Minnesota Sports Forum

Give Flip the credit he deserves! I am turning 30 on March 1st and the only good times I recall as a fan growing up are when he was head coach. Flip has rotations that confuse me at times and fails to exploit other teams weakness the way I think is sometimes possible. However he can draw up a play that yields a good look and uses timeout's rather well to keep his team focused. With the results though one has to wonder how good of a defensive coach Flip can be or are the results due to youth and lack of experience together? Maybe another excuse is injuries?

Nikola Pekovic - You can do both better than Pek and worse than Pek but if he can stay healthy, I think we'd see him turn into one of the very best. His low post scoring is predicated on muscle and he has shown the touch for a jumper. I think this is where he becomes a beast, health and refinement of the jumper make him a scoring machine.

Thaddeus Young - I see him becoming better and his defense is more acceptable than I thought when he came here. I actually like his production if playing SF but I think he is better at turn and facing up against PF's than SF's. I'd prefer a better player long term so I kinda hope we move him but won't be surprised if he stays put. He is expiring next year and his production is acceptable so I'm ok with one more year of Thad if we go that route.

Andrew Wiggins - He has to set the tone going forward by becoming our most improved player going into next year. We all see the talent, its up to him to go from exciting to great. He needs to assert himself more often as I see him disappearing and being to passive in far to many games.

Kevin Martin - I doubt he gets traded which is fine when you consider he will have two more years and pure scorers are always in demand. He's not overly expensive and while I prefer better defenders than him, he does his job. I'd keep him just because I see his value being the same next year and he improves our playoff chances for next season. I am also ok with moving him and letting LaVine and Wiggins fill passing lanes for Rubio on fast breaks.

Ricky Rubio - Our leader makes everyone better and is finally becoming enough of a threat offensively to become special. His health is the only thing that worries me, Flip will probably bring in a decent backup next year to move LaVine into more of a SG role.

Lorenzo Brown - I want to like him for his length but maybe some time over seas would help. I doubt he is here next year.

Zach LaVine - He has excellent athleticism and is quite the dunk master! I see him as a SG that should be encouraged to play at space jam warp speed. I love when he pushes a break as he reminds me of Westbrook flying down court. My question is how long will it take for a break out? He is only 19 yrs old so be patient.

Shabazz Muhammad - A monster on the O-glass with low post moves and what appears to be a solid mid-range and 3pt shots. Gotta hand it to Flip he's a better player than I thought he'd be.

Anthony Bennett - Talent is abundant but does he have the drive? Sometimes he looks lost and is it me or does he seem to avoid contact. I want to see either a low post move developed or a much better turn and face game. I always expect the other team to just attack him every play when he is in the game but more often than not they just run offensive sets than Isolate him. I think he is soft and won't fully realize his potential but he's got massive upside if he puts it all together.

Gorgui Dieng - He's shown improvement and that's the goal for him.....get better every day! While I am left wanting more out of him, I think we gotta be patient as he's still raw. I'd like to see him work a little on not over contesting everything as he leaves a big to contest and that big gets put back dunks more often then I am comfortable with. Part of that is on his teammates for allowing penetration but he stands to get better at that along with blocking shots toward teammates instead of to the stands.

Adreian Payne - I thought the price was expensive considering ATL's objectives in making a deal but he has potential and a cheap contract. His athletic profile, length and offensive skill set provides high upside, but I question his defense, in college I seen him as soft but the defensive potential is there.

Chase Budinger - Lets not dream that he gets traded or agrees to a buyout. He is a shell of his former self and it sucks, I expect him to realize his true potential to this franchise as an expiring deal trade asset come next year.

Gary Neal - If he plays the mentor role and provides points off the bench I am cool with his championship experience being around our young team. However you gotta think he wants to be on a playoff team so look for him to be bought out or traded.

Robbie Hummel - He is an NBA player and an easy player to cheer for. I do however hope that we realize this is not the type a player that you spend money on. If he wants to play for a million dollars fine but he's not enough of an asset to care about if he cost more than that.

Glenn Robinson III - Please prove me wrong but I don't see much in GRIII.

Now Flip isn't the best in the league but I think we are in good hands and I like the players he has selected. Building from within keeps us youthful, loaded with cheap contracts, and exciting. We need to continue to focus on player development as growing what we have and spending correctly will determine how great this team can be. I want to see Flip take us back to the playoffs and get the credit he deserves before handing the team off to a better coach or maybe I'll call shots and say he hands off the team to his son down the road.

Anyone know if a team has the rights to Seth Curry? If his rights are not owned, he might be worth a shot out of the D-League.

Does Flip want all the credit he deserves? We have the second worst record in the entire NBA :-). In all seriousness, I'm not hating on Flip. I realize he was dealt a tough hand with the injuries and all the new players. I'm just saying he hasn't really accomplished much yet this time around. I'm pulling for the guy. There are some neat, shiny new pieces. But it's on him to make them all fit together and start winning games. I'll give Flip a pass for this year. For all I know, he went into tank mode to get another good asset (top 5 pick this year). If so - good for him. But if we are not a .500 or better team next year...I'm not sure he'll have a lot of supporters. As I've written before...coaches generally get two years to turn things around or they are out. And if that happens - it could get complicated. Would they fire him as GM too? If not, what coach would want to come in and work with Flip the GM/former coach? Let's hope it never gets to that. There is plenty of talent on this team now. I hope they start coming together now that everyone is healthy.

I am not a Flip hater. I think he really should look to step down as coach this year if he can find the right guy. (Hoiberg) I don't think he needs to win 41 games next year, but getting 30 will be a must. Only move that I really don't like is the Payne move. If Payne turns into a player it won't hurt as much, but at the time of the trade we gave up to much.

What's giving up too much? It's a supply and demand market. Atlanta has been pursing the best deal possible for the last couple of weeks. If Flip decides Payne is the best risk/reward PF out there, then you do whatever you have to do to get him (although you have to draw the line somewhere).

A HUGE weakness for the Wolves is at PF. Thad had proved he is NOT a starting PF, at least in the West, plus the Wolves have no control over his destination after this season. Bennett has NOT shown he can be counted on (ala Derrick Williams). Other than Dieng playing out of position, the Wolves have NOTHING at PF.

Payne gives Flip a guy he trusts can develop into a productive PF. He has 29 games left evaluate how quickly Payne can develop. But Payne is just one PF. PF will still be a top priority this offseason, whether in the draft, free agency or by trade.

60WinTim wrote:What's giving up too much? It's a supply and demand market. Atlanta has been pursing the best deal possible for the last couple of weeks. If Flip decides Payne is the best risk/reward PF out there, then you do whatever you have to do to get him (although you have to draw the line somewhere).

A HUGE weakness for the Wolves is at PF. Thad had proved he is NOT a starting PF, at least in the West, plus the Wolves have no control over his destination after this season. Bennett has NOT shown he can be counted on (ala Derrick Williams). Other than Dieng playing out of position, the Wolves have NOTHING at PF.

Payne gives Flip a guy he trusts can develop into a productive PF. He has 29 games left evaluate how quickly Payne can develop. But Payne is just one PF. PF will still be a top priority this offseason, whether in the draft, free agency or by trade.

Tim, I don't disagree with anything you wrote and I'm excited to see Payne play. But I do understand the other side of the argument as well. 1st round picks are sort of like new cars. They have their greatest value unused. And once you use them, they generally go down in value. In this case, Payne is now obviously another year older than last year (he's two years older than Anthony Bennett). In addition, I believe there still might be some concerns over his medical condition (I believe he has some sort of lung capacity issue). So, it would not be unreasonable to believe they could have picked up a similar player with that pick that would be younger and without the medical concern. That being said...I have not seen this guy play, so I'm hoping Flip can tell the doubters to stick it like the lady in the GoDaddy commercial: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VIBfctISM9M

I completely agree, Tim...I think Flip made a good deal here. Payne is a long, athletic PF with great shooting range and character. And he went 15th in a draft that is widely considered the best in years, and was rumored to go even higher. Most likely the pick that we will eventually surrender will be a lower pick and perhaps much lower, and if it is conveyed in 2017, early reports are that will be a relatively weak draft. Payne's plantars fasciitis early in the season and Atlanta's big man depth have limited him to 3 games and 18 minutes total this season, so nobody knows how he will perform in the NBA, but he certainly seems to have the physical tools to succeed. I'm not saying he will be the certain all-star that college teammate Draymond Green says he will be, but he is as likely to be our starting PF on day 1 next season as Young or Bennett.

I think we rushed to fill the hole honestly. We would have been better served letting AB play more and if it doesn't work out we gave him the rest of the season and it likely improved our draft position. The biggest concern with Payne is he didn't light the D-League on fire either.

I think Clint Capela is a better prospect then Payne and Houston likely would have traded him for the pick. 3 years younger and average 3 times the blocks, shotting over 10% higher FG%, and grabbing the same boards in about 7 minutes less a game. I just think this was a poor value and we reached. Now if we can get a lottery protected pick for Thad then this is a wash in my eyes, but would rather have Thad then Payne. (basically would have traded the Miami pick for Payne who Flip would have drafted anyways)

I woudl also rather have Jarnell Stokes or even Mitch McGeary then Payne. Also why not ask for Walter Tavares instead. They obviously felt it was better to keep him. It is not like the Hawks couldn't cut a player to make roster room then give up a good prospect.

"A HUGE weakness for the Wolves is at PF. Thad had proved he is NOT a starting PF, at least in the West"

Mehh. I disagree, clearly, and Thad's play since having some normalcy around him in the lineup attest to his ability to be a starting caliber player. If you can't see the difference it makes having your starting PG, SG and C next to Thad, then we're not watching the same team.

I'm not saying Thad's All-NBA, but you (Tim) continually post like he's garbage and needs to be replaced. We actually have bigger issues (guards off the bench), though every position could use a shot in the arm of talent.

Payne isn't the long-term answer. Some you proclaimed at the year's start that Bennett would be, and that he'd take Young's starting spot. That was foolishness. The best thing to hope out of Payne is that he evolves into a good option off the bench. We don't have that right now in Bennett.

We are watching the same player, Cam. And he absolutely is playing better with Rubio's return. But IMO, he would be one of the weak links on a good team if he is your starting PF.

And why was it "foolishness" to hope that Bennett might blossom this year? You wrote him off after his issues last year. Yet you are still hopeful Stauskas is going to blossom in his second year?

What did Bennett do to make you so subjective on him? That's something you're really never explained, and may help those people who get offended at your endless rants on him.