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Re: GDT: Minnesota vs. Golden State

Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2022 12:27 pm
by Camden [enjin:6601484]
- Spencer Dinwiddie: three-years, $54-million (2021)
- Lonzo Ball: four-years, $80-million (2021)
- Fred VanVleet: four-years, $85-million (2020)
- Malcolm Brogdon: four-years, $89.3-million (2021)
- Kyle Lowry: three-years, $85-million (2021)
- DeMar DeRozan: three-years, $85-million (2021)
- Chris Paul: four-years, $120-million (2021)

The salary cap projections from last summer proved to be accurate and the market has been set for non-superstar guards. Minnesota could offer D'Angelo Russell the four-years, $100-million deal that's been mentioned here or even choose to go three-years, $85-million and allow him to retest free agency as a 30-year old, but the range of what he should be offered is in place already. We can go back and forth over his importance to this team and the statistics we choose to mention, but the fact of the matter is that the deals above show what his potential earnings are on the free market. Considering his durability concerns, it would behoove Russell and his agency to lock him into another long-term deal and provide financial security moving forward. He could always choose to bet on himself and play out his final year, but I'm not sure how much more he'd stand to earn in doing so when the 2023 free agent class appears to be loaded with marquee names. He could potentially receive a less favorable deal by waiting. These are the facts as I see it.

Re: GDT: Minnesota vs. Golden State

Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2022 12:52 pm
by AbeVigodaLive
Camden wrote:- Spencer Dinwiddie: three-years, $54-million (2021)
- Lonzo Ball: four-years, $80-million (2021)
- Fred VanVleet: four-years, $85-million (2020)
- Malcolm Brogdon: four-years, $89.3-million (2021)
- Kyle Lowry: three-years, $85-million (2021)
- DeMar DeRozan: three-years, $85-million (2021)
- Chris Paul: four-years, $120-million (2021)

The salary cap projections from last summer proved to be accurate and the market has been set for non-superstar guards. Minnesota could offer D'Angelo Russell the four-years, $100-million deal that's been mentioned here or even choose to go three-years, $85-million and allow him to retest free agency as a 30-year old, but the range of what he should be offered is in place already. We can go back and forth over his importance to this team and the statistics we choose to mention, but the fact of the matter is that the deals above show what his potential earnings are on the free market. Considering his durability concerns, it would behoove Russell and his agency to lock him into another long-term deal and provide financial security moving forward. He could always choose to bet on himself and play out his final year, but I'm not sure how much more he'd stand to earn in doing so when the 2023 free agent class appears to be loaded with marquee names. He could potentially receive a less favorable deal by waiting. These are the facts as I see it.



Hey. We agree on this stuff. I'm willing to go up to $100M for Russell.

Even then, I hope he's willing to take it (or even less) because I don't think he's worth $30M or more.

But I have my doubts. In fact, this could be a case of a franchise bidding against itself. We'll see how much influence the new guys have vs. the old guy with a history of terrible deals...

Re: GDT: Minnesota vs. Golden State

Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2022 8:17 pm
by Monster
FNG wrote:
AbeVigodaLive wrote:
Camden wrote:
AbeVigodaLive wrote:
Camden wrote:
thedoper wrote:





"De'Aron Fox is making $33M, $35M and $37M over the next three years. And you expect D. Russell to take a PAYCUT after he led the Timberwolves to only their 2nd winning season in 18 seasons?!?! You seriously expect us to believe that you traded for him at $30M/yr along with a lottery pick and now expect him to make less money after PROVING he's critical to your team's success? Go F yourself. My client is in his prime and wants a contract that starts at $33M annually with escalators or you can go kick rocks for another 18 years."


We love what D'Angelo Russell brings to the team -- his scoring ability and willingness to facilitate. We admire his leadership. D-Lo is someone we value very highly. Glen Taylor, Alex Rodriguez, Marc Lore, and myself would love to offer your client a four-year, $100-million deal. We feel that this accurately represents your client's value to our team, the fans, and the city of Minneapolis. We believe that he's a near-perfect fit alongside Karl-Anthony Towns and Anthony Edwards in the present and the future. We feel that he can help this team not only make the playoffs, but win a playoff series and contend in the Western Conference for years to come.

With that said, we have worries about your client's durability -- specifically his lower body injuries that have caused him to play in just 103 of 149 (69%) possible games since we acquired him from Golden State. Our medical staff is prepared to help Russell manage his lower body injuries and we feel confident we can keep him available in the future, but as an organization we have to protect ourselves and our investments. Furthermore, we feel that it's important to not only retain your client, but to also field a competitive team around him. That includes re-signing Karl-Anthony Towns and Anthony Edwards in the near future as well as making necessary additions to help bolster this roster as it continues to ascend in the NBA.

We value loyalty, family, and a commitment to winning. We feel your client is an embodiment of all three. We hope you seriously consider our offer and look forward to announcing our new deal.






So is this 20+% salary cut your final offer? We're disappointed that you haven't noticed that the Timberwolves are 29 - 20 when D'Angelo plays this season... but 5 - 9 when he sits. We're disappointed that you didn't mention the Wolves are 43 - 30 (.589) with D'Angelo on the court with Towns the past 2+ seasons, but hovering around .300 without our client.

We're disappointed that despite 75+ years of evidence that players' peak performance (and championship windows) usually happen when they reach 27 years old... you're expecting our 25-year-old client to take a 20+% pay cut from what he has been making even as teams finances are rebounding and salary caps rising.

Just let us know if negotiations will begin in earnest... so we'll know whether we need to begin doing so with other organizations. We too believe in family. And that's why as a head of this family, we believe our client deserves a larger slice of that meatloaf sitting on the table.


And if attendance is any interest to you, Marc and ARod, the Wolves are 16-6 at home when DLo plays and 3-6 when he doesn't.

Salary negotiations involve 2 aspects for NBA players...money, and pride...and the latter is often more important, because with any kind of discipline at all, money is not an issue for these guys. And I can't see DLo's pride allowing him to take a pay cut after what is unquestionably his finest season. So he makes a max salary as a guy with arguably mediocre advanced stats (some may argue against that, but many of his advanced stats prior to this season are average for the association or even below average). We expect him to be happy taking a pay cut now that his stats are vastly better than they have ever been before? Not likely. The Wolves' best chance of retaining KAT, DLo and Ant at the price tag they demand is if the new owners are willing to go deep into luxury tax land. We'll have to see if they have any appetite for that.


FNG I think an argument can be made that the Last season Russell was with the Nets was his best season. He was the best player on a 42-40 team that was a bit of a surprise. He played 81 games and had turned 23 in February. There was talk about him MAYBE be on sort of a Harden Trajectory. The Max contract he signed was for a terrific team in GS and wasn't actually that expensive in terms of max contracts. It's still less than Wiggins. That first max contract guys get is often based on them improving from where they already are.

Fast forward to this offseason. Russell is now 26 and has continued to have problems staying healthy. He did make some progress to becoming a star guard his first year after his max contract playing for the Warriors especially upping his FTs but since then...he has just been a good guard more in the realm of the 20 something million guards others have posted. Is there anyone that's thinks he is now going to morph into a star guard now? I could see him maybe be Jamal Murray type still but is anyone going to pay him 30 million in hoping for that?

Plus if he waits till his contract expires Russell will be 27 and he is a big PG that doesn't rely on athletic ability but he also has injury issues. So how long of a contract will a team give a guy like that? Will Russell he willing to bet on himself? Maybe, but I think we have seen some guards go for a nice multi-year deal instead of going for the most they could have gotten in a year or 2 down the road. Some of those guys hadn't made big money yet though so they likely wanted to cash in. There are also plenty of young or youngish players that really screwed up and waited and then got paid a fraction of what they were offered.

Another question is...what teams need a guard like Russell? There are a lot of guard out there. The team that comes to mind is maybe the Knicks. What if the guard spots fill up? I think some team would end up paying him pretty well but is it more or much more than the Wolves will offer him this offseason? What value is guaranteed money for possibly 4 years? What if the Wolves front load the contract and so he gets the money earlier?

Ultimately I think if Russell thinks he is a max player or anything near that I think he could be in for a bit of a rude awakening in basically a few months. Will the Wolves be willing to play hard ball? For the most part they were under Rosas. Sure Juancho got overpaid but it was for 2 years. Tyus got paid and they let him go. They played hardball with Vanderbilt and McLaughlin. Those are obviously much lesser players. Beasley they got him for a market value deal but they did act pretty quickly with him.

Only time will tell what will happen. I think there is a legit range of ways for the Russell contract situation to go. I'm trying not to be too optimistic about something getting done but I also think that a few months ago Russell was a guy that I wasn't certain what he was actually worth. His value has clearly gone up but is this real? I always believed in Russell to some extent but there is reason for skepticism about just how valuable he is at this point of his career even with the success the Wolves have had this season.

Re: GDT: Minnesota vs. Golden State

Posted: Sat Mar 05, 2022 2:04 am
by thedoper
Id just like to see a Wolves team stay together for once. My gut says we end up overpaying for Russel a bit but honestly I dont care. 3 or 4 more years of exciting basketball where the team continues to give the kind of effort they have put out this season is fine with me. Go Wolves.