KG4Ever wrote:Thibs left us with KAT, an injured Cov, a broken Wiggs and not much else and yet some complain when Ryan isn't winning every game. The sky must be falling.
True, don't forget the DIeng contract, Teague contract, input into drafting Okogie who didn't play, Dunn over Hield. Wiggins over LaVine. Butler for RoCo instead of trading up for Doncic (like we all wanted).
Could have had -
KAT
Collins
Doncic
Herro
LaVine
Wolves would avg 180 points a night.
We get Doncic becuase we would have lost so much? Great.
Traded into the top 3 giving up Butler and 1st round pick. That was my idea predraft. I would have kept LaVine and traded Wiggins. I would have drafted Markkanen. He can come off the bench.
Camden wrote:I'm not sure why anyone here is talking about Luka Doncic like the Wolves ever had a shot at him without moving on from Karl-Anthony Towns. Otherwise, he was never going to be here.
It was possible to trade up with Atlanta or 1-2. Butler and a 1st (maybe another 1st) might have gotten it done and yes I thought that was the move to make predraft. Butler was on his way out of here (after destroying the next season BTW) and then was the time to make a deal. Doncic was the obvious best player in that draft so I would have targeted him. I'm just reliving Thibs horrid history of mismanaging the team.
In all likelihood, this was never on the table. Think about it logically. Why would Phoenix, Sacramento, or Atlanta -- all teams firmly entrenched in a rebuild at the time -- make a "win now" move before they're ready to compete that also very much risked their future for one year of a player unlikely to re-sign with them? They wouldn't. It's a nice use of the imagination, but it had zero chance of actually happening. It's like criticizing Thibs for not signing LeBron James two summers ago. It's ridiculous.
Atlanta did trade out of their spot for one!!! Maybe Phoenix or Sacramento wanted to accelerate the process of rebuilding? Also they would have cap space to resign Butler, MN didn't!
The point is that Butler had to be moved prior to the draft. I said it at the time. This was prior to waiting till after the summer to see Butler blow up the team. You could have got another team involved as well. Just saying, Thibs was not worth criticizing for not getting it done isn't fair, because it was the logical move at the time.
Thibs even held onto Butler longer and longer and watched his trade value plummet while the team was imploding. It was a disaster you couldn't even make up. With some smart calculated moves we get rid of Butler while getting Doncic. It was certainly possible and the right move to try and make.
So yes, Thibs was a complete idiot and 99.9% of people would agree he mishandled the Butler situation.
Camden wrote:I'm not sure why anyone here is talking about Luka Doncic like the Wolves ever had a shot at him without moving on from Karl-Anthony Towns. Otherwise, he was never going to be here.
It was possible to trade up with Atlanta or 1-2. Butler and a 1st (maybe another 1st) might have gotten it done and yes I thought that was the move to make predraft. Butler was on his way out of here (after destroying the next season BTW) and then was the time to make a deal. Doncic was the obvious best player in that draft so I would have targeted him. I'm just reliving Thibs horrid history of mismanaging the team.
In all likelihood, this was never on the table. Think about it logically. Why would Phoenix, Sacramento, or Atlanta -- all teams firmly entrenched in a rebuild at the time -- make a "win now" move before they're ready to compete that also very much risked their future for one year of a player unlikely to re-sign with them? They wouldn't. It's a nice use of the imagination, but it had zero chance of actually happening. It's like criticizing Thibs for not signing LeBron James two summers ago. It's ridiculous.
Atlanta did trade out of their spot for one!!! Maybe Phoenix or Sacramento wanted to accelerate the process of rebuilding? Also they would have cap space to resign Butler, MN didn't!
The point is that Butler had to be moved prior to the draft. I said it at the time. This was prior to waiting till after the summer to see Butler blow up the team. You could have got another team involved as well. Just saying, Thibs was not worth criticizing for not getting it done isn't fair, because it was the logical move at the time.
Thibs even held onto Butler longer and longer and watched his trade value plummet while the team was imploding. It was a disaster you couldn't even make up. With some smart calculated moves we get rid of Butler while getting Doncic. It was certainly possible and the right move to try and make.
So yes, Thibs was a complete idiot and 99.9% of people would agree he mishandled the Butler situation.
We have been over this what pick we could have gotten for Butler many many times and nobody has changed their minds on what value he would have brought back. Not everyone agrees on that.
Meanwhile you have a guy picked 11th in SGA that's putting up over 20ppg for OKC. There were other guys people were willing to trade Butler to get pick to draft like Kevin Knox or Mo Bamba. Looks like Bamba has been a disaster pick so far. Knox hasn't broke through yet. Covington my himself might have more value than they guy could have ended up with drafting if we had dealt Butler although we probably would have gotten something back if it was a lower pick. If the Wolves build assets and solid players we can get were we need to go especially if Wiggins is semi legit.
Camden wrote:I'm not sure why anyone here is talking about Luka Doncic like the Wolves ever had a shot at him without moving on from Karl-Anthony Towns. Otherwise, he was never going to be here.
It was possible to trade up with Atlanta or 1-2. Butler and a 1st (maybe another 1st) might have gotten it done and yes I thought that was the move to make predraft. Butler was on his way out of here (after destroying the next season BTW) and then was the time to make a deal. Doncic was the obvious best player in that draft so I would have targeted him. I'm just reliving Thibs horrid history of mismanaging the team.
In all likelihood, this was never on the table. Think about it logically. Why would Phoenix, Sacramento, or Atlanta -- all teams firmly entrenched in a rebuild at the time -- make a "win now" move before they're ready to compete that also very much risked their future for one year of a player unlikely to re-sign with them? They wouldn't. It's a nice use of the imagination, but it had zero chance of actually happening. It's like criticizing Thibs for not signing LeBron James two summers ago. It's ridiculous.
Atlanta did trade out of their spot for one!!! Maybe Phoenix or Sacramento wanted to accelerate the process of rebuilding? Also they would have cap space to resign Butler, MN didn't!
The point is that Butler had to be moved prior to the draft. I said it at the time. This was prior to waiting till after the summer to see Butler blow up the team. You could have got another team involved as well. Just saying, Thibs was not worth criticizing for not getting it done isn't fair, because it was the logical move at the time.
Thibs even held onto Butler longer and longer and watched his trade value plummet while the team was imploding. It was a disaster you couldn't even make up. With some smart calculated moves we get rid of Butler while getting Doncic. It was certainly possible and the right move to try and make.
So yes, Thibs was a complete idiot and 99.9% of people would agree he mishandled the Butler situation.
We have been over this what pick we could have gotten for Butler many many times and nobody has changed their minds on what value he would have brought back. Not everyone agrees on that.
Meanwhile you have a guy picked 11th in SGA that's putting up over 20ppg for OKC. There were other guys people were willing to trade Butler to get pick to draft like Kevin Knox or Mo Bamba. Looks like Bamba has been a disaster pick so far. Knox hasn't broke through yet. Covington my himself might have more value than they guy could have ended up with drafting if we had dealt Butler although we probably would have gotten something back if it was a lower pick. If the Wolves build assets and solid players we can get were we need to go especially if Wiggins is semi legit.
If you were just trading Butler for a pick who knows. Houston offered 4 1st round picks for him plus Gordon. Late rounders in all likelihood though is what they would have been.
kekgeek1 wrote:I was at the game last night. About 4 rows up from the wolves bench. Here are some observations.
I met Jim P. My buddies dad knows him. He is the pro-shop guy at the pines. So Jim P came up and talked to us for about 10 minutes before the game. What I thought is cool.
My buddies dad also texts Jim P during the games and he responses during the broadcast what I thought was funny.
Jake Layman rolls his eyes all game at the stupidity of this team. Guys don't know where they are going and layman rolls his eyes. It's pretty funny.
Teague was pissed when he was benched at the 8 minute mark of the 4th quarter. Came to the bench during a timeout and hit his hand against the chair and sat by himself when the team was in the huddle.
Jordan Bell is such a goofball. He accidently hit Saunders in the face during a timeout. I understand now why he dosen't get playing time.
I'm not shocked Clemmons had a good game. He was the nation's leading scorer last year. He is just short so guys can shoot over him. In the other game he got extended minutes he scored an efficient 16 pts.
I feel like Ryan doesn't have a feel for the game. Wolves were down 10 with 10 minutes left and rockets just brought in harden. And Saunders refused to put Cov or towns back in. Then when they retuned the game was over.
Also don't understand the lack of towns post touches they couldn't stop him
Fun take sounds like the Jim Pete experience saved the night on a rather poor game to attend.
Ryan has been making some mistakes he's super young and I think he will self evaluate and learn his way in the league in due time. The hardest part for me watching the past two games was the lack of defense and relative low Towns use in games he should have dominated. If you don't want to post him up for spacing then fine but he can handle the ball well and attack outright or even use a pick himself.
Camden0916 wrote:Jake Layman shouldn't be any team's second-best shooter from deep. You'd think Minnesota would invest in a flamethrower in the draft at some point considering they never improve anyone's shot while they're here.
