Minnesota Sports Forum

lipoli390 wrote:

thedoper wrote:What would have the wins prediction thread looked like with the knowledge KAT was going to be out for 50-60 games? I think most predictions would have us right around where we are right now. In spite of all the letdowns this hasnt been a lost season at all imo. The door to the next step is clearly there for both Ant and Jaden. They just need to take it. Happy to keep KAT in the mix until it is crystal clear it is not working. I couldnt think of a worse time to trade Rudy then this offseason unless he has a killer play in, playoff stretch.

I would have predicted a slightly better record than the current record if I had known KAT would miss 55 games. I would have expected the team to win more of the 25 games KAT and Rudy played together. I would have also expected wins against some of the bad teams the Wolves lost after KAT went down. But I've since come to realize that Rudy isn't as good as I thought he was. I never thought he was a very good fit and I hated how much we gave up for him, but I still thought he'd be better than he's been. On the other hand, I never thought this team would be particularly good with Rudy and no KAT. I absolutely think this team would have a significantly better record if, instead of Rudy, they had Vando, Beasley, Beverley and Kessler. Moreover, they'd also have all their 2023 first round pick as consolation. But that's history.

thedoper wrote:

AbeVigodaLive wrote:

lipoli390 wrote:

thedoper wrote:What would have the wins prediction thread looked like with the knowledge KAT was going to be out for 50-60 games? I think most predictions would have us right around where we are right now. In spite of all the letdowns this hasnt been a lost season at all imo. The door to the next step is clearly there for both Ant and Jaden. They just need to take it. Happy to keep KAT in the mix until it is crystal clear it is not working. I couldnt think of a worse time to trade Rudy then this offseason unless he has a killer play in, playoff stretch.

I would have predicted a slightly better record than the current record if I had known KAT would miss 55 games. I would have expected the team to win more of the 25 games KAT and Rudy played together. I would have also expected wins against some of the bad teams the Wolves lost after KAT went down. But I've since come to realize that Rudy isn't as good as I thought he was. I never thought he was a very good fit and I hated how much we gave up for him, but I still thought he'd be better than he's been. On the other hand, I never thought this team would be particularly good with Rudy and no KAT. I absolutely think this team would have a significantly better record if, instead of Rudy, they had Vando, Beasley, Beverley and Kessler. Moreover, they'd also have all their 2023 first round pick as consolation. But that's history.

And there's context to consider.

For example... the Timberwolves are repeatedly and consistently losing to the worst teams in the league in similar ways... with "lack of urgency and effort" as described by the coach, players and writers close to the team.

So while I'd agree that a .500 record without Towns actually sounds pretty solid in a vacuum... we've all experienced HOW this team has made it to this point. And I can't imagine a single one of us on this forum has immensely enjoyed this season or appreciated the (in)consistent effort from this squad.

Personally, I've found it to be very much a drag. Whether we go back to the Gobert trade itself, or the listless losses to the Pistons or Rockets or whoever, to the 4th quarter failures in the past couple of weeks... it's been a slog.

And there's just no way I can look at the results thus far and think "Hey, not bad. This team deserves my money/attention/patience/excuses/et al."



[Note: Last night was a good, but not even close to the most glaring example. The Warriors crowd knew their local team was undermanned and showed their appreciation when they battled back into the game largely due to grit and hustle.]

I have enjoyed the season. I have looked at it completely from the standpoint of how has the future of our team (Ant and Jaden) developed. There have been all sorts of ups and downs but I really think the development of these kids has been really fun to watch. Especially since we have been through so many iterations of teams lead by players in the early 20s being God awful. Rudy has always just been a glue guy, I feel he's played that role for the most part with this team. I did have higher expectations but all of them were due to Towns being a significant part of the talent on this roster.

CoolBreeze44 wrote:

thedoper wrote:

AbeVigodaLive wrote:

lipoli390 wrote:

thedoper wrote:What would have the wins prediction thread looked like with the knowledge KAT was going to be out for 50-60 games? I think most predictions would have us right around where we are right now. In spite of all the letdowns this hasnt been a lost season at all imo. The door to the next step is clearly there for both Ant and Jaden. They just need to take it. Happy to keep KAT in the mix until it is crystal clear it is not working. I couldnt think of a worse time to trade Rudy then this offseason unless he has a killer play in, playoff stretch.

I would have predicted a slightly better record than the current record if I had known KAT would miss 55 games. I would have expected the team to win more of the 25 games KAT and Rudy played together. I would have also expected wins against some of the bad teams the Wolves lost after KAT went down. But I've since come to realize that Rudy isn't as good as I thought he was. I never thought he was a very good fit and I hated how much we gave up for him, but I still thought he'd be better than he's been. On the other hand, I never thought this team would be particularly good with Rudy and no KAT. I absolutely think this team would have a significantly better record if, instead of Rudy, they had Vando, Beasley, Beverley and Kessler. Moreover, they'd also have all their 2023 first round pick as consolation. But that's history.

And there's context to consider.

For example... the Timberwolves are repeatedly and consistently losing to the worst teams in the league in similar ways... with "lack of urgency and effort" as described by the coach, players and writers close to the team.

So while I'd agree that a .500 record without Towns actually sounds pretty solid in a vacuum... we've all experienced HOW this team has made it to this point. And I can't imagine a single one of us on this forum has immensely enjoyed this season or appreciated the (in)consistent effort from this squad.

Personally, I've found it to be very much a drag. Whether we go back to the Gobert trade itself, or the listless losses to the Pistons or Rockets or whoever, to the 4th quarter failures in the past couple of weeks... it's been a slog.

And there's just no way I can look at the results thus far and think "Hey, not bad. This team deserves my money/attention/patience/excuses/et al."



[Note: Last night was a good, but not even close to the most glaring example. The Warriors crowd knew their local team was undermanned and showed their appreciation when they battled back into the game largely due to grit and hustle.]

I have enjoyed the season. I have looked at it completely from the standpoint of how has the future of our team (Ant and Jaden) developed. There have been all sorts of ups and downs but I really think the development of these kids has been really fun to watch. Especially since we have been through so many iterations of teams lead by players in the early 20s being God awful. Rudy has always just been a glue guy, I feel he's played that role for the most part with this team. I did have higher expectations but all of them were due to Towns being a significant part of the talent on this roster.

I've also enjoyed the season, particularly for the way Ant and Jaden have grown. But also because I never have to watch DLO Russell perform in a Wolves uniform again. You may think that's trite, but my enjoyment of the team present and future is so much better with him out of the picture. The trade was a pivot point for me in terms of how much I enjoy the games. And who knows, anything can happen in this crazy season. One game a time from here on out and let's see where we are after game 82.

CoolBreeze44 wrote:

lipoli390 wrote:

thedoper wrote:What would have the wins prediction thread looked like with the knowledge KAT was going to be out for 50-60 games? I think most predictions would have us right around where we are right now. In spite of all the letdowns this hasnt been a lost season at all imo. The door to the next step is clearly there for both Ant and Jaden. They just need to take it. Happy to keep KAT in the mix until it is crystal clear it is not working. I couldnt think of a worse time to trade Rudy then this offseason unless he has a killer play in, playoff stretch.

I would have predicted a slightly better record than the current record if I had known KAT would miss 55 games. I would have expected the team to win more of the 25 games KAT and Rudy played together. I would have also expected wins against some of the bad teams the Wolves lost after KAT went down. But I've since come to realize that Rudy isn't as good as I thought he was. I never thought he was a very good fit and I hated how much we gave up for him, but I still thought he'd be better than he's been. On the other hand, I never thought this team would be particularly good with Rudy and no KAT. I absolutely think this team would have a significantly better record if, instead of Rudy, they had Vando, Beasley, Beverley and Kessler. Moreover, they'd also have all their 2023 first round pick as consolation. But that's history.

I don't know how, but you keep breaking new ground. :)

CoolBreeze44 wrote:Lebron looks to be out for a while with his foot injury. That will help our cause.

lipoli390 wrote:

CoolBreeze44 wrote:

lipoli390 wrote:

thedoper wrote:What would have the wins prediction thread looked like with the knowledge KAT was going to be out for 50-60 games? I think most predictions would have us right around where we are right now. In spite of all the letdowns this hasnt been a lost season at all imo. The door to the next step is clearly there for both Ant and Jaden. They just need to take it. Happy to keep KAT in the mix until it is crystal clear it is not working. I couldnt think of a worse time to trade Rudy then this offseason unless he has a killer play in, playoff stretch.

I would have predicted a slightly better record than the current record if I had known KAT would miss 55 games. I would have expected the team to win more of the 25 games KAT and Rudy played together. I would have also expected wins against some of the bad teams the Wolves lost after KAT went down. But I've since come to realize that Rudy isn't as good as I thought he was. I never thought he was a very good fit and I hated how much we gave up for him, but I still thought he'd be better than he's been. On the other hand, I never thought this team would be particularly good with Rudy and no KAT. I absolutely think this team would have a significantly better record if, instead of Rudy, they had Vando, Beasley, Beverley and Kessler. Moreover, they'd also have all their 2023 first round pick as consolation. But that's history.

I don't know how, but you keep breaking new ground. :)

Not sure what you mean, Cool. Was it unreasonable to believe Rudy would be better than he's been? Was it nuts to believe this team should have won more games against bad teams when Rudy and KAT were playing together for 25 games or so? I don't think so.

Not sure how anyone would conclude we couldn't possibly have a better record with Vando, Beasley, Beverley and Kessler instead of Rudy. Note we'd also have Anderson since he was signed before the Rudy deal. The depth alone would have given us a better record given how bad our bench has been. What I find amusing is how some fans keep deluding themselves into believing we're better off with Rudy than with the players traded away to get him. I just hope our front office execs have their feet planted a bit more firmly in reality.

CoolBreeze44 wrote:

lipoli390 wrote:

CoolBreeze44 wrote:

lipoli390 wrote:

thedoper wrote:What would have the wins prediction thread looked like with the knowledge KAT was going to be out for 50-60 games? I think most predictions would have us right around where we are right now. In spite of all the letdowns this hasnt been a lost season at all imo. The door to the next step is clearly there for both Ant and Jaden. They just need to take it. Happy to keep KAT in the mix until it is crystal clear it is not working. I couldnt think of a worse time to trade Rudy then this offseason unless he has a killer play in, playoff stretch.

I would have predicted a slightly better record than the current record if I had known KAT would miss 55 games. I would have expected the team to win more of the 25 games KAT and Rudy played together. I would have also expected wins against some of the bad teams the Wolves lost after KAT went down. But I've since come to realize that Rudy isn't as good as I thought he was. I never thought he was a very good fit and I hated how much we gave up for him, but I still thought he'd be better than he's been. On the other hand, I never thought this team would be particularly good with Rudy and no KAT. I absolutely think this team would have a significantly better record if, instead of Rudy, they had Vando, Beasley, Beverley and Kessler. Moreover, they'd also have all their 2023 first round pick as consolation. But that's history.

I don't know how, but you keep breaking new ground. :)

Not sure what you mean, Cool. Was it unreasonable to believe Rudy would be better than he's been? Was it nuts to believe this team should have won more games against bad teams when Rudy and KAT were playing together for 25 games or so? I don't think so.

Not sure how anyone would conclude we couldn't possibly have a better record with Vando, Beasley, Beverley and Kessler instead of Rudy. Note we'd also have Anderson since he was signed before the Rudy deal. The depth alone would have given us a better record given how bad our bench has been. What I find amusing is how some fans keep deluding themselves into believing we're better off with Rudy than with the players traded away to get him. I just hope our front office execs have their feet planted a bit more firmly in reality.

It's not what you're saying, it's the frequency with which you find different ways to say the same thing. We've been reading this take in one form or another since the day the trade was made. What you're saying is right, few would dispute that. But it's the Camdenian approach to posting that's getting somewhat obnoxious.

Camden wrote:

CoolBreeze44 wrote:

lipoli390 wrote:

CoolBreeze44 wrote:

lipoli390 wrote:

thedoper wrote:What would have the wins prediction thread looked like with the knowledge KAT was going to be out for 50-60 games? I think most predictions would have us right around where we are right now. In spite of all the letdowns this hasnt been a lost season at all imo. The door to the next step is clearly there for both Ant and Jaden. They just need to take it. Happy to keep KAT in the mix until it is crystal clear it is not working. I couldnt think of a worse time to trade Rudy then this offseason unless he has a killer play in, playoff stretch.

I would have predicted a slightly better record than the current record if I had known KAT would miss 55 games. I would have expected the team to win more of the 25 games KAT and Rudy played together. I would have also expected wins against some of the bad teams the Wolves lost after KAT went down. But I've since come to realize that Rudy isn't as good as I thought he was. I never thought he was a very good fit and I hated how much we gave up for him, but I still thought he'd be better than he's been. On the other hand, I never thought this team would be particularly good with Rudy and no KAT. I absolutely think this team would have a significantly better record if, instead of Rudy, they had Vando, Beasley, Beverley and Kessler. Moreover, they'd also have all their 2023 first round pick as consolation. But that's history.

I don't know how, but you keep breaking new ground. :)

Not sure what you mean, Cool. Was it unreasonable to believe Rudy would be better than he's been? Was it nuts to believe this team should have won more games against bad teams when Rudy and KAT were playing together for 25 games or so? I don't think so.

Not sure how anyone would conclude we couldn't possibly have a better record with Vando, Beasley, Beverley and Kessler instead of Rudy. Note we'd also have Anderson since he was signed before the Rudy deal. The depth alone would have given us a better record given how bad our bench has been. What I find amusing is how some fans keep deluding themselves into believing we're better off with Rudy than with the players traded away to get him. I just hope our front office execs have their feet planted a bit more firmly in reality.

It's not what you're saying, it's the frequency with which you find different ways to say the same thing. We've been reading this take in one form or another since the day the trade was made. What you're saying is right, few would dispute that. But it's the Camdenian approach to posting that's getting somewhat obnoxious.

You're calling someone else obnoxious? That's ironic. What was the purpose of your response above? It's not productive dialogue and you know that. You just felt like being a dickhead for the sake of doing so.

Lip's comment aligns with the position we knew he had and it fit the topic of discussion raised by another poster. I see no issue here besides your lack of etiquette.