Minnesota Sports Forum

lipoli390 wrote:

FNG wrote:

Camden wrote:Alize Johnson signed a two-year deal with the Bulls for $3.6-million deal at the minimum. This doesn't directly impact Minnesota, obviously, but Johnson was a player I had mentioned not too long ago as a waiver target and then he was brought up again recently as someone intriguing should the Wolves have an extra spot.

I may have overestimated my prediction for what Jarred Vanderbilt will sign for. I felt good about a deal around three-year, $12-million total, but I'm now thinking it might be less than that.

Yep, I agree Cam. I like both Johnson and Vando for similar reasons, but I suspect this lessens Vando's bargaining position a little. I'm now more confident we'll sign Vando on a team-friendly contract. This is good news.

Yep. I always thought Cam's 3 yrs/$12M was on the high side. I'm thinking 3 yrs/$10M at most. The money and roster spots just aren't out there to bid up Vanderbilt's price. I continue to believe that the only reason Rosas hasn't signed Vando yet is to preserve salary and roster flexibility for a potential Simmons deal. It's the same reason they haven't yet signed Bolmaro. In fact, there's no other credible reason for not yet signing Bolmaro. He was recently in town and might still be here. And there's nothing to negotiate since his contract is subject to the rookie scale under the CBA. It's more evidence that Rosas really intent on trying to pull off a deal for Simmons.

Lip here is a different perspective which I have shared to some extent before. The likely question for Vanderbilt (and to some extent the Wolves) isn't what someone will pay him this season it what someone might pay him after this season. Let's say he has another good season taking some sort of legit step forward. What would you pay that sort of player? 10 million over 3 years means he is gonna make a little over 1 million more this season than the qualifying offer. If he really believes in himself that's a decent gamble IMO. I'm not saying Vanderbilt should do that but I also think it's a real possibility. It's not like he is Turning down 20 million a year (or even 5 million a year) or something.

If the Wolves believe in Vanderbilt...and it seems like they do I would want to give him just a little more money to lock him in for the next 3 years because like I said if he plays well he could costs alot more than 3 or 4 million a year. Of course if Vanderbilt signed the qualifying offer that means the wolves would have some more money to spend and could bring in a guy to the 15th spot and still have some wiggle room left under the tax. There is a positive there.

Like I have said a few times IMHO I think the reality is both sides are gonna want to get something done. I think it's interesting that we keep hearing reports that the Wolves are planning to give McLaughlin a little more than the vet min to bring him back. I think that means they are willing to spend a little more to get a guy back that they like. If McLaughlin is the guy a number of us think he is that's going to be a nice contract for a legit backup level PG who could assume that role next season while providing nice depth at a spot where the 2 top PGs tend to miss games every season. I wouldn't be shocked the the Wolves rested either of those guys some games. I also think that the Wolves may also be thinking they will give McLaughlin a little more money since they made him play on a 2-way last year and didn't do anything with the open spot they had. They could have given him a little more money by signing him at the end of the season but they probably wanted to keep that roster spot open in case of any trades were to happen around the draft or before the new league year. Having him as a RFA and not taking up a 2-way deal or a roster spot had some benefits also.

Monster - I think your alternative perspective is reasonable and worth considering. I'd love to know what's really going on with Vanderbilt. It sure sounds like the Wolves are highly confident they'll re-sign him. I don't think the two sides are far apart. In fact, I think they're very close. I'm not sure what the delay is. Even stranger is the delay signing Bolmaro since there's nothing to negotiate with him.

lipoli390 wrote:Monster - I think your alternative perspective is reasonable and worth considering. I'd love to know what's really going on with Vanderbilt. It sure sounds like the Wolves are highly confident they'll re-sign him. I don't think the two sides are far apart. In fact, I think they're very close. I'm not sure what the delay is. Even stranger is the delay signing Bolmaro since there's nothing to negotiate with him.

It's been a little over a week ago that the Markkenan RFA situation was resolved. I don't find the delay of RFA signing strange at all.

Bolmaro not being signed yet...that seems more significant. His rights could be traded and his salary would be 0 in the trade. As Cool stated it could be something to do with the buyout. Toronto seems like a franchise that would like a guy like him.

monsterpile wrote:

lipoli390 wrote:Monster - I think your alternative perspective is reasonable and worth considering. I'd love to know what's really going on with Vanderbilt. It sure sounds like the Wolves are highly confident they'll re-sign him. I don't think the two sides are far apart. In fact, I think they're very close. I'm not sure what the delay is. Even stranger is the delay signing Bolmaro since there's nothing to negotiate with him.

It's been a little over a week ago that the Markkenan RFA situation was resolved. I don't find the delay of RFA signing strange at all.

Bolmaro not being signed yet...that seems more significant. His rights could be traded and his salary would be 0 in the trade. As Cool stated it could be something to do with the buyout. Toronto seems like a franchise that would like a guy like him.

Yes. I have no doubt that Bolmaro hasn't been signed as part of Gersson's strategy to maintain flexibility for a Simmons deal. I think the same is true for Vanderbilt, although it's less obvious. We know the Wolves like Vanderbilt based on what Gersson and Finch have said publicly. Given the free-agent market situation right now, a Vanderbilt deal should be easy. He's easily affordable for the Wolves with their remaining luxury tax room. I'll add that, if Rosas wants maximum flexibility for a possible Simmons deal as I'm sure he does, then it actually makes no sense to sign Vanderbilt now. There is, in fact, no risk to the Wolves from delay. Vanderbilt is a restricted free agent, which puts the Wolves in the cat bird's seat. Moreover, the free agent market is pretty cold now with cap money, cap exceptions and roster spots down to bare minimums.

Harry Giles signed a one-year, non-guaranteed contract with the Clippers.

Camden wrote:Harry Giles signed a one-year, non-guaranteed contract with the Clippers.

I just saw that. As Rosas keeps his remaining powder dry for a possible run at Simmons, other opportunities slip away. Not that Giles was a jewel the Wolves shouldn't have let slip through their fingers. But he remains an interesting, high-upside PF who I would have liked this Wolves to try out on a cheap non-guaranteed contract. Meanwhile, Hartenstein remains available, but I don't see the Wolves signing him as they continue to pursue Simmons. I can't get down on Rosas for passing on players like Giles and Hartenstein to preserve flexibility for a run at a player like Simmons. But there are opportunity costs associated with Gersson's Simmons gambit. At the end of the day, Rosas can't ensure he gets Simmons and he could end up overpaying to get him.

If I were in Gersson's position, I'd join the vast majority of NBA teams who are not pursuing Simmons. Instead, I'd turn my attention to shoring up the roster we have by signing Vanderbilt and J-Mac while also trading Layman for some more salary space and signing Hartenstein. Meanwhile, I'd explore possible deals for Myles Turner, who could probably be obtained for a fraction of what it would take to get Simmons. Myles is also a great defender and an elite rim protection, which is something we don't have on this team.

lipoli390 wrote:

Camden wrote:Harry Giles signed a one-year, non-guaranteed contract with the Clippers.

I just saw that. As Rosas keeps his remaining powder dry for a possible run at Simmons, other opportunities slip away. Not that Giles was a jewel the Wolves shouldn't have let slip through their fingers. But he remains an interesting, high-upside PF who I would have liked this Wolves to try out on a cheap non-guaranteed contract. Meanwhile, Hartenstein remains available, but I don't see the Wolves signing him as they continue to pursue Simmons. I can't get down on Rosas for passing on players like Giles and Hartenstein to preserve flexibility for a run at a player like Simmons. But there are opportunity costs associated with Gersson's Simmons gambit. At the end of the day, Rosas can't ensure he gets Simmons and he could end up overpaying to get him.

If I were in Gersson's position, I'd join the vast majority of NBA teams who are not pursuing Simmons. Instead, I'd turn my attention to shoring up the roster we have by signing Vanderbilt and J-Mac while also trading Layman for some more salary space and signing Hartenstein. Meanwhile, I'd explore possible deals for Myles Turner, who could probably be obtained for a fraction of what it would take to get Simmons. Myles is also a great defender and an elite rim protection, which is something we don't have on this team.

Hang in there Lip. We need Simmons first and foremost. These end of the roster guys really don't mean much in the grand scheme of things. Myles Turner excluded of course.

CoolBreeze44 wrote:

lipoli390 wrote:

Camden wrote:Harry Giles signed a one-year, non-guaranteed contract with the Clippers.

I just saw that. As Rosas keeps his remaining powder dry for a possible run at Simmons, other opportunities slip away. Not that Giles was a jewel the Wolves shouldn't have let slip through their fingers. But he remains an interesting, high-upside PF who I would have liked this Wolves to try out on a cheap non-guaranteed contract. Meanwhile, Hartenstein remains available, but I don't see the Wolves signing him as they continue to pursue Simmons. I can't get down on Rosas for passing on players like Giles and Hartenstein to preserve flexibility for a run at a player like Simmons. But there are opportunity costs associated with Gersson's Simmons gambit. At the end of the day, Rosas can't ensure he gets Simmons and he could end up overpaying to get him.

If I were in Gersson's position, I'd join the vast majority of NBA teams who are not pursuing Simmons. Instead, I'd turn my attention to shoring up the roster we have by signing Vanderbilt and J-Mac while also trading Layman for some more salary space and signing Hartenstein. Meanwhile, I'd explore possible deals for Myles Turner, who could probably be obtained for a fraction of what it would take to get Simmons. Myles is also a great defender and an elite rim protection, which is something we don't have on this team.

Hang in there Lip. We need Simmons first and foremost. These end of the roster guys really don't mean much in the grand scheme of things. Myles Turner excluded of course.

What's the chances a guy like Harry Giles becomes even a solid rotation player? 25%? I think there is a legit chance that the Wolves could get Simmons for a price Lip could be talked into reasonably easily. Lip you are obsessed with Turner I'm concerned you would overpay to get him here. :)

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CoolBreeze44 wrote:

lipoli390 wrote:

Camden wrote:Harry Giles signed a one-year, non-guaranteed contract with the Clippers.

I just saw that. As Rosas keeps his remaining powder dry for a possible run at Simmons, other opportunities slip away. Not that Giles was a jewel the Wolves shouldn't have let slip through their fingers. But he remains an interesting, high-upside PF who I would have liked this Wolves to try out on a cheap non-guaranteed contract. Meanwhile, Hartenstein remains available, but I don't see the Wolves signing him as they continue to pursue Simmons. I can't get down on Rosas for passing on players like Giles and Hartenstein to preserve flexibility for a run at a player like Simmons. But there are opportunity costs associated with Gersson's Simmons gambit. At the end of the day, Rosas can't ensure he gets Simmons and he could end up overpaying to get him.

If I were in Gersson's position, I'd join the vast majority of NBA teams who are not pursuing Simmons. Instead, I'd turn my attention to shoring up the roster we have by signing Vanderbilt and J-Mac while also trading Layman for some more salary space and signing Hartenstein. Meanwhile, I'd explore possible deals for Myles Turner, who could probably be obtained for a fraction of what it would take to get Simmons. Myles is also a great defender and an elite rim protection, which is something we don't have on this team.

Hang in there Lip. We need Simmons first and foremost. These end of the roster guys really don't mean much in the grand scheme of things. Myles Turner excluded of course.

Yeah, I agree. I do like a lot of the guys Lip mentions, but ultimately they are end of the rotation guys who I don't believe get us anywhere near 40 wins. I think Rosas is smart enough to realize Simmons is his best chance to add 10-15 wins to this roster, and he has to be encouraged by most sources having the Wolves in the lead in the Simmons Sweepstakes. This is a unique opportunity for the Wolves, and this isn't the time to play small ball. Rosas needs to sit tight and play for the Earl Weaver 3-run homer here. If the Simmons dream doesn't come to fruition, I think we're doomed to a mid-30s win season (still a double digit increase in wins by the way). But be patient and hope the dream happens.

monsterpile wrote:

CoolBreeze44 wrote:

lipoli390 wrote:

Camden wrote:Harry Giles signed a one-year, non-guaranteed contract with the Clippers.

I just saw that. As Rosas keeps his remaining powder dry for a possible run at Simmons, other opportunities slip away. Not that Giles was a jewel the Wolves shouldn't have let slip through their fingers. But he remains an interesting, high-upside PF who I would have liked this Wolves to try out on a cheap non-guaranteed contract. Meanwhile, Hartenstein remains available, but I don't see the Wolves signing him as they continue to pursue Simmons. I can't get down on Rosas for passing on players like Giles and Hartenstein to preserve flexibility for a run at a player like Simmons. But there are opportunity costs associated with Gersson's Simmons gambit. At the end of the day, Rosas can't ensure he gets Simmons and he could end up overpaying to get him.

If I were in Gersson's position, I'd join the vast majority of NBA teams who are not pursuing Simmons. Instead, I'd turn my attention to shoring up the roster we have by signing Vanderbilt and J-Mac while also trading Layman for some more salary space and signing Hartenstein. Meanwhile, I'd explore possible deals for Myles Turner, who could probably be obtained for a fraction of what it would take to get Simmons. Myles is also a great defender and an elite rim protection, which is something we don't have on this team.

Hang in there Lip. We need Simmons first and foremost. These end of the roster guys really don't mean much in the grand scheme of things. Myles Turner excluded of course.

What's the chances a guy like Harry Giles becomes even a solid rotation player? 25%? I think there is a legit chance that the Wolves could get Simmons for a price Lip could be talked into reasonably easily. Lip you are obsessed with Turner I'm concerned you would overpay to get him here. :)

Lol. Good one, Monster. I know you think Myles Turner is permanently on crutches. :) Note, however, that Turner apparently did not opt for surgery on his toe. He said he's doing fine and back practicing on the court. So he remains my #1 obsession. Rosas could get my obsession for far less than it will cost to get his newest obsession. Simmons. My obsession is not only an elite defender, but an elite rim protector. He is a precise fit for the Wolves biggest need, i.e, a defensive PF. And he can hit threes and free throws. Is Simmons a better overall player and talent? Definitely. But give in the Wolves current core and the much smaller price we'd have to pay to get Turner, I'd pursue Turner more aggressively than Simmons. But that's just my obsession. :)