Minnesota Sports Forum

Flip acquired Brewer, who proceeded to have a career year, and Kevin Martin that summer after Kahn was let go. So I think it's a little questionable to suggest Kahn handed Flip a 40-win squad since those two guys were slotted right into the starting 5 and played quite well for us.

Either way, the whole franchise has been a disaster for the most part, Thibs and Kahn included.

Q12543 wrote:Flip acquired Brewer, who proceeded to have a career year, and Kevin Martin that summer after Kahn was let go. So I think it's a little questionable to suggest Kahn handed Flip a 40-win squad since those two guys were slotted right into the starting 5 and played quite well for us.

Either way, the whole franchise has been a disaster for the most part, Thibs and Kahn included.

Q I'd say Flip was competent and also doing things that made the franchise look like it was pretty legit. He made some mistakes but most of us would be happy for that again. Remember Flip also moved on from AK and some of us were on the fence about that. My previous post about Kahn that included Flip selling some picks was a bit of a shot at Flip (and defending Thibs a bit) but mostly a shot at Kahn and his ability to suck at drafting players. I'd be curious to know what Tony Ronzoe wanted to do in that Derrick Williams draft.

My point more is that IMO Thibs was probably more in line with competent than disaster when it comes to basketball decisions. If you want to talk about how he handled things as THE guy...sure maybe it would be fair to compare him to Kahn although some stories I've heard about Kahn he sounded hilariously bad at his job as a GM. Maybe we will hear some stories like that about Thibs also.

Hopefully we get better but I would think we could get someone fairly competent that also was not hated and makes the franchise look more legit...wait that's a lot to ask right? Sigh...

I was expecting this team to fold when Roco went down, they're sticking around. Nice to see.

sjm34 wrote:Kahn started rebuilding immediately and they managed a paltry 15 wins his first season, and the team he left with Flip pumped out 40 wins. Thibs managed 31 wins (2 more than Mitchell) his first season and I would guess a full season might have brought 40-45 wins. Not really seeing much of a difference. For as bad as Kahn was, Thibs actually looks to be worse.

Your memory seems to be way off if you actually believe any of what you said.

thedoper wrote:I was expecting this team to fold when Roco went down, they're sticking around. Nice to see.

It helps there are some other flawed teams some of which have their own injury problems. I was thinking if the Wolves can stay around .500 without Covington and get him back they would have a chance. They are not doing it in spectacular fashion but they are doing it and having to do so starting a rookie and having to play guys like Bayless and even Deng minutes plus Tolliver as a wing.

We were 3 1/2 games out of the playoffs when RoCo went down at the start of January. And at that time we didn't know that our second highest scorer (Rose) would miss more than half of January's games, and our 2 most reliable PGs (Teague and Tyus), both in the top 5 in the league in assist to turnover ratio, would miss about half the games this month, and Jerryd Bayless would be playing 36 minutes a game.

Be honest. If you had known on January 1 that we would be without so many key players during the month, would you have predicted that we would have actually narrowed the gap by the end of the month to 3 games? My guess is if we had conducted a poll, over 90% of the board would have said the gap would have increased rather than decreased.

So why is it so lonely here on playoff island? Doesn't everyone agree that we have overachieved given the injuries? If the playoff pessimism is based on a belief that our 4 injured players aren't going to play or contribute much the rest of the year (I tend to think Teague is out for the season based on what I am hearing), then I don't disagree...we simply can't continue to compete without 4 key players. But if it's based on a belief that we can't compete even with a full roster, I invite you to reconsider your position. We have closed the gap by a half game with Ryan coaching Bayless, Okogie, Terrell and Canaan...and Tolliver out of position. Does anyone really think we wouldn't be much better with Ryan coaching RoCo, Rose, Tyus and Teague instead? Compare those two groups player by player, and you can't help but understand how amazing this month has been.

Plenty of room here on playoff island...

longstrangetrip wrote:We were 3 1/2 games out of the playoffs when RoCo went down at the start of January. And at that time we didn't know that our second highest scorer (Rose) would miss more than half of January's games, and our 2 most reliable PGs (Teague and Tyus), both in the top 5 in the league in assist to turnover ratio, would miss about half the games this month, and Jerryd Bayless would be playing 36 minutes a game.

Be honest. If you had known on January 1 that we would be without so many key players during the month, would you have predicted that we would have actually narrowed the gap by the end of the month to 3 games? My guess is if we had conducted a poll, over 90% of the board would have said the gap would have increased rather than decreased.

So why is it so lonely here on playoff island? Doesn't everyone agree that we have overachieved given the injuries? If the playoff pessimism is based on a belief that our 4 injured players aren't going to play or contribute much the rest of the year (I tend to think Teague is out for the season based on what I am hearing), then I don't disagree...we simply can't continue to compete without 4 key players. But if it's based on a belief that we can't compete even with a full roster, I invite you to reconsider your position. We have closed the gap by a half game with Ryan coaching Bayless, Okogie, Terrell and Canaan...and Tolliver out of position. Does anyone really think we wouldn't be much better with Ryan coaching RoCo, Rose, Tyus and Teague instead? Compare those two groups player by player, and you can't help but understand how amazing this month has been.

Plenty of room here on playoff island...

I'll give you one gigantic reason why I am pessimistic. We are 6-5 since ryan has taken over. We are 1-4 against playoff teams and 5-1 against non playoff teams. We have beat the suns twice, non lebron lakers, pelicans, the terrible Grizzlies and a solid OKC team. Yes we are injured but we don't have a clue when those guys are back.

We have beat the teams we are supposed to and have lost to the teams we are chasing. I think every team above us is more talented top to bottom.

We have one above average starter in Kat. I just don't see a massive run coming on. Cov is streaky, wiggins is streaky, rose can't keep healthy.

I'm happy we are winning I just don't see this massive run coming

Regardless of how the Wolves do, they need 3 of LAC, LAL, Sac or Utah to slip...

3 games is nothing to sneeze at... but let's assume the Clippers fall apart AND the Wolves play better than they have all season. Fair enough.

And let's assume the upstart Sacramento squad has been a fluke. Take them out too in a best case scenario. We still need another team:

- The Lakers are 20 - 14 with James. He's expected back soon... possibly joined by Anthony Davis. We really want to be optimistic vs. that?

- Utah has won 8 out of 10 games. They're 3.5 up. And they've had the best defense in basketball for 2 months... and are poised for yet another strong 2nd half showing like they've done repeatedly in recent seasons.

Meanwhile, we'd have to expect a team with its 4th string PG and top wing player out... is going to suddenly improve a lot?

The Wolves aren't making the playoffs. But every week... every game... they stay in the hunt is ultimately a good thing for the future.

longstrangetrip wrote:We were 3 1/2 games out of the playoffs when RoCo went down at the start of January. And at that time we didn't know that our second highest scorer (Rose) would miss more than half of January's games, and our 2 most reliable PGs (Teague and Tyus), both in the top 5 in the league in assist to turnover ratio, would miss about half the games this month, and Jerryd Bayless would be playing 36 minutes a game.

Be honest. If you had known on January 1 that we would be without so many key players during the month, would you have predicted that we would have actually narrowed the gap by the end of the month to 3 games? My guess is if we had conducted a poll, over 90% of the board would have said the gap would have increased rather than decreased.

So why is it so lonely here on playoff island? Doesn't everyone agree that we have overachieved given the injuries? If the playoff pessimism is based on a belief that our 4 injured players aren't going to play or contribute much the rest of the year (I tend to think Teague is out for the season based on what I am hearing), then I don't disagree...we simply can't continue to compete without 4 key players. But if it's based on a belief that we can't compete even with a full roster, I invite you to reconsider your position. We have closed the gap by a half game with Ryan coaching Bayless, Okogie, Terrell and Canaan...and Tolliver out of position. Does anyone really think we wouldn't be much better with Ryan coaching RoCo, Rose, Tyus and Teague instead? Compare those two groups player by player, and you can't help but understand how amazing this month has been.

Plenty of room here on playoff island...

I'll come to playoff Island. We better have lots of Tequila and limes though because it may get ugly.

thedoper wrote:

longstrangetrip wrote:We were 3 1/2 games out of the playoffs when RoCo went down at the start of January. And at that time we didn't know that our second highest scorer (Rose) would miss more than half of January's games, and our 2 most reliable PGs (Teague and Tyus), both in the top 5 in the league in assist to turnover ratio, would miss about half the games this month, and Jerryd Bayless would be playing 36 minutes a game.

Be honest. If you had known on January 1 that we would be without so many key players during the month, would you have predicted that we would have actually narrowed the gap by the end of the month to 3 games? My guess is if we had conducted a poll, over 90% of the board would have said the gap would have increased rather than decreased.

So why is it so lonely here on playoff island? Doesn't everyone agree that we have overachieved given the injuries? If the playoff pessimism is based on a belief that our 4 injured players aren't going to play or contribute much the rest of the year (I tend to think Teague is out for the season based on what I am hearing), then I don't disagree...we simply can't continue to compete without 4 key players. But if it's based on a belief that we can't compete even with a full roster, I invite you to reconsider your position. We have closed the gap by a half game with Ryan coaching Bayless, Okogie, Terrell and Canaan...and Tolliver out of position. Does anyone really think we wouldn't be much better with Ryan coaching RoCo, Rose, Tyus and Teague instead? Compare those two groups player by player, and you can't help but understand how amazing this month has been.

Plenty of room here on playoff island...

I'll come to playoff Island. We better have lots of Tequila and limes though because it may get ugly.

Welcome, doper...I'll have to check on my Tequila inventory!

Abe makes a good point that we need to play better than 3 of the 4 teams we are chasing (or another that might be one injury away from collapsing). I have become a big fan of Utah after they swept us, so I see them making it. But I am still not sold on the Clip-joint and Sac-town, and see us easily passing them IF we get healthy (2 home games against LA will help here). So that leaves the Lakers, and I agree that we are not likely to catch them if James is healthy. But is he? The latest update is that he is "close". My recollection is that he was "close" two weeks ago too, so this is looking fishy to me. I get the same feeling about James' injury that I get with Teague, who I think is out for a long time if not the season. Groin injuries are tricky and tend to recur more than a typical injury. I wouldn't be surprised if James returns within a week or so, but goes down again with the same groin issue.

So the path to the playoffs has two significant hurdles...we have to get healthy, and James has to not (or one of the other teams ahead of us has to get in the same injury boat we have been in for the entire month). Unlikely to be sure, but far from impossible. At any rate, Wolves fans have to be encouraged about the way this severely depleted team has performed under Saunders.