Page 1 of 1

Damn... you didn't have to murder them and then set the bodies on fire.

Posted: Sun Jan 01, 2023 12:47 pm
by AbeVigodaLive
"No matter how hard you look, wanting to see some pride, some heart, some understanding of the hole they are digging and the laughter they are eliciting from the rest of the league, it just hasn't been there nearly often enough."

"The biggest issue this team faces is that when they have to dig deep to find some reservoir of gumption, guts and heart in an effort to overcome an obstacle in front of them, they not only have trouble locating any of it, but they also seemingly don't want to do the digging in the first place."

"It's not about coaching or talent, X's or O's. It's about getting punched in the mouth repeatedly and just not mustering the give-a-damn to punch back."

"The Wolves may have more collective talent than last year's team. But the thing that drove that team to overachieve was the fire in the eyes. That team wanted to fight. That team had pride and will, all the intangibles you could ever want. Right now, you look in this team's eyes and there is nothing there."

"The Timberwolves have hit rock bottom."

Re: Damn... you didn't have to murder them and then set the bodies on fire.

Posted: Sun Jan 01, 2023 12:51 pm
by AbeVigodaLive
Jon Krawczynski going all-in on the Timberwolves players in his write-up in The Athletic.

The best beat writers (and play-by-play guys) aren't afraid to offer criticisms amid the fawning. But the article today was especially harsh, in large part, because it wasn't about basketball stuff.

That should not be discounted. A guy like Krawczynki needs access from the Timberwolves and its players to remain the team's most known and connected beat writer. So, if Krawzynski doesn't have another job lined up (nationally?), this is a very revealing article.

It suggests he was given clearance to go all-in on the heart of the players... by either the star players and/or the front office.

Things may be bleak... but at least they're getting interesting in a TMZ sort of way.



[EDIT: Jon K responded to a few people in the comments of his piece in The Athletic... and most seem to be defending Tim Connelly. So maybe we know who pushed/agreed to having the "players' effort is the problem" article written.]

Re: Damn... you didn't have to murder them and then set the bodies on fire.

Posted: Sun Jan 01, 2023 2:24 pm
by thedoper
Changes better come quick to protect Ant. We start losing him and close up magician Mark Lore is going to make this team disappear to Telosa.

Re: Damn... you didn't have to murder them and then set the bodies on fire.

Posted: Sun Jan 01, 2023 5:00 pm
by Monster
It's an exception to the rule but it's hard not to think back to last season when the Celtics were floundering (had just a couple more wins at the same point) and there were far from positive things happening around that team which had some significant organizational changes. They made some changes but it seems mostly that they turned things around with the players and coach they had (then that coach the next offseason got suspended by the team) and ended up in the Finals. In the Article by Jon K the other interested things was the comments by Naz Reid.

Will there be a turnaround or will this team keep limping around? Idk but again last year it looked like multiple points in the Celtics last season it looked like that group just wasn't gonna be good enough and that doesn't seem to be the case now.

Re: Damn... you didn't have to murder them and then set the bodies on fire.

Posted: Sun Jan 01, 2023 6:26 pm
by AbeVigodaLive
monsterpile wrote:It's an exception to the rule but it's hard not to think back to last season when the Celtics were floundering (had just a couple more wins at the same point) and there were far from positive things happening around that team which had some significant organizational changes. They made some changes but it seems mostly that they turned things around with the players and coach they had (then that coach the next offseason got suspended by the team) and ended up in the Finals. In the Article by Jon K the other interested things was the comments by Naz Reid.

Will there be a turnaround or will this team keep limping around? Idk but again last year it looked like multiple points in the Celtics last season it looked like that group just wasn't gonna be good enough and that doesn't seem to be the case now.


Many believe the Celtics turnaround was the greatest midseason turnaround in NBA history.

Are we really holding out hope for a nearly unprecedented event happening... again? Remember, the Celtics had A LOT of success with its key players, including an ever-improving Brown and Tatum.

The Timberwolves don't even know when its best player is returning from injury.

Re: Damn... you didn't have to murder them and then set the bodies on fire.

Posted: Sun Jan 01, 2023 11:09 pm
by Lipoli390
Very interesting to see Jon K unleash such a fury at the team he covers. I agree with Abe that Jon must have received clearance (or at least a wink and a nod) from the front office to publish the article.

Particularly interesting was Jon's phrase, "the Wolves may have more collective talent than last year's team . . ..". I thought his choice of the term "may" was the interesting part. Jon is very smart and a terrific writer who chooses his words carefully. His main point is that core problem with this team has nothing to do with talent. But Jon wasn't willing to say that this team actually is more talented than last season. The sad truth is that this team is NOT more talented. I'll take the collective talent of Vando, Beverley and Beasley any day over Gobert and the other players TC added. Of course, it's hard to precisely calibrate talent level. So I'll just come back to the fact that the collective talent last season added up to a better team.

Regarding Jon K's point about this team lacking gumption or heart, I'll say that Edwards, KAT and McDaniels are the same guys they were last season, except that Edwards and McDaniels (especially Edwards) are playing better. Those three core players didn't suddenly lose their heart or toughness. But instead of playing with three guys oozing toughness and heart - Beverley, Vando and Beasley - they're playing with Gobert who is the antithesis of tough. He routinely gets outmuscled and the ball ripped from his hands by smaller players. He's the guy who whined the first time he heard boos from the home crowed even though the team, including Rudy, was putrid in that half and clearly deserved those boos. Rudy is barely averaging over 1 block a game and guards have been driving the lane and shooting over him. He developed a reputation in the carefully crafted cocoon the Jazz constructed for him - a system that fit Gobert perfectly, maximizing his strengths and hiding his weaknesses. He apparently chaffed at the fact he wasn't getting more touches on offense and it led to conflict with Donovan Mitchell. But the Jazz coaches knew what they were doing. Gobert played in a shelter of complete comfort and never had to deal with adversity. He's always played soft in my eyes so I'm not surprised by what we're seeing. He's been exposed with the Wolves and players are no longer afraid to drive the lane when he's there. Players are taking him on physically even more than previously.

If this team lacks heart or toughness compared to last season's team, you don't have to look further than the Gobert trade to figure out why. That deal sent toughness and heart out the door and brought back the opposite. That's the elephant in the room that most Wolves fans don't want to acknowledge. But it's something this team's front office had better come to grips with really soon if they haven't already.

Re: Damn... you didn't have to murder them and then set the bodies on fire.

Posted: Sun Jan 01, 2023 11:26 pm
by Lipoli390
If you trust Dane Moore's reporting, it doesn't look like either Rudy or Finch will be leaving any time soon:

Dane Moore: Every conversation I've had with people in the Wolves org since the day the hired Tim Connelly is that they're committed to a long-term vision with Rudy Gobert and Chris Finch. Which is to say, as I get many questions, that I'd be shocked if they make a big change any time soon. 8 hours ago - via Twitter DaneMooreNBA

Re: Damn... you didn't have to murder them and then set the bodies on fire.

Posted: Mon Jan 02, 2023 3:50 am
by Tactical unit
lipoli390 wrote:If you trust Dane Moore's reporting, it doesn't look like either Rudy or Finch will be leaving any time soon:

Dane Moore: Every conversation I've had with people in the Wolves org since the day the hired Tim Connelly is that they're committed to a long-term vision with Rudy Gobert and Chris Finch. Which is to say, as I get many questions, that I'd be shocked if they make a big change any time soon. 8 hours ago - via Twitter DaneMooreNBA


After 3 games right before tipoff of our 4th game I went in hard on this team in the Wolves 2022-23 Outlook.
Here's my post....

What has this team shown to think they have gotten over the things that plagued them in the playoffs last year?

Still embracing hero ball.
Time to be great yet we lack hustle and effort.
This bunch is still a highly emotional complaining oriented group.

Maybe I just expect too much and more time is needed cause it's early right?

I really don't want to hear it's early, when you overpay for DPOY type and trade away role players and bring in new talent.

Wolves 2022-23 Outlook = Exposable team that needs to take massive strides.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I was told it's too early, I'm sorry but you don't trade away the effort of Bev, V8, Beasley and think there won't be repercussions. Bev was the veteran heart and sole, V8 spread infections effort and Beasley while not the most amazing defender brought firepower and effort every night.

I think most the season will be written off as missing KAT but the problems are much deeper than that.

I'll continue to say we need a major shake up and why wait?

Re: Damn... you didn't have to murder them and then set the bodies on fire.

Posted: Mon Jan 02, 2023 2:18 pm
by KG4Ever
I looked at the remaining Wolves schedule and its quite tough except for a near term stretch with three winnable games against the Rockets. Even going .500 the rest of the way is a challenge and to play well enough to match last year's win total would be very difficult. Sure, getting KAT back in a few weeks should help, but to finish in top 8 will be difficult. The best chance to do that still involves a major trade (DLO) and/or a coaching change (Quin Snyder, Udoko etc). I prefer trying to trade DLO and get someone who can get our offense moving better and I'd try to land Lowry, Conley or Rubio as I mentioned in another thread. I'd add Monte Morris/Wright (if Wash capitulates) or Tyus Jones (though not sure what we could offer to entice Memphis)

Re: Damn... you didn't have to murder them and then set the bodies on fire.

Posted: Tue Jan 03, 2023 7:17 am
by Sundog
lipoli390 wrote:If you trust Dane Moore's reporting, it doesn't look like either Rudy or Finch will be leaving any time soon:

Dane Moore: Every conversation I've had with people in the Wolves org since the day the hired Tim Connelly is that they're committed to a long-term vision with Rudy Gobert and Chris Finch. Which is to say, as I get many questions, that I'd be shocked if they make a big change any time soon. 8 hours ago - via Twitter DaneMooreNBA


I'd be surprised if there's any kind of course correction, either in management, coaching or key players. Part of my reasoning on that is hubris on the part of the Wolves. But the larger part is that we haven't seen any significant amount of time where KAT, Rudy, Ant were all healthy and playing -- plus the loss of time for Prince, JMac. None of *know* whether this mix of players can work because of that fact. So, what would ownership base a course correction on? They believe in the direction they set out on this summer. I think they will stay the course. I could see trades involving Dlo, Naz and/or Nowell this season though.