Windhorst: Towns and Butler pushing for Irving trade

[Coolbreeze44]

Would you really want to give up Wiggins AND Gorgui for Irving? Personally I wouldn't give up Wig for Kyrie even up unless we were pushing all of our chips in to the middle of the table for the next two years. I think Wiggins will eventually be a better all around player. But what we haven't heard is Thibs come out and say Wiggins is off the table. And until he does these rumors will persist until Irving is moved someplace.

[AbeVigodaLive]

Irving is a better player than Wiggins right now. It's not even very close.

But as noted, what about in two years? Wiggins should improve. He's finally surrounded by veteran difference makers. And even if he doesn't become good enough to be THE guy... is that terrible?

Irving struggled at times to take a backseat to James. Do you think he's getting his wish to be traded to take a backseat to a 3rd year guy in Minnesota? I might be in the minority as a huge NBA guy who dislikes the new turn for drama in the L. I don't want to rebuild after begging Butler and Irving to stay here in two years... and failing.

Build something sustainable. I don't see how mortgaging the long-term future for Irving for two years does that.

[TRKO [enjin:12664595]]

Would you really want to give up Wiggins AND Gorgui for Irving? Personally I wouldn't give up Wig for Kyrie even up unless we were pushing all of our chips in to the middle of the table for the next two years. I think Wiggins will eventually be a better all around player. But what we haven't heard is Thibs come out and say Wiggins is off the table. And until he does these rumors will persist until Irving is moved someplace.

I wouldn't at this point in the offseason. I would had considered it before free agency started. Even then I'm not sure I do it. Irving is an incredible offensive talent, but I like the idea of a fully balanced lineup.

[Coolbreeze44]

Irving is a better player than Wiggins right now. It's not even very close.

But as noted, what about in two years? Wiggins should improve. He's finally surrounded by veteran difference makers. And even if he doesn't become good enough to be THE guy... is that terrible?

Irving struggled at times to take a backseat to James. Do you think he's getting his wish to be traded to take a backseat to a 3rd year guy in Minnesota? I might be in the minority as a huge NBA guy who dislikes the new turn for drama in the L. I don't want to rebuild after begging Butler and Irving to stay here in two years... and failing.

Build something sustainable. I don't see how mortgaging the long-term future for Irving for two years does that.

Well said, I agree with all of that. The inmates are running the asylum now and the losers are going to be the small market franchises. Milwaukee has a promising core but no real way to add to it. If anything they will have trouble keeping it together. The only way a team like Milwaukee has a chance to win a championship is to luck into a MIchael or Lebron type draft pick. The Greek Freak is terrific, but he isn't transcendent and can't do it with the pieces Milwaukee can afford. I almost wish the 20 smallest market franchises would break off and start their own league with a hard cap. I'd support it knowing all the markets have at least close to an equal chance to compete.

[khans2k5 [enjin:6608728]]

Irving is a better player than Wiggins right now. It's not even very close.

But as noted, what about in two years? Wiggins should improve. He's finally surrounded by veteran difference makers. And even if he doesn't become good enough to be THE guy... is that terrible?

Irving struggled at times to take a backseat to James. Do you think he's getting his wish to be traded to take a backseat to a 3rd year guy in Minnesota? I might be in the minority as a huge NBA guy who dislikes the new turn for drama in the L. I don't want to rebuild after begging Butler and Irving to stay here in two years... and failing.

Build something sustainable. I don't see how mortgaging the long-term future for Irving for two years does that.

I just don't get the notion we would have to beg a team with 3 top 20 players to stay together. We were on his list for a reason. He's been in Cleveland his whole career so we'd be a step up in market. Butler is a good buddy of his. I just don't think there's gonna be any begging. It's gonna be more hey want to make a bunch of money and keep winning a bunch of games with a good friend of yours? Why would we not be in a strong position in that case instead of lowly beggars? Who else can offer him two top 15 teammates in 2 years? I'd give it a less than 10% chance we lose both Kyrie and Butler in 2 years. I still probably don't do the deal at the end of the day, but the attitude about this team is different around the league now so we should as fans stop acting like we are a lowly franchise who will need to beg and plead their way to success and start acting like the team guys like Kyrie Irving want to play for.

[AbeVigodaLive]

I think virtually every team is in the "begging" mode in today's NBA as players are staring at unprecedented money and freedom to make what they want... and play where they want... and with whom they want.

There's a lot of manipulation right now. And maybe MN becomes a fixture on that short list of destinations... but I'm not exactly sold on it either.

[Big O [enjin:13874644]]

My opinion comes down to two questions. 1) are we as presently configured a title contender within two years? 2) with a Wiggins for Kyrie trade are we a title contender in two years? If 2 is true and 1 is not I make the trade. If neither is true I pass. Kyrie and Butler do not leave a contender at the end of their contracts.

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

The only way we get Irving is if we part with Wiggins. I just don't see that happening...and that's coming from a Wiggins skeptic!

[TAFKASP]

I think Wiggins will eventually be a better all around player.

The most Minnesotan statement ever! We always prefer the "Might be" over the "Already is". On the one hand I feel the same, how do you risk losing out on the immense potential that Wiggins represents? On the other hand none of the Wolves potential has brought a single playoff loss, much less win in just about forever.

I've come to the conclusion that I just don't care. I don't want to think about it anymore, I just want to watch the Wolves win, however Thibs feels is best do it.

[Coolbreeze44]

I think Wiggins will eventually be a better all around player.

The most Minnesotan statement ever! We always prefer the "Might be" over the "Already is". On the one hand I feel the same, how do you risk losing out on the immense potential that Wiggins represents? On the other hand none of the Wolves potential has brought a single playoff loss, much less win in just about forever.

I've come to the conclusion that I just don't care. I don't want to think about it anymore, I just want to watch the Wolves win, however Thibs feels is best do it.

Keep in mind that Irving is a very one-way player, maybe even more than Andrew is today. He's never done anything without Lebron on the court with him. He's going to eventually bring back more than he's worth.