longstrangetrip wrote:Kent Youngblood writes today about the Wolves' 4th quarter woes, and the numbers are even worse than I would have thought. Here are the ratings for the Wolves in the first 3 quarters compared to their ratings in the 4th:
Quarters 1-3: Offense 109.8 (4th in the league), Defense 104.8 (15th), Overall Plus 5.0 (5th)
These numbers are astonishing, and need to be understood to really predict where this team is going this year...and what has to change. Last year, many here gave Thibs a pass and blamed the 4th quarter collapses on our youth or Rubio's poor shooting hurting our offense at the end of games...I scoffed at this idea. Now we have added 3 veterans to our starting lineup (and the lineup that Thibs almost always closes games with) and replaced Ricky with a better shooter and, if anything, our 4th quarter performance has gotten even worse. So, what's really going on here?
In the article, Thibs talks about ball movement as the culprit, but what is he doing about it? I obviously think the issue is his ridiculously out-of-step rotations which leave our stars hopelessly overmatched at the end of games...on offense and defense. Is Thibs capable of coaching us out of this bizarre occurrence? Does anyone here have another believable reason for our being one of the best teams in the league in quarters 1-3, and the absolute worst in the 4th?
The numbers don't lie. Talent prevails early in games, and coaching prevails at crunch time. When will Glen begin to understand this and do something about it?
I didn't know the numbers were that stark, but I'm not surprised. It's coaching. And something needs to be done if this team is going to achieve its full potential.
Game vs. Orlando supports Thibs getting outcoached. Magic started resting starters at 6 minute mark of 3rd Q. Thibs started four minutes later. 4th Q, we started with five subs and Magic brought back five starters. They went on run and we panicked and brought back starters with three minutes rest. As a result, we saw missed free throws, sloppy ball-handling, and slow defense. All signs of tired players.
On another note, Teague is not the PG we need. It's not pick-and-roll with him, it's pick-and-shoot. Even if he makes an early pass, once it comes back it's dribble the clock down. This is not a defense of Rubio - merely suggesting we need better than Teague to go deep in the playoffs.
I think this team will be in the playoffs and play better as the season goes along, but will be tired in the playoffs and exit early.
petecorcoran wrote:Game vs. Orlando supports Thibs getting outcoached. Magic started resting starters at 6 minute mark of 3rd Q. Thibs started four minutes later. 4th Q, we started with five subs and Magic brought back five starters. They went on run and we panicked and brought back starters with three minutes rest. As a result, we saw missed free throws, sloppy ball-handling, and slow defense. All signs of tired players.
On another note, Teague is not the PG we need. It's not pick-and-roll with him, it's pick-and-shoot. Even if he makes an early pass, once it comes back it's dribble the clock down. This is not a defense of Rubio - merely suggesting we need better than Teague to go deep in the playoffs.
I think this team will be in the playoffs and play better as the season goes along, but will be tired in the playoffs and exit early.
Good to hear from you Pete and good observations. You should come around more often!
It's hard for me to say Teague is the problem. I do think he isn't as "natural" of a passer as say Rubio was or even Tyus Jones. But he does good enough for what this team needs on paper. It would help if KAT actually set good picks. Teague's defender gets around KAT's picks with ease on most occasions. That is a real underrated skill, but I think it was 538 (?) or some other publication by some smart people that broke down how Al Horford's ability to set good picks is a massive asset for the Celtics offense. It's another one of those little things KAT struggles at. It seems like unless it's recorded on a box score, KAT doesn't care too much about it.....
petecorcoran wrote:Game vs. Orlando supports Thibs getting outcoached. Magic started resting starters at 6 minute mark of 3rd Q. Thibs started four minutes later. 4th Q, we started with five subs and Magic brought back five starters. They went on run and we panicked and brought back starters with three minutes rest. As a result, we saw missed free throws, sloppy ball-handling, and slow defense. All signs of tired players.
On another note, Teague is not the PG we need. It's not pick-and-roll with him, it's pick-and-shoot. Even if he makes an early pass, once it comes back it's dribble the clock down. This is not a defense of Rubio - merely suggesting we need better than Teague to go deep in the playoffs.
I think this team will be in the playoffs and play better as the season goes along, but will be tired in the playoffs and exit early.
Good to hear from you Pete and good observations. You should come around more often!
It's hard for me to say Teague is the problem. I do think he isn't as "natural" of a passer as say Rubio was or even Tyus Jones. But he does good enough for what this team needs on paper. It would help if KAT actually set good picks. Teague's defender gets around KAT's picks with ease on most occasions. That is a real underrated skill, but I think it was 538 (?) or some other publication by some smart people that broke down how Al Horford's ability to set good picks is a massive asset for the Celtics offense. It's another one of those little things KAT struggles at. It seems like unless it's recorded on a box score, KAT doesn't care too much about it.....
The Wolves are like bottom 5 in the league in screen assists.
petecorcoran wrote:Game vs. Orlando supports Thibs getting outcoached. Magic started resting starters at 6 minute mark of 3rd Q. Thibs started four minutes later. 4th Q, we started with five subs and Magic brought back five starters. They went on run and we panicked and brought back starters with three minutes rest. As a result, we saw missed free throws, sloppy ball-handling, and slow defense. All signs of tired players.
On another note, Teague is not the PG we need. It's not pick-and-roll with him, it's pick-and-shoot. Even if he makes an early pass, once it comes back it's dribble the clock down. This is not a defense of Rubio - merely suggesting we need better than Teague to go deep in the playoffs.
I think this team will be in the playoffs and play better as the season goes along, but will be tired in the playoffs and exit early.
Good to hear from you Pete and good observations. You should come around more often!
It's hard for me to say Teague is the problem. I do think he isn't as "natural" of a passer as say Rubio was or even Tyus Jones. But he does good enough for what this team needs on paper. It would help if KAT actually set good picks. Teague's defender gets around KAT's picks with ease on most occasions. That is a real underrated skill, but I think it was 538 (?) or some other publication by some smart people that broke down how Al Horford's ability to set good picks is a massive asset for the Celtics offense. It's another one of those little things KAT struggles at. It seems like unless it's recorded on a box score, KAT doesn't care too much about it.....
The Wolves are like bottom 5 in the league in screen assists.
I didn't know that, but hardly a shock. LST was mentioning Cole Aldrich earlier....Now that guy knows how to set screens.
petecorcoran wrote:Game vs. Orlando supports Thibs getting outcoached. Magic started resting starters at 6 minute mark of 3rd Q. Thibs started four minutes later. 4th Q, we started with five subs and Magic brought back five starters. They went on run and we panicked and brought back starters with three minutes rest. As a result, we saw missed free throws, sloppy ball-handling, and slow defense. All signs of tired players.
On another note, Teague is not the PG we need. It's not pick-and-roll with him, it's pick-and-shoot. Even if he makes an early pass, once it comes back it's dribble the clock down. This is not a defense of Rubio - merely suggesting we need better than Teague to go deep in the playoffs.
I think this team will be in the playoffs and play better as the season goes along, but will be tired in the playoffs and exit early.
Good to hear from you Pete and good observations. You should come around more often!
It's hard for me to say Teague is the problem. I do think he isn't as "natural" of a passer as say Rubio was or even Tyus Jones. But he does good enough for what this team needs on paper. It would help if KAT actually set good picks. Teague's defender gets around KAT's picks with ease on most occasions. That is a real underrated skill, but I think it was 538 (?) or some other publication by some smart people that broke down how Al Horford's ability to set good picks is a massive asset for the Celtics offense. It's another one of those little things KAT struggles at. It seems like unless it's recorded on a box score, KAT doesn't care too much about it.....
The Wolves are like bottom 5 in the league in screen assists.
I didn't know that, but hardly a shock. LST was mentioning Cole Aldrich earlier....Now that guy knows how to set screens.
Yep. I miss Pek and Dieng is much better than Towns. It seems like there was a recent stretch where Town was doing much better in the screen game.
petecorcoran wrote:Game vs. Orlando supports Thibs getting outcoached. Magic started resting starters at 6 minute mark of 3rd Q. Thibs started four minutes later. 4th Q, we started with five subs and Magic brought back five starters. They went on run and we panicked and brought back starters with three minutes rest. As a result, we saw missed free throws, sloppy ball-handling, and slow defense. All signs of tired players.
On another note, Teague is not the PG we need. It's not pick-and-roll with him, it's pick-and-shoot. Even if he makes an early pass, once it comes back it's dribble the clock down. This is not a defense of Rubio - merely suggesting we need better than Teague to go deep in the playoffs.
I think this team will be in the playoffs and play better as the season goes along, but will be tired in the playoffs and exit early.
Good to hear from you Pete and good observations. You should come around more often!
It's hard for me to say Teague is the problem. I do think he isn't as "natural" of a passer as say Rubio was or even Tyus Jones. But he does good enough for what this team needs on paper. It would help if KAT actually set good picks. Teague's defender gets around KAT's picks with ease on most occasions. That is a real underrated skill, but I think it was 538 (?) or some other publication by some smart people that broke down how Al Horford's ability to set good picks is a massive asset for the Celtics offense. It's another one of those little things KAT struggles at. It seems like unless it's recorded on a box score, KAT doesn't care too much about it.....
The Wolves are like bottom 5 in the league in screen assists.
I didn't know that, but hardly a shock. LST was mentioning Cole Aldrich earlier....Now that guy knows how to set screens.
petecorcoran wrote:Game vs. Orlando supports Thibs getting outcoached. Magic started resting starters at 6 minute mark of 3rd Q. Thibs started four minutes later. 4th Q, we started with five subs and Magic brought back five starters. They went on run and we panicked and brought back starters with three minutes rest. As a result, we saw missed free throws, sloppy ball-handling, and slow defense. All signs of tired players.
On another note, Teague is not the PG we need. It's not pick-and-roll with him, it's pick-and-shoot. Even if he makes an early pass, once it comes back it's dribble the clock down. This is not a defense of Rubio - merely suggesting we need better than Teague to go deep in the playoffs.
I think this team will be in the playoffs and play better as the season goes along, but will be tired in the playoffs and exit early.
Good to hear from you Pete and good observations. You should come around more often!
It's hard for me to say Teague is the problem. I do think he isn't as "natural" of a passer as say Rubio was or even Tyus Jones. But he does good enough for what this team needs on paper. It would help if KAT actually set good picks. Teague's defender gets around KAT's picks with ease on most occasions. That is a real underrated skill, but I think it was 538 (?) or some other publication by some smart people that broke down how Al Horford's ability to set good picks is a massive asset for the Celtics offense. It's another one of those little things KAT struggles at. It seems like unless it's recorded on a box score, KAT doesn't care too much about it.....
The Wolves are like bottom 5 in the league in screen assists.
I didn't know that, but hardly a shock. LST was mentioning Cole Aldrich earlier....Now that guy knows how to set screens.
petecorcoran wrote:Game vs. Orlando supports Thibs getting outcoached. Magic started resting starters no at 6 minute mark of 3rd Q. Thibs started four minutes later. 4th Q, we started with five subs and Magic brought back five starters. They went on run and we panicked and brought back starters with three minutes rest. As a result, we saw missed free throws, sloppy ball-handling, and slow defense. All signs of tired players.
On another note, Teague is not the PG we need. It's not pick-and-roll with him, it's pick-and-shoot. Even if he makes an early pass, once it comes back it's dribble the clock down. This is not a defense of Rubio - merely suggesting we need better than Teague to go deep in the playoffs.
I think this team will be in the playoffs and play better as the season goes along, but will be tired in the playoffs and exit early.
Good to hear from you Pete and good observations. You should come around more often!
It's hard for me to say Teague is the problem. I do think he isn't as "natural" of a passer as say Rubio was or even Tyus Jones. But he does good enough for what this team needs on paper. It would help if KAT actually set good picks. Teague's defender gets around KAT's picks with ease on most occasions. That is a real underrated skill, but I think it was 538 (?) or some other publication by some smart people that broke down how Al Horford's ability to set good picks is a massive asset for the Celtics offense. It's another one of those little things KAT struggles at. It seems like unless it's recorded on a box score, KAT doesn't care too much about it.....
The Wolves are like bottom 5 in the league in screen assists.
I didn't know that, but hardly a shock. LST was mentioning Cole Aldrich earlier....Now that guy knows how to set screens.
petecorcoran wrote:Game vs. Orlando supports Thibs getting outcoached. Magic started resting starters at 6 minute mark of 3rd Q. Thibs started four minutes later. 4th Q, we started with five subs and Magic brought back five starters. They went on run and we panicked and brought back starters with three minutes rest. As a result, we saw missed free throws, sloppy ball-handling, and slow defense. All signs of tired players.
On another note, Teague is not the PG we need. It's not pick-and-roll with him, it's pick-and-shoot. Even if he makes an early pass, once it comes back it's dribble the clock down. This is not a defense of Rubio - merely suggesting we need better than Teague to go deep in the playoffs.
I think this team will be in the playoffs and play better as the season goes along, but will be tired in the playoffs and exit early.
Good to hear from you Pete and good observations. You should come around more often!
It's hard for me to say Teague is the problem. I do think he isn't as "natural" of a passer as say Rubio was or even Tyus Jones. But he does good enough for what this team needs on paper. It would help if KAT actually set good picks. Teague's defender gets around KAT's picks with ease on most occasions. That is a real underrated skill, but I think it was 538 (?) or some other publication by some smart people that broke down how Al Horford's ability to set good picks is a massive asset for the Celtics offense. It's another one of those little things KAT struggles at. It seems like unless it's recorded on a box score, KAT doesn't care too much about it.....
The Wolves are like bottom 5 in the league in screen assists.
I didn't know that, but hardly a shock. LST was mentioning Cole Aldrich earlier....Now that guy knows how to set screens.
Let's all get on board the Cole train!
Ha, love it!
Screening is such an underrated skill. I love how Horford is getting a lot of credit for the Celtics' offense because of his effective screening. Cole will never be 1/4 the offensive player KAT is, but he does screen well and plays tough defense. I'd like to see Thibs play him when KAT is playing so poorly.
