with that pick and Pek's inability to stay healthy combined with his huge contract. I agree that the Wolves deserve credit for a solid single for Corey Brewer, although he was a pretty high lottery pick.

I was tempted to give the Wolves a home run for Kevin Love as Abe suggests, especially given the conventional wisdom and impetus to take Mayo. But I'm reserving home runs for picks who stay for an extended period without whining and begging to leave. So far that's just KG and KAT.

I realized I overlooked Marbury (technically we drafted Allen, but effectively we were drafting Marbury). He was really good for the short time he was here before flaming out and ending up in China. Considering we could have have Ray Allen, I have a hard time giving the Wolves an extra base hit for the Marbury pick, but I have to give them credit for a single. And I think the Wolves deserve a single for Ellington.

So my final tally for the Wolves 30-year draft history is the following:

- 5 extra base hits, including 2 home runs (KG & KAT), 1 triple (Love) and 2 doubles (Wally & Zach).

- 5 singles (Rubio, Pek, Brewer, Ellington & Marbury)

- 1 sacrifice fly (Dunn)

I looked back and counted all the Wolves 1st and 2nd round picks. If you include the 1st round pick we sold in 2013, the Wolves have had 74 draft picks in their 30-year history. With the one sacrifice fly (Dunn), the Wolves have 11 hits in 73 at bats - a .150 batting average with only 5 extra base hits. Is there any wonder why the Wolves have no championships, only 8 playoff appearances and first round exists in 7 of those 8 in 30 years? Like any other mid-market NBA team, if the Wolves don't draft well they won't do well. The Wolves draft history has been atrocious.

Among the Wolves draft whiffs, here's my hall of shame list:

1. Nudity Ebi
2. Randy Foye (because Brandon Roy was available)
3. Jonny Flynn (because Curry and DeRozan were available and we already drafted Ricky)
4. Bazz (because we could have drafted McCollum, or if no trade, Giannis)
5. Selling the 27th pick for cash when Gobert was available

Wolves could have picked Pek and DeAndre Jordon we traded that Chambers pick for what turned into a pile of cash and a variety of 2nd round pick opportunities.

I think Bjelica is worth mentioning as a 2nd round pick that ended up being a worthwhile player even if it was a fairly short time....but really 3 years in a row as a Wolves player is probably kind of a long time.

I'll also mention that even though Flip passed on C.J. McCollum he was right about Trey Burke and a lot of basketball folks though it was basically criminal that he lasted that long. Burke I think willl have a nice career as an NBA backup but yeah anywho...

What kind of hit was Rasho?

[Lipoli390]

Good post, Lip. I'm not meaning to nitpick or be a wise ass with my addition to your comment, but I think Nikola Pekovic was good enough for a handful of years to be considered a "double" in your analogy -- or maybe a single and stolen base, I don't know. He was a solid, steadying force in the middle of the Wolves lineup that kept bodies off the glass and always made opposing bigs work. I can remember Amar'e Stoudemire talking about his matchup with Dwight Howard and a reporter asked him about going against the strongest center in the league and Stoudemire corrected him by saying Nikola Pekovic is the strongest big in the game. DeMarcus Cousins on a different occasion called him one of the five strongest centers in the game. Take their word for it, those guys were feeling the physicality from Pek night in and night out.

Lastly, Corey Brewer is probably a single when it's all said and done. I know, I'm digging deep here, but he's somehow stuck around in the league for over a decade. He's a legitimate NBA player and while he wasn't ever a core piece, he wasn't a strikeout either.

I accept your proposals as friendly amendments to my analogy. I forgot about both Pek and Corey. I'll give the Wolves a single for Pek. I'd give them a double if not for the fact that D'Andre Jordan was available with that pick and Pek's inability to stay healthy combined with his huge contract. I agree that the Wolves deserve credit for a solid single for Corey Brewer, although he was a pretty high lottery pick.

I was tempted to give the Wolves a home run for Kevin Love as Abe suggests, especially given the conventional wisdom and impetus to take Mayo. But I'm reserving home runs for picks who stay for an extended period without whining and begging to leave. So far that's just KG and KAT.

I realized I overlooked Marbury (technically we drafted Allen, but effectively we were drafting Marbury). He was really good for the short time he was here before flaming out and ending up in China. Considering we could have have Ray Allen, I have a hard time giving the Wolves an extra base hit for the Marbury pick, but I have to give them credit for a single. And I think the Wolves deserve a single for Ellington.

So my final tally for the Wolves 30-year draft history is the following:

- 5 extra base hits, including 2 home runs (KG & KAT), 1 triple (Love) and 2 doubles (Wally & Zach).

- 5 singles (Rubio, Pek, Brewer, Ellington & Marbury)

- 1 sacrifice fly (Dunn)

I looked back and counted all the Wolves 1st and 2nd round picks. If you include the 1st round pick we sold in 2013, the Wolves have had 74 draft picks in their 30-year history. With the one sacrifice fly (Dunn), the Wolves have 11 hits in 73 at bats - a .150 batting average with only 5 extra base hits. Is there any wonder why the Wolves have no championships, only 8 playoff appearances and first round exists in 7 of those 8 in 30 years? Like any other mid-market NBA team, if the Wolves don't draft well they won't do well. The Wolves draft history has been atrocious.

Among the Wolves draft whiffs, here's my hall of shame list:

1. Nudity Ebi
2. Randy Foye (because Brandon Roy was available)
3. Jonny Flynn (because Curry and DeRozan were available and we already drafted Ricky)
4. Bazz (because we could have drafted McCollum, or if no trade, Giannis)
5. Selling the 27th pick for cash when Gobert was available

Wolves could have picked Pek and DeAndre Jordon we traded that Chambers pick for what turned into a pile of cash and a variety of 2nd round pick opportunities.

I think Bjelica is worth mentioning as a 2nd round pick that ended up being a worthwhile player even if it was a fairly short time....but really 3 years in a row as a Wolves player is probably kind of a long time.

I'll also mention that even though Flip passed on C.J. McCollum he was right about Trey Burke and a lot of basketball folks though it was basically criminal that he lasted that long. Burke I think willl have a nice career as an NBA backup but yeah anywho...

What kind of hit was Rasho?

Rasho? 3-pitch strikeout. Lol

Might have to give David Kahn a hit for Belly. Wolves organizastion's batting average slowly creeping up towards .200. :)

By the way, just realized what spell check did to Ebi's first name in my hall of share. lol.

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

I've mentioned Monte Morris before. And I'm excited to see him play for 35 minutes to see him in action more. But the stats are ridiculously good. Check out that efficiency. It's off the charts GREAT.

10 ppg
3 reb
4 apg
49% fg
45% 3fg
0.7 TO !!!!!!

And he's essentially a rookie. Drafted #51 last season... and only played 3 games as noted.

Yeah, I watched him last night along with Beasley, Craig and Barton and it was like, WTF!? Why don't we ever come up aces like this!? Denver has just nailed it with multiple non-lotto picks, either as trade throw ins (Barton) or their own draft and development process.

[AbeVigodaLive]

Good post, Lip. I'm not meaning to nitpick or be a wise ass with my addition to your comment, but I think Nikola Pekovic was good enough for a handful of years to be considered a "double" in your analogy -- or maybe a single and stolen base, I don't know. He was a solid, steadying force in the middle of the Wolves lineup that kept bodies off the glass and always made opposing bigs work. I can remember Amar'e Stoudemire talking about his matchup with Dwight Howard and a reporter asked him about going against the strongest center in the league and Stoudemire corrected him by saying Nikola Pekovic is the strongest big in the game. DeMarcus Cousins on a different occasion called him one of the five strongest centers in the game. Take their word for it, those guys were feeling the physicality from Pek night in and night out.

Lastly, Corey Brewer is probably a single when it's all said and done. I know, I'm digging deep here, but he's somehow stuck around in the league for over a decade. He's a legitimate NBA player and while he wasn't ever a core piece, he wasn't a strikeout either.

I accept your proposals as friendly amendments to my analogy. I forgot about both Pek and Corey. I'll give the Wolves a single for Pek. I'd give them a double if not for the fact that D'Andre Jordan was available with that pick and Pek's inability to stay healthy combined with his huge contract. I agree that the Wolves deserve credit for a solid single for Corey Brewer, although he was a pretty high lottery pick.

I was tempted to give the Wolves a home run for Kevin Love as Abe suggests, especially given the conventional wisdom and impetus to take Mayo. But I'm reserving home runs for picks who stay for an extended period without whining and begging to leave. So far that's just KG and KAT.

I realized I overlooked Marbury (technically we drafted Allen, but effectively we were drafting Marbury). He was really good for the short time he was here before flaming out and ending up in China. Considering we could have have Ray Allen, I have a hard time giving the Wolves an extra base hit for the Marbury pick, but I have to give them credit for a single. And I think the Wolves deserve a single for Ellington.

So my final tally for the Wolves 30-year draft history is the following:

- 5 extra base hits, including 2 home runs (KG & KAT), 1 triple (Love) and 2 doubles (Wally & Zach).

- 5 singles (Rubio, Pek, Brewer, Ellington & Marbury)

- 1 sacrifice fly (Dunn)

I looked back and counted all the Wolves 1st and 2nd round picks. If you include the 1st round pick we sold in 2013, the Wolves have had 74 draft picks in their 30-year history. With the one sacrifice fly (Dunn), the Wolves have 11 hits in 73 at bats - a .150 batting average with only 5 extra base hits. Is there any wonder why the Wolves have no championships, only 8 playoff appearances and first round exists in 7 of those 8 in 30 years? Like any other mid-market NBA team, if the Wolves don't draft well they won't do well. The Wolves draft history has been atrocious.

Among the Wolves draft whiffs, here's my hall of shame list:

1. Nudity Ebi
2. Randy Foye (because Brandon Roy was available)
3. Jonny Flynn (because Curry and DeRozan were available and we already drafted Ricky)
4. Bazz (because we could have drafted McCollum, or if no trade, Giannis)
5. Selling the 27th pick for cash when Gobert was available

To be fair... KAT is in only in Year 4. And he was handed keys to the castle from the very beginning. Let's consider WHY Kevin Love might have been unhappy.

- His 1st coach basically forbid him from shooting 3 pointers.
- Love sat many games behind starter Jason Collins.... a guy who shot 31% ONLY on dunks and averaged 1.8 ppg.
- Kurt Rambis.
- Kevin Love actually started FEWER games in Year 2. At one point in the season, both Ryan Hollins + Darko Milicic were starting over him. READ THAT AGAIN!
- Year 3: Kevin Love was a starter! But benched in the very first game... and he got over 30 minutes only one time in the first 9 games of the season. He went for 23 points and 24 rebounds in that game. Still... nope... fluke minutes. Finally, Kurt Rambis' hand was forced by Love's 30/30 game vs. NY. Love won the rebounding title when he finally was unleashed (finished with 36 mpg)
- But wait... there's more. A lot more.
- Love was a 26/13 guy in Year 4... but the Wolves refused to give him a max contract.
- The team still hadn't come close to .500 yet...

Now imagine if KAT had to endure that in his first 4 seasons? I know we feel betrayed when players want to leave... but based on Love's first 4 seasons in MN... can anybody blame him (relatively speaking to other NBA players)...?

I don't think it's fair to use KAT's "happiness" against Love when KAT has started every game and was given a max contract (along with Wiggins who did A LOT less than Kevin Love.) Kevin Love was a HR pick -- regardless of what we think about him as a player or person.

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

I'd like to get some thoughts on the Bucks chances in the East. They are past being a cute story or pleasant surprise. They are a legit threat to win the conference now. Only team in the league who is top 5 in offense and defense. They have the first prerequisite, a legitimate aircraft carrier in Giannis. They have a modern offense and make a bunch of three's even though they don't have particularly great shooters. They have borderline all stars in Brogdon and Bledsoe. And they have another good, emerging young piece in DJ Wilson. They have a lot of length and they compete at both ends. I'm guessing Philadelphia is going to get by Toronto, the Bucks will outlast Boston, and it will be the 6ers and Bucks for the conference. If that happens the CoolBreeze household is going to be on lockdown. The chance to knock my favorite son Jimmy Butler out of the playoffs would just be too good. What do you guys think?

I don't have any strong opinion about their chances other than I'm really, really happy that a small market midwest franchise is having a ton of success right now. Good to see. And these guys didn't just luck into it. They have made calculated risks (e.g. Giannis) and savvy moves to get to this point. Their coaching hire was the latest example.

[Monster]

Good post, Lip. I'm not meaning to nitpick or be a wise ass with my addition to your comment, but I think Nikola Pekovic was good enough for a handful of years to be considered a "double" in your analogy -- or maybe a single and stolen base, I don't know. He was a solid, steadying force in the middle of the Wolves lineup that kept bodies off the glass and always made opposing bigs work. I can remember Amar'e Stoudemire talking about his matchup with Dwight Howard and a reporter asked him about going against the strongest center in the league and Stoudemire corrected him by saying Nikola Pekovic is the strongest big in the game. DeMarcus Cousins on a different occasion called him one of the five strongest centers in the game. Take their word for it, those guys were feeling the physicality from Pek night in and night out.

Lastly, Corey Brewer is probably a single when it's all said and done. I know, I'm digging deep here, but he's somehow stuck around in the league for over a decade. He's a legitimate NBA player and while he wasn't ever a core piece, he wasn't a strikeout either.

I accept your proposals as friendly amendments to my analogy. I forgot about both Pek and Corey. I'll give the Wolves a single for Pek. I'd give them a double if not for the fact that D'Andre Jordan was available with that pick and Pek's inability to stay healthy combined with his huge contract. I agree that the Wolves deserve credit for a solid single for Corey Brewer, although he was a pretty high lottery pick.

I was tempted to give the Wolves a home run for Kevin Love as Abe suggests, especially given the conventional wisdom and impetus to take Mayo. But I'm reserving home runs for picks who stay for an extended period without whining and begging to leave. So far that's just KG and KAT.

I realized I overlooked Marbury (technically we drafted Allen, but effectively we were drafting Marbury). He was really good for the short time he was here before flaming out and ending up in China. Considering we could have have Ray Allen, I have a hard time giving the Wolves an extra base hit for the Marbury pick, but I have to give them credit for a single. And I think the Wolves deserve a single for Ellington.

So my final tally for the Wolves 30-year draft history is the following:

- 5 extra base hits, including 2 home runs (KG & KAT), 1 triple (Love) and 2 doubles (Wally & Zach).

- 5 singles (Rubio, Pek, Brewer, Ellington & Marbury)

- 1 sacrifice fly (Dunn)

I looked back and counted all the Wolves 1st and 2nd round picks. If you include the 1st round pick we sold in 2013, the Wolves have had 74 draft picks in their 30-year history. With the one sacrifice fly (Dunn), the Wolves have 11 hits in 73 at bats - a .150 batting average with only 5 extra base hits. Is there any wonder why the Wolves have no championships, only 8 playoff appearances and first round exists in 7 of those 8 in 30 years? Like any other mid-market NBA team, if the Wolves don't draft well they won't do well. The Wolves draft history has been atrocious.

Among the Wolves draft whiffs, here's my hall of shame list:

1. Nudity Ebi
2. Randy Foye (because Brandon Roy was available)
3. Jonny Flynn (because Curry and DeRozan were available and we already drafted Ricky)
4. Bazz (because we could have drafted McCollum, or if no trade, Giannis)
5. Selling the 27th pick for cash when Gobert was available

Wolves could have picked Pek and DeAndre Jordon we traded that Chambers pick for what turned into a pile of cash and a variety of 2nd round pick opportunities.

I think Bjelica is worth mentioning as a 2nd round pick that ended up being a worthwhile player even if it was a fairly short time....but really 3 years in a row as a Wolves player is probably kind of a long time.

I'll also mention that even though Flip passed on C.J. McCollum he was right about Trey Burke and a lot of basketball folks though it was basically criminal that he lasted that long. Burke I think willl have a nice career as an NBA backup but yeah anywho...

What kind of hit was Rasho?

Rasho? 3-pitch strikeout. Lol

Might have to give David Kahn a hit for Belly. Wolves organizastion's batting average slowly creeping up towards .200. :)

By the way, just realized what spell check did to Ebi's first name in my hall of share. lol.

Oh autocorrect even got you on your comment on autocorrect.

Pretty harsh on Rasho who was a pretty solid starting center. It's not like they passed on any awesome players either in the first round after him.

To add to the hits and home runs anology you don't win with just hole runs. You need hits bunts walks getting guys on base and of course pitching!!! Lol you needs some walks some singles bunts (could even mean cutting loses of a guy you hoped for more) to win the game. Quite frankly what this organization often hasn't done enough of in the draft is getting a few singles out of lower picks. Heck at least Craig Smith helped for a while and was a fun player to watch. Honestly even in FA this team has been able to hit on some of those types of guys even in the Kahn era but drafting guys that can/could help just as rotation guys was a struggle. Hopefully Okogie and KBD can be part of the reason this team has some real depth and talent.

[BizarroJerry [enjin:6592520]]

If someone decides to post our last 25 draft picks, please let me know so I can grab a bottle of bourbon.