Minnesota Sports Forum

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/how-jimmy-butler-can-get-wolves-back-to-playoffs-why-wiggins-is-biggest-wild-card/

I think this is a very good analysis and take on things. This guy has Wiggins as our X-factor, unsurprisingly...see excerpt below the break.

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Wiggins is the biggest question on this team

Wiggins occupies a very divided space among analysts and fans. The talent is undeniable. The style is familiar, and ... retro. He's a high-usage, low-efficiency player who doesn't defend, pass or rebound at a high level. Everything he can be is tied up in potential. If he becomes a better shooter, if his defense comes around, if he suddenly develops a playmaking instinct that has never revealed itself, he has the raw talent to be something special.

The biggest issue: Wiggins' game is built off being a pure scorer in an era where those players are less valuable and harder to build around than ever. Wiggins is at a crossroads. He has to decide if he's going to be ball-dominant, or if he's going to help his team win.

It is less valuable being a pure scorer in the modern era? That is beyond ridiculous and completely negates the perspective of the writer to me. Wiggins needs to be more efficient as a pure scorer but there are a few pure scorers who were just on a championship team named Durant and Curry. It's never been a better time to be a pure scorer if you can do it efficiently.

I think the author emphasized Wiggins lack of efficiency and that's what he probably meant by "pure scorer". Besides, Durant and Curry aren't just pure scorers that do so with elite efficiency - they are both well rounded basketball players. Curry has elite handles and play making ability. If they didn't have Draymond setting the table so often, Curry would probably be averaging nearly double digit assists to go along with his scoring.

And to add insult to injury, Curry has even averaged more rebounds per game than Andrew, despite being 5+ inches shorter and not having nearly the same athleticism.

Q12543 wrote:I think the author emphasized Wiggins lack of efficiency and that's what he probably meant by "pure scorer". Besides, Durant and Curry aren't just pure scorers that do so with elite efficiency - they are both well rounded basketball players. Curry has elite handles and play making ability. If they didn't have Draymond setting the table so often, Curry would probably be averaging nearly double digit assists to go along with his scoring.

And to add insult to injury, Curry has even averaged more rebounds per game than Andrew, despite being 5+ inches shorter and not having nearly the same athleticism.

So a pure scorer is an inefficient scorer? I think he may need to go back to journalism school if we have to guess what he means.

Durant and Curry have become well rounded basketball players. Both experienced criticism early in their careers for not being well rounded, now when surrounded by optimal talent and winning everyone lauds them as "well rounded". I am confident the same will happen with Wiggins. The nuances of the game have always taken time for young players.

Q got it right. Curry and Durant are both very well-rounded players. Curry is a tremendous passer. When analyzing draft prospects the year Curry entered the draft, Bobby Knight referred to him as the "best passer in college basketball." Durant is a terrific rebounder who also blocks shots and makes his teammates better. He's averaged 7.2 boards, 1 block and 1.2 steals per game over his career. While not what I'd call a playmaker, he's averaged nearly 4 assists per game over his career. Last season he averaged nearly 5 assists per game to go with 1.6 blocks, and 8.3 rebounds. And of course, he's also a prolific scorer who scores efficiently - averaging 27 points per game with a 53.5% eFG percentage over his career.

Thus far in his now three-year old career, Wiggins is a one-dimensional player -- namely a scorer. He averaged 23 points per game last season, but only averaged around 4 rebounds and 2.1 assists. And his 48% eFG stat highlights his need to become a more efficient scorer. What's frustrating is that he clearly has the physical talent to be much more that he's shown thus far in his career.

Thankfully, the arrival of Butler gives us an elite all-around player. Towns also looks like he's developing into an all-around star, pulling down 12.3 rebounds to go with his 25 points per game last season. Note that Towns also had 2.7 assists per game last season. And that's why I don't think the Wolves can become a top team even if Wiggins fails to develop an all-around game. He simply needs to improve his three-point shooting and become a more efficient and even more prolific scorer.

The keys to this team, in my view, will be Butler, Towns, and Belly. We know what Butler will bring. He question is whether he stays healthy and gives us 76 games like he gave the Bulls last season or plays only 65-67 games due to various injuries as he did the previous three seasons. Towns needs to pick up where he left off last season as a scorer and rebounder while also becoming more of a defensive presence, which he clearly has the talent and passion to do. Belly needs to come back fully recovered from his broken foot, continue the rebounding and defense we saw from him last season and finally get his three-pointers to fall consistently as he did in Europe. A healthy Butler, defensively improved Towns and healthy more efficient scoring Belly will propel this team forward as they combine with an all-star, caliber, durable PG in Teague, and two very solid, reliable bigs in Gorgui and Taj.

To make it all work, Wiggins simply has to take and make more threes while continuing to draw fouls and put up 23-26 points per game. If he develops into the anything close to the on-ball defender he's capable of being that's icing in my view. And if he also starts pulling down 6 rather than 4 rebounds per game, that's double icing. Wiggins doesn't have to handle the ball this season. We have Teague and Butler for that. He doesn't have to create for his teammates. Teague, Butler will do that while Towns and Gorgui have already shown the vision and instincts to do it as well.

Wiggins is still very young and he'll have peers like Butler and Gibson pushing and holding him accountable. So I fully expect to see significant improvement from Wiggins. I don't expect him to start pulling down 7 rebounds per game or dishing out 4-6 assists. However, I do think he'll up his scoring average and the efficiency with which he scores. I see him taking a significant volume of threes and hitting at least 36% of them. I also see him pulling down 5 boards per game and defending much better than he did last season (understanding that he set a very low bar for himself). If by chance, he transforms into something approaching the player he has the potential to be, then look out Warriors. :)

here are some thoughts.

I wish I could have a sophomore slump like Towns. That one part of the article I didn't get. Lol

The author made a case for Wiggins being efficient playing off the ball more and suggesting he could be very good if he does more of that. I wouldn't be shocked to see it happen.

The author broke down how good of a playmaker Butler can be which was interesting. Teague is no slouch either. That reminds m of something I saw on twitter today.

https://twitter.com/hpbasketball/status/898429246778949632

"This is nuts.

Jeff Teague was 97th percentile in offensive points per possession including assists last year.

Rubio was 98th percentile"

Butler Teague Wiggins Towns those guys could be really dynamic, a nightmare, unguardable, pick your poison etc etc etc. I think they are going to create a lot of looks for each other and even at the 3 point line.

thedoper wrote:

Q12543 wrote:I think the author emphasized Wiggins lack of efficiency and that's what he probably meant by "pure scorer". Besides, Durant and Curry aren't just pure scorers that do so with elite efficiency - they are both well rounded basketball players. Curry has elite handles and play making ability. If they didn't have Draymond setting the table so often, Curry would probably be averaging nearly double digit assists to go along with his scoring.

And to add insult to injury, Curry has even averaged more rebounds per game than Andrew, despite being 5+ inches shorter and not having nearly the same athleticism.

So a pure scorer is an inefficient scorer? I think he may need to go back to journalism school if we have to guess what he means.

Durant and Curry have become well rounded basketball players. Both experienced criticism early in their careers for not being well rounded, now when surrounded by optimal talent and winning everyone lauds them as "well rounded". I am confident the same will happen with Wiggins. The nuances of the game have always taken time for young players.

Well, you can nit-pick his verbiage if you'd like, but his point is Wiggins needs to do more to help the team than just be a volume scorer that does so with mediocre efficiency. Monta Ellis, Antawn Jamison, Rudy Gay, Kevin Martin (without the efficiency)....those are some worst-case scenarios for Wiggins.

And Curry and Durant were both better all-around players than Wiggins by their 3rd year. Bad examples.

Q12543 wrote:

thedoper wrote:

Q12543 wrote:I think the author emphasized Wiggins lack of efficiency and that's what he probably meant by "pure scorer". Besides, Durant and Curry aren't just pure scorers that do so with elite efficiency - they are both well rounded basketball players. Curry has elite handles and play making ability. If they didn't have Draymond setting the table so often, Curry would probably be averaging nearly double digit assists to go along with his scoring.

And to add insult to injury, Curry has even averaged more rebounds per game than Andrew, despite being 5+ inches shorter and not having nearly the same athleticism.

So a pure scorer is an inefficient scorer? I think he may need to go back to journalism school if we have to guess what he means.

Durant and Curry have become well rounded basketball players. Both experienced criticism early in their careers for not being well rounded, now when surrounded by optimal talent and winning everyone lauds them as "well rounded". I am confident the same will happen with Wiggins. The nuances of the game have always taken time for young players.

Well, you can nit-pick his verbiage if you'd like, but his point is Wiggins needs to do more to help the team than just be a volume scorer that does so with mediocre efficiency. Monta Ellis, Antawn Jamison, Rudy Gay, Kevin Martin (without the efficiency)....those are some worst-case scenarios for Wiggins.

And Curry and Durant were both better all-around players than Wiggins by their 3rd year. Bad examples.

There shouldn't be much debate about this. Thus far in his career, Wiggins has been a high volume but relatively low efficiency scorer. And he hasn't excelled in any other facet of the game, which makes him one-dimensional. You're right about Curry and Durant. I'll put some numbers to it for Doper's benefit. In his 3rd season, Durant 7.8 rebounds, 1.4 steals and 1 block per game to go with his 30 points with and eFG of 50.3%. Wiggin's 3rd season wasn't even in the same stratosphere. Likewise, in his 2nd season Curry averaged 5.8 assists, 4 rebounds,1.5 steals and an eFG of 55%. (I used Curry's 2nd season for comparison because he missed most of his 3rd season).

The best comparison for Wiggins would be Melo. He averaged 4.9 rebounds, 2.7 assists, 1.1 steal and 0.5 blocks to go with his 26.5 points per game that season with an eFG of 49.3%. He actually had 5.7 rebounds in his second season and has averaged 6.6 rebounds over his career. So you can see that Melo's early-career stats were fairly similar to Andrew's, but even then Melo was a better rebounder and a slightly more efficient scorer.

I really want Wiggins to suceed and I would LOVE to see him make a huge jump into becoming a complete player this next season. But the facts speak for themselves and tell us what Wiggins is right now. Unfortunately, history tells us that players usually don't transform themselves from one-dimensional scorers into complete two-way players after their 3rd season. But there are exceptions to ever rule, so I'm still hopeful. In any event, I am optimistic about Wiggins becoming a more efficient scorer and improving his on-ball defense.

lipoli390 wrote:

Q12543 wrote:

thedoper wrote:

Q12543 wrote:I think the author emphasized Wiggins lack of efficiency and that's what he probably meant by "pure scorer". Besides, Durant and Curry aren't just pure scorers that do so with elite efficiency - they are both well rounded basketball players. Curry has elite handles and play making ability. If they didn't have Draymond setting the table so often, Curry would probably be averaging nearly double digit assists to go along with his scoring.

And to add insult to injury, Curry has even averaged more rebounds per game than Andrew, despite being 5+ inches shorter and not having nearly the same athleticism.

So a pure scorer is an inefficient scorer? I think he may need to go back to journalism school if we have to guess what he means.

Durant and Curry have become well rounded basketball players. Both experienced criticism early in their careers for not being well rounded, now when surrounded by optimal talent and winning everyone lauds them as "well rounded". I am confident the same will happen with Wiggins. The nuances of the game have always taken time for young players.

Well, you can nit-pick his verbiage if you'd like, but his point is Wiggins needs to do more to help the team than just be a volume scorer that does so with mediocre efficiency. Monta Ellis, Antawn Jamison, Rudy Gay, Kevin Martin (without the efficiency)....those are some worst-case scenarios for Wiggins.

And Curry and Durant were both better all-around players than Wiggins by their 3rd year. Bad examples.

There shouldn't be much debate about this. Thus far in his career, Wiggins has been a high volume but relatively low efficiency scorer. And he hasn't excelled in any other facet of the game, which makes him one-dimensional. You're right about Curry and Durant. I'll put some numbers to it for Doper's benefit. In his 3rd season, Durant 7.8 rebounds, 1.4 steals and 1 block per game to go with his 30 points with and eFG of 50.3%. Wiggin's 3rd season wasn't even in the same stratosphere. Likewise, in his 2nd season Curry averaged 5.8 assists, 4 rebounds,1.5 steals and an eFG of 55%. (I used Curry's 2nd season for comparison because he missed most of his 3rd season).

The best comparison for Wiggins would be Melo. He averaged 4.9 rebounds, 2.7 assists, 1.1 steal and 0.5 blocks to go with his 26.5 points per game that season with an eFG of 49.3%. He actually had 5.7 rebounds in his second season and has averaged 6.6 rebounds over his career. So you can see that Melo's early-career stats were fairly similar to Andrew's, but even then Melo was a better rebounder and a slightly more efficient scorer.

I really want Wiggins to suceed and I would LOVE to see him make a huge jump into becoming a complete player this next season. But the facts speak for themselves and tell us what Wiggins is right now. Unfortunately, history tells us that players usually don't transform themselves from one-dimensional scorers into complete two-way players after their 3rd season. But there are exceptions to ever rule, so I'm still hopeful. In any event, I am optimistic about Wiggins becoming a more efficient scorer and improving his on-ball defense.

Wow I feel benefited. Hindsight is always 20/20. Steph and Durant were both criticized for not being well rounded early in their careers and were often labeled scorers, that was my only point. I never said Wiggins has been the player either of them are to date, and was aware of all their stats. Well rounded play takes time, that's my only point. It may never come, but I highly doubt it with Wiggins talent and work ethic. Which is why I assume all of his coaches still gush over him.

Doper -- Durant's and Curry's stats in their 2nd and 3rd seasons show that they were NOT one-dimensional players back then. This has nothing to do with hindsight other than looking back and seeing that, unlike Wiggins, Durant and Curry were multi-dimensional players even early in their careers in spite of the labels you say people were attaching to them. They were scorers who excelled in other facets of the game from the beginning. Not sure why you keep arguing this point. Wiggin's career to day is comparable to Melo's. Whether he becomes more of a complete player than Melo became remains an open question. The fact that Thibs appears to remain high on Wiggins gives me hope that he'll blossom into more than just a scorer. We'll see.