Minnesota Sports Forum

I'll worry about Ball leaving in 8 years when it would actually have any traction. Until then it's a poor mindset to rule someone out for something their future self may not even do. Towns had as much power as you could after Jimmy was shipped out and he's still here. These guys literally have nothing before that second contract and even then it's still very difficult to get out before the last year of that deal. What young superstars are forcing their ways off teams right now? So far none of them. It's the older guys like Kawhi and PG and Jimmy doing it when they have significantly more bargaining power on shorter deals. Devin Booker would be on this team tomorrow if young players had the power you guys speak of that Ball and his family have. They don't though so that's not even a consideration for me that he might not stay after 8 years. The team won't be here if we suck for 8 more years.

khans2k5 wrote:I'll worry about Ball leaving in 8 years when it would actually have any traction. Until then it's a poor mindset to rule someone out for something their future self may not even do. Towns had as much power as you could after Jimmy was shipped out and he's still here. These guys literally have nothing before that second contract and even then it's still very difficult to get out before the last year of that deal. What young superstars are forcing their ways off teams right now? So far none of them. It's the older guys like Kawhi and PG and Jimmy doing it when they have significantly more bargaining power on shorter deals. Devin Booker would be on this team tomorrow if young players had the power you guys speak of that Ball and his family have. They don't though so that's not even a consideration for me that he might not stay after 8 years. The team won't be here if we suck for 8 more years.

James Harden did it a decade ago and Kristaps Porzingis literally forced his way out of New York just over a year ago. It doesn't happen often, but to act like it's not possible is a farce. And the Ball family is an added element to this whole idea.

Camden wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:I'll worry about Ball leaving in 8 years when it would actually have any traction. Until then it's a poor mindset to rule someone out for something their future self may not even do. Towns had as much power as you could after Jimmy was shipped out and he's still here. These guys literally have nothing before that second contract and even then it's still very difficult to get out before the last year of that deal. What young superstars are forcing their ways off teams right now? So far none of them. It's the older guys like Kawhi and PG and Jimmy doing it when they have significantly more bargaining power on shorter deals. Devin Booker would be on this team tomorrow if young players had the power you guys speak of that Ball and his family have. They don't though so that's not even a consideration for me that he might not stay after 8 years. The team won't be here if we suck for 8 more years.

James Harden did it a decade ago and Kristaps Porzingis literally forced his way out of New York just over a year ago. It doesn't happen often, but to act like it's not possible is a farce. And the Ball family is an added element to this whole idea.

James Harden didn't force himself out of OKC. They literally weren't willing to go into the luxury tax to keep that team together. That has been brought up for the past decade on multiple podcasts talking about that atrocity of a trade and why OKC didn't have to do it, but still did it anyway. So the only example is the New York Knicks. The team that is a beacon of stability and proper asset management in the NBA. If you don't have faith in Rosas and this front office to not be the Knicks then we might as well just pack it up and move somewhere else because you literally have to be as bad as the Knicks to fuck up the management of a young star in this league.

khans2k5 wrote:

Camden wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:I'll worry about Ball leaving in 8 years when it would actually have any traction. Until then it's a poor mindset to rule someone out for something their future self may not even do. Towns had as much power as you could after Jimmy was shipped out and he's still here. These guys literally have nothing before that second contract and even then it's still very difficult to get out before the last year of that deal. What young superstars are forcing their ways off teams right now? So far none of them. It's the older guys like Kawhi and PG and Jimmy doing it when they have significantly more bargaining power on shorter deals. Devin Booker would be on this team tomorrow if young players had the power you guys speak of that Ball and his family have. They don't though so that's not even a consideration for me that he might not stay after 8 years. The team won't be here if we suck for 8 more years.

James Harden did it a decade ago and Kristaps Porzingis literally forced his way out of New York just over a year ago. It doesn't happen often, but to act like it's not possible is a farce. And the Ball family is an added element to this whole idea.

James Harden didn't force himself out of OKC. They literally weren't willing to go into the luxury tax to keep that team together. That has been brought up for the past decade on multiple podcasts talking about that atrocity of a trade and why OKC didn't have to do it, but still did it anyway. So the only example is the New York Knicks. The team that is a beacon of stability and proper asset management in the NBA. If you don't have faith in Rosas and this front office to not be the Knicks then we might as well just pack it up and move somewhere else because you literally have to be as bad as the Knicks to fuck up the management of a young star in this league.

and Kristaps wanted out because the Knicks didn't wanna fully guarantee a 5 year max to him (they wanted to give him the kind of contract Joel Embiid got from the Sixers). That and he was disillusioned with their direction. Had they committed to him as their franchise guy and not gone out chasing dreams, he'd still be there, because when he was in NY, they adored him.


As a Jets fan, I just saw how a team's dysfunction and mismanagement led to them getting rid of their best player 3 years after drafting him.

Draft Edwards. I don't want the Ball circus in town, Deni is an interesting prospect but too risky for 1st overall, Wiseman seems like a good player but goes against the grain for the modern NBA with KAT on the roster.

Trading for an established NBA player and a top 10 pick would be a good option too.

I think Edwards is another Oladipo, which would be a nice fit for the squad but Beasley would get screwed over.

Of course this would be the year the Wolves move up lol.

Still exciting though

God forbid the Wolves go against the trends and implement their own style of play. Make teams adjust to them for a change.

khans2k5 wrote:I'll worry about Ball leaving in 8 years when it would actually have any traction. Until then it's a poor mindset to rule someone out for something their future self may not even do. Towns had as much power as you could after Jimmy was shipped out and he's still here. These guys literally have nothing before that second contract and even then it's still very difficult to get out before the last year of that deal. What young superstars are forcing their ways off teams right now? So far none of them. It's the older guys like Kawhi and PG and Jimmy doing it when they have significantly more bargaining power on shorter deals. Devin Booker would be on this team tomorrow if young players had the power you guys speak of that Ball and his family have. They don't though so that's not even a consideration for me that he might not stay after 8 years. The team won't be here if we suck for 8 more years.

Here's my take on this issue. I would never forego drafting a player solely out of concern that he would prefer not to play for the Wolves or live in Minnesota. But I agree with Cam that it should be a factor for consideration in the mix with other factors. I'd give it some weight, but not controlling weight by any means. And the Ball family dynamic has to be considered as well.

Importantly, however, young players rarely reject playing anywhere because of where the team plays, i.e., market size, weather, etc. If they say they don't want a particular team to draft them or after being drafted soon express a desire to leave, it's almost always because of their view that the situation is not conducive to their development as a player. Curry's agent told Kahn he didn't want the Wolves to draft him, but it wasn't because he didn't want to be in Minnesota. Instead, it was because the Wolves had already drafted Rubio and Curry was adamant about playing PG. He was right. A key to his development into the superstar he has become was the opportunity to dominate the ball as the Warrior's sole PG. Billups wanted out because Flip chose to stay with Brandon as the Wolves starting PG and refused Billup's request for a commitment to give him a shot at the starting PG role. Marbury wanted out simply out of jealousy over KG's contract.

What does all this mean? It means that if the Wolves are inclined to draft Ball or Edwards, they have to consider the Beasley factor. The top pick in the draft typically expects to start. Ball and Edwards are both guards; yet the Wolves already have their starting PG as one of their two stars and they apparently want to re-sign Beasley. I just don't see Beasley re-signing, at least not long term, if he believes he'll have to compete with Ball or Edwards for a starting backcourt role next to Russell. At the same time, neither Ball nor Edwards would likely be happy coming here knowing that the Wolves have committed themselves to two young veteran guards they would have to play behind. We haven't talked about his, but I think drafting Edwards or Ball would mean passing on re-signing Beasley. I'm not sure I like that idea. It would certainly diminish the value of the Covington deal.

So what should the Wolves do? I think the Beasley factor is another reason for the Wolves to pass on both Ball and Edwards in favor of Wiseman, Okongwu, Avdija, or Vassell. And if the idea is to take the player with the highest upside, then Wiseman is the guy. I'd say his upside is equal to Ball's and Edward's, but he would be a better fit if the Wolves are inclined to re-sign Beasley. Of course, I have other misgivings about Ball and Edwards - their perimeter shooting, defense and competitiveness/motor. If Oladipo were in this draft instead of Edwards, I'd take Oladipo in a heartbeat regardless of the Beasley situation. If Ja Morant were in the draft instead of Ball, I'd take Morant in a heartbeat. But my misgivings about Ball and Edwards, in combination with the Beasley situation, creates a different calculus in my mind and adds further weight to my inclination to pass on both of them.

Camden wrote:God forbid the Wolves go against the trends and implement their own style of play. Make teams adjust to them for a change.

Your 100% correct and I've been saying the same thing for a long time. Problem is we hired a GM who has a singular focus on copying a style that the league has had a long time to counteract. Houston has had some limited success with it because they were at the leading edge. We won't have that advantage in our favor.

My issue with the Houston philosophy isn't the 3's and layups. That is obvious and highly successful way of playing offense. It's defensively that concerns me. You need some rim protection and rebounding. The Lakers are doing it successfully with two bigs at a time. Of course, AD and LeBron, yada yada they are superstars....

I just don't think you can have a great defense playing guys all 6-5 and under. That is concerning to me. Just not even considering KAT at the 4 is a concern.

Saying that if you could somehow add a Simmons for instance, I think the defense instantly gets much better. But guys like that are tough to get and will Philly even consider it?

CoolBreeze44 wrote:

Camden wrote:God forbid the Wolves go against the trends and implement their own style of play. Make teams adjust to them for a change.

Your 100% correct and I've been saying the same thing for a long time. Problem is we hired a GM who has a singular focus on copying a style that the league has had a long time to counteract. Houston has had some limited success with it because they were at the leading edge. We won't have that advantage in our favor.

Totally agree with both of you!!!