Martin Officially on the Trading Block

[bleedspeed]

Latest from Hoop Hype.

http://hoopshype.com/2016/01/07/kevin-martin-may-be-on-the-move/

[bleedspeed]

Looks like Houston is looking to trade Mr Jones.

Terrence Jones, Rockets

The Rockets got Josh Smith back and figure to use him heavily, and expect Donatas Motiejunas back for the stretch run to boot. With Clint Capela as a rotation mainstay, Terrence Jones' days are numbered. He's set to be a restricted free agent (much more enticing than unrestricted for a team that might want to keep him) after this season, and when he's confident, he can knock down open 3-pointers and drive with physicality to the hoop.

Though he can block shots and make some eye-opening defensive plays, he's unable to stand up physically to the more skilled power forwards out there. But for a team that could give him consistent minutes, he could possibly find his way. He's certainly got NBA skills, and he's still young. More importantly for his placement here, GM Daryl Morey is never afraid to make moves.

http://news.yahoo.com/players-might-moved-nba-trade-164002176.html

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

Looks like Houston is looking to trade Mr Jones.

Terrence Jones, Rockets

The Rockets got Josh Smith back and figure to use him heavily, and expect Donatas Motiejunas back for the stretch run to boot. With Clint Capela as a rotation mainstay, Terrence Jones' days are numbered. He's set to be a restricted free agent (much more enticing than unrestricted for a team that might want to keep him) after this season, and when he's confident, he can knock down open 3-pointers and drive with physicality to the hoop.

Though he can block shots and make some eye-opening defensive plays, he's unable to stand up physically to the more skilled power forwards out there. But for a team that could give him consistent minutes, he could possibly find his way. He's certainly got NBA skills, and he's still young. More importantly for his placement here, GM Daryl Morey is never afraid to make moves.

http://news.yahoo.com/players-might-moved-nba-trade-164002176.html

Seems like a bit of an enigma. He started a bunch of games for Houston in his second season and put up some nice numbers. Ever since then, his playing time and performance has been uneven.

It's a cautionary tale - not all young players just keep getting better. Some peak somewhat early and then tail off. Some never improve at all. And others really do follow a more linear path of improvement.

Speaking of guys that didn't follow the traditional lifecycle of a player, I recall seeing Ronnie Brewer play in one of those D-League games when Tyus was sent down. Remember Ronnie Brewer? He had a tremendously productive couple of years starting for Utah very early in his career and then gradually fizzled out. At 30, he's toiling away in the D-League. What the hell happened?

[MikkeMan]

Seems like a bit of an enigma. He started a bunch of games for Houston in his second season and put up some nice numbers. Ever since then, his playing time and performance has been uneven.

It's a cautionary tale - not all young players just keep getting better. Some peak somewhat early and then tail off. Some never improve at all. And others really do follow a more linear path of improvement.

Speaking of guys that didn't follow the traditional lifecycle of a player, I recall seeing Ronnie Brewer play in one of those D-League games when Tyus was sent down. Remember Ronnie Brewer? He had a tremendously productive couple of years starting for Utah very early in his career and then gradually fizzled out. At 30, he's toiling away in the D-League. What the hell happened?

Still if we would be able to swap Martin for Jones (and some scrub to get contracts matching), we should make that trade. He seems that kind of young and promising although inconsistent player, Wolves should try. We could give Jones some playtime as stretch four and we would get basically free preview whether we should try to sign him next summer when his contract ends. If he wouldn't show enough, we would just not sign him and then we would have more cap room to sign someone else. There would not be downside in that trade.

[AbeVigodaLive]

Seems like a bit of an enigma. He started a bunch of games for Houston in his second season and put up some nice numbers. Ever since then, his playing time and performance has been uneven.

It's a cautionary tale - not all young players just keep getting better. Some peak somewhat early and then tail off. Some never improve at all. And others really do follow a more linear path of improvement.

Speaking of guys that didn't follow the traditional lifecycle of a player, I recall seeing Ronnie Brewer play in one of those D-League games when Tyus was sent down. Remember Ronnie Brewer? He had a tremendously productive couple of years starting for Utah very early in his career and then gradually fizzled out. At 30, he's toiling away in the D-League. What the hell happened?

Still if we would be able to swap Martin for Jones (and some scrub to get contracts matching), we should make that trade. He seems that kind of young and promising although inconsistent player, Wolves should try. We could give Jones some playtime as stretch four and we would get basically free preview whether we should try to sign him next summer when his contract ends. If he wouldn't show enough, we would just not sign him and then we would have more cap room to sign someone else. There would not be downside in that trade.

I don't see how Martin and Jones are anywhere near a match for a trade. Teams interested in Jones will see his promise and potential and that's why they want him. Martin is on a pretty steep downward slide. I don't know why Houston would want to give up that much value for so little in return.

[Hicks123 [enjin:6700838]]

Seems like a bit of an enigma. He started a bunch of games for Houston in his second season and put up some nice numbers. Ever since then, his playing time and performance has been uneven.

It's a cautionary tale - not all young players just keep getting better. Some peak somewhat early and then tail off. Some never improve at all. And others really do follow a more linear path of improvement.

Speaking of guys that didn't follow the traditional lifecycle of a player, I recall seeing Ronnie Brewer play in one of those D-League games when Tyus was sent down. Remember Ronnie Brewer? He had a tremendously productive couple of years starting for Utah very early in his career and then gradually fizzled out. At 30, he's toiling away in the D-League. What the hell happened?

Still if we would be able to swap Martin for Jones (and some scrub to get contracts matching), we should make that trade. He seems that kind of young and promising although inconsistent player, Wolves should try. We could give Jones some playtime as stretch four and we would get basically free preview whether we should try to sign him next summer when his contract ends. If he wouldn't show enough, we would just not sign him and then we would have more cap room to sign someone else. There would not be downside in that trade.

I don't see how Martin and Jones are anywhere near a match for a trade. Teams interested in Jones will see his promise and potential and that's why they want him. Martin is on a pretty steep downward slide. I don't know why Houston would want to give up that much value for so little in return.

I think this board has surprisingly gone to a place where everyone is overvaluing other teams scrubs (or at best, moderate players), while totally discounting a guy like Martin. Even in the thread about free agents for next year....there were ridiculous dollars being talked about for guys like Tyler Johnson for $8MM per, Mahinmi for $10MM per, Dwight Powell for $8MM per, etc, etc. Those guys are all minimal players. Is Martini limited at this point? Yes. But his value should be fairly high for the right playoff bound team that needs a VETERAN shooter. He will reliably provide exactly what he has given us, a shooter that can play immediately and provide instant scoring. I don't think Jones is unrealistic at all. It all comes down to which guy provides more value this year for Houston. I would argue they need Martin more than Jones for the remainder of the season. Will other teams value Jones more? Maybe, but as stated, he has really flatlined. I was high on him a year ago, but he is certainly not a guaranteed starter moving forward, and with impending RFA status, his value for a team like the Rockets is diminished.

We have a serious case of "the grass is greener" syndrome. It's very rarely greener...just different.

[Porckchop]

If this was last year I'd agree with you Hicks, but Martins a year older and regressed to the point of being useless on the court . His ability to score made me turn a blind eye to all of his other warts, but what is left when his shot isn't falling?

[rapsuperstar31]

I think this board has surprisingly gone to a place where everyone is overvaluing other teams scrubs (or at best, moderate players), while totally discounting a guy like Martin. Even in the thread about free agents for next year....there were ridiculous dollars being talked about for guys like Tyler Johnson for $8MM per, Mahinmi for $10MM per, Dwight Powell for $8MM per, etc, etc. Those guys are all minimal players. Is Martini limited at this point? Yes. But his value should be fairly high for the right playoff bound team that needs a VETERAN shooter. He will reliably provide exactly what he has given us, a shooter that can play immediately and provide instant scoring. I don't think Jones is unrealistic at all. It all comes down to which guy provides more value this year for Houston. I would argue they need Martin more than Jones for the remainder of the season. Will other teams value Jones more? Maybe, but as stated, he has really flatlined. I was high on him a year ago, but he is certainly not a guaranteed starter moving forward, and with impending RFA status, his value for a team like the Rockets is diminished.

We have a serious case of "the grass is greener" syndrome. It's very rarely greener...just different.

Yes and no, marginal players might be slightly overvalued and Martin does have some value although his playing abilities are falling fast. If you give Powell 8MM next year when the cap is 90 million that is only 8.8% of the cap or the equivalent of 6.2MM in today' caps, or 5.5MM in last years cap. If it is 8MM the following year when the salary cap is 108MM its only 7.4% of the cap which is only 5.18MM in today's cap or 4.6MM of last years cap. If Martin starts hitting his shots he has value to us, but does us no good in his current form. Jones would be a good fit here, not sure he will be worth his market value though. If we could trade for him on the cheap I wouldn't mind a look at him playing next to Towns to see if he worth signing to a big contract, but I would not give up a big bounty for him in case we decide not to resign him.

[AbeVigodaLive]

Seems like a bit of an enigma. He started a bunch of games for Houston in his second season and put up some nice numbers. Ever since then, his playing time and performance has been uneven.

It's a cautionary tale - not all young players just keep getting better. Some peak somewhat early and then tail off. Some never improve at all. And others really do follow a more linear path of improvement.

Speaking of guys that didn't follow the traditional lifecycle of a player, I recall seeing Ronnie Brewer play in one of those D-League games when Tyus was sent down. Remember Ronnie Brewer? He had a tremendously productive couple of years starting for Utah very early in his career and then gradually fizzled out. At 30, he's toiling away in the D-League. What the hell happened?

Still if we would be able to swap Martin for Jones (and some scrub to get contracts matching), we should make that trade. He seems that kind of young and promising although inconsistent player, Wolves should try. We could give Jones some playtime as stretch four and we would get basically free preview whether we should try to sign him next summer when his contract ends. If he wouldn't show enough, we would just not sign him and then we would have more cap room to sign someone else. There would not be downside in that trade.

I don't see how Martin and Jones are anywhere near a match for a trade. Teams interested in Jones will see his promise and potential and that's why they want him. Martin is on a pretty steep downward slide. I don't know why Houston would want to give up that much value for so little in return.

I think this board has surprisingly gone to a place where everyone is overvaluing other teams scrubs (or at best, moderate players), while totally discounting a guy like Martin. Even in the thread about free agents for next year....there were ridiculous dollars being talked about for guys like Tyler Johnson for $8MM per, Mahinmi for $10MM per, Dwight Powell for $8MM per, etc, etc. Those guys are all minimal players. Is Martini limited at this point? Yes. But his value should be fairly high for the right playoff bound team that needs a VETERAN shooter. He will reliably provide exactly what he has given us, a shooter that can play immediately and provide instant scoring. I don't think Jones is unrealistic at all. It all comes down to which guy provides more value this year for Houston. I would argue they need Martin more than Jones for the remainder of the season. Will other teams value Jones more? Maybe, but as stated, he has really flatlined. I was high on him a year ago, but he is certainly not a guaranteed starter moving forward, and with impending RFA status, his value for a team like the Rockets is diminished.

We have a serious case of "the grass is greener" syndrome. It's very rarely greener...just different.

To be fair, I'm not claiming Jones is the cat's meow or anything close to that. I'm only pointing out his value around the league compared to Martin.

Houston can get more than Martin for him. After all, it's possible Martin can be had for a 2nd round pick or two.

So why give up a guy like Jones who will have value with other teams for Martin?


[Note: Remember, Houston was able to get Corey Brewer pretty easily. And Josh Smith 2x. That's a team that targets easy-to-get vets. Not one who gives up a 23-year-old who as recently as 2 months ago was considered a lock for a $50 - 60M contract this summer.]

[worldK]

Martin has become useless on the court and a negative trade value by himself. It's not just us that sees that but everyone else.

The best we could get for martin at this point without packaging him with ine of our young promising guys is a 2nd round pick with a guarantee by martin that he will opt out of his deal for next season for the other team to agree to take him. That is the sad reality.

I don't see martin opting out for next year as even with a big salary cap jump, I don't see martin getting 7m from any team. Martin knows this as well and he ain't gambling on himself. A buyout is a more likely scenario at this point. He has become useless to our team that I just want him gone and look at it as an addition by subtraction.