Minnesota Sports Forum

We had great seats just 3 rows behind the Wolves bench in Cox Arena. For those of you who haven't been there, Cox Arena is like a small college arena -- small an intimate. It's a lot of fun to watch a game there. Sitting where we were, we felt like we were part of the bench. Good things Thibs wasn't coaching. He would have driven us nuts being so close. Lucas seems to want to be like Thibs, displaying some of the same sour facial expressions and attempting to direct the players repeatedly on the floor. I sure didn't see anything to suggest he has a future as an NBA head coach.

Another cool thing was that we sat next to a friend of Okogie from Georgia Tech. His name is Mario. He's two years older than Josh and just graduated. He's a basketball junkie who is looking to work as a scout and eventually a front office executive in the NBA. I asked him what Josh thinks of being drafted by the Wolves. He said, Josh didn't care who drafted him. He just wanted to play in the NBA. I asked what Josh thinks he needs to work most on and he said his shooting. Even though he shots 38% from the three, Josh knows he has a lot of work to do to become a consistent shooter. He also knows he needs to work on his ballhandling. He said that Josh understands, like everyone else, that his game right now is defense and slashing. He said no one will outwork Josh. I asked him about other playes on the Wolves Summer League squad -- what he or Josh thinks of them. Mario said that he loves Jaylen Barford out of Arkansas. He said Josh was raving about him from their Summer League practice. Jaylen averaged almost 18 points per game this past season with Arkansas. He said he's a combo guard who can run the point effectively. He was surprised Jaylen didn't get any playing time tonight.

As for the game, wow was it ugly!! But it also turned out to be a fun game to watch as the Wolves clawed their way back from nearly 20 down before losing by 1 after an ill-advised time-out and horrible play call (if you can even call it a play call) by Lucas with 4 seconds left. Overall, the Wolves looked vastly inferior to the Nuggets in talent and coaching. The Nuggets had good spacing, had lots of movement off the ball with lots of cutters to the basket while the Wolves Summer League squad looked a lot like the big league club with with less talent. It was a familiar sight watching the poor spacing, lack of off-ball movement and nearly pure iso-style offense -- extreme iso even by Summer League standards. The Wolves shooting was clearly terrible. Some of that was just poor shooting while much of it was poor shot selection. But this is Summer League and it was the first pro-level game for a lot of these guys.

As you can see from the box score, none of the Wolves players put up good numbers, except maybe Jefferson. But one of the great things about seeing games live, especially up so close, is you can really get a feeling for the skills, effort and raw physical abilities of individual players. As I see it, the Wolves had only three potential NBA-caliber players on the floor tonight -- Okogie, Bates-Diop and Charles Cooke. Jonathan Stark played well and helped get the Wolves back in the game, but he only played 4 minutes, so I'm not prepared to declare him having NBA potential. The point of watching Summer League games, aside from just the fun of it, is to get a sense of each player's play and potential. Here's my breakdown of some of the individual Wolves players tonight:

1. Josh Okogie. I have to start with our first round pick. Sad to say that his handle is bad for an NBA shooting guard, which confirms scoring reports we're read. Not only is his handle fairly loose, but he has absolutely no shake in his game with the ball -- not change of pace or change of direction. He's strictly a put-you-head-down north south slasher. And in spite of his terrific hops, he showed a tendency to get his shot blocked fairly easily. His didn't shoot well tonight, but his shot doesn't look bad. So I'm not too concerned about his shooting. But now the really good news. Josh Okogie tonight was everything he's been advertised to be and then some when it comes to defense and hustle. Some of it shows in the box score - 2 steals and 3 blocks. One of those blocks from behind reminded me of the LeBron block in the playoffs a couple seasons ago. What the box score doesn't show was Josh diving to the floor for and beating other guys to loose balls. One thing I really loved was the intensity in his face. I can tell you there is no Wes Johnson in this guy - none!! It's all business with him. Okogie seemed to really struggle early, but his friend Mario assumed me that Okogie would get stronger as the game wore on. His words turned out to be pretty prophetic because that's exactly what Josh did. You could see him gaining confidence as the game progressed. It's only one Summer League game, so we have to take initial observations with a grain of salt. My initial take is that he has a longer way to go than I had hoped on the offensive end, but that he'll be a defensive contributor fairly early on in the season. I'm concerned about his overall offensive potential because of his shaky handle and lack of any change of speed or direction in his game. But he doesn't have the really shaky high dribble of Wiggins and, unlike Wiggins, this guy looks like he has a fire burning in his belly.

2. Bates-Diop. He's really long as advertised and plays intelligently. I like his shot even though he didn't shoot well tonight. He played for a stretch with blood running down his face and he played some of his best basketball during that stretch. He seems to have some toughness to his game. I liked his basketball instincts. He doesn't go at 100 mph like Josh, but he's active and smart. Like Okogie, there doesn't appear to be any Wes Johnson in him. I think he's more advanced offensively than Okogie.

3. Charles Cooke. I was surprised by how big he is. And I liked his effort and athleticism. I can see him sticking in the NBA beyond last season.

4. Amile Jefferson. I'm starting with the Wolves players we're most familiar with. He's also the Wolves player who had the best overall stats tonight with 14 reabounds and 23 points on 60% shooting. But you'll note I didn't list him among the individuals playing for the Wolves tonight who looked like potential NBA players. There's good reason for that. He doesn't! I now understand why he didn't get minutes with the Wolves last season in spite of his prowess in the G-League. He's simply not very talented. He works his butt and might be and end-of-bench guy on an NBA squad. But he's really unathletic with a very limited skill set and not much strength. He's likeable based on how hard he plays, but no one should be holding out hope that he's going to be a contributor with the Wolves this season.

As for the others? I have no idea why Thibs game Jared Terrell a 2-way contract so quickly. He looked terrible. But he didn't look as bad as Andrew White or Dennis Clifford. I have no idea why those two are even on the Summer League squad, much less why they got playing time tonight while Jaylen Barford got no time. Isaiah Cousins looked OK, but I don't see him as an NBA player.

That's it for now. I'll report back after Sunday's game.

I still have hopes that okogie will become a jae crowder type abd at worst shumpert with a better attitude and health. Those guys have a place in this league.

I'm not too concerned with his boxscore numbers.

Thanks for the update.

Thanks for the report Lip! Are you going to other summer league games?

I saw the same things in Amile. He doesn't have any super wow skills or physical abilities (except maybe above average moving well making him switchable) so yeah it's hard to see him blossom into something I'm a significant way. He knows how to play and does some good things. He is a fun player to watch and puts up impressive numbers. That's something. I'd like to keep him in Iowa one way or another but the priority for me is less than it was a few weeks ago.

I was more intrigued by Terrell than you were. I'd like to see more. It seems like there are skills there and his physical profile is intruiging.

I thought Clifford was a mix of good and bad. I also thought it was interesting that Perry Jones didn't see time. He showed some flashes last year in Iowa before he got hurt. It could have been another tease though.

The offense wasn't great but it's a summer league game. It's worth mentioning that Denver has 2 guards in Morris and Beasley that are more experienced and have been in the system for at least 2 years. Like you said it's earlt let's see how they look in following games. The Wolves could have won this easily they missed a bunch of FTs and some of the easy shots they did get.

Agree on your take of Okogie. I didn't think KBD looked as good as you did but I enjoyed your observations about him. I think he will be a guy that's probably better in an environment that's more structured than someone that just gets out there and starts ballin. He doesn't have the atheltism or overall skill (except maybe that jumper) to overwhelm offensively. That's fine.

Good report, Lip...enjoyed the insights from Josh's friend.

High energy game with some sloppy handles by our draft picks and disappointing 3-point shooting from a roster that was built around the three. That said, Okogie exceeded my expectations on the defensive side of the ball...looked even better than Kris Dunn in his first outing. His footwork and toughness on screens was refreshing, as was his non-stop motor and smooth body control on his blocks. Here are a few highlights from his first game...mostly good on defense, and bad on offense:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mDyckVdFsa4

I was not impressed with KDP's first game. I loved the draft pick, but also was wary of reports about his lack of toughness. He seemed slow and soft in his first game. Here are his highlights:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0heGSLQJf20

Always dangerous to draw any conclusions from SL, especially the first game. But motor is something that is important to me, whether SL or regular season, and Josh clearly has it. I hope KDP picks it up in the next game, because I still think we may have gotten a steal in the second round. I'm looking forward to Sunday and Lip's next report.

To me Okogie looked like the kid in high school who is the best athlete on the soccer team and gets invited to try out for basketball. He doesn't really know what he's doing but he's doing it at a rate twice as fast and hard as anyone else. He was kind of fun to watch but any description of him has to begin with the word raw.

KBD was too passive and never really showed what he can do. But game one just allows you to get to game 2. That's good because I'm not even sure if what we saw last night qualifies as basketball.

CoolBreeze44 wrote:To me Okogie looked like the kid in high school who is the best athlete on the soccer team and gets invited to try out for basketball. He doesn't really know what he's doing but he's doing it at a rate twice as fast and hard as anyone else. He was kind of fun to watch but any description of him has to begin with the word raw.

KBD was too passive and never really showed what he can do. But game one just allows you to get to game 2. That's good because I'm not even sure if what we saw last night qualifies as basketball.

I mainly agree with you on both Okogie and KBD. I completely agree with you that last night's game probably doesn't qualify as basketball. :). My one quibble with you on Okogie is that he actually showed a pretty decent level of floor-awareness and made some nice passes as result. Otherwise, he's definitely raw as said. Accordingly, as I mentioned in my post, he's going to take longer than some of us thought to develop an NBA-level offensive game. But he has some basketball IQ in his game. Sadly, he showed much better cout-awareness than Terrell, a guy who played 4 years in college and was already given a 2-way contract. I worry about his ball-handling and lack of any change f speed or direction in his dribble-drive game. That can work in college the way a 98 mph fastball can work in the minors. But he has to improve substantially on his ballhandling and change of speeds/direction the way a pitcher has to develop a changeup and breaking ball to because a really good major league pitcher.

I think you'd like KDB's game last night a bit better if you saw him in person, but otherwise he did seem a bit passive. He's a good defender and showed the ability to recover quickly when his man initially beat him. I think I'd call him tentative last night more than passive. It will be interesting to see how both rookies perform tomorrow.

What did you think of Cooke? I liked his aggressiveness, size and athleticism.

lipoli390 wrote:

CoolBreeze44 wrote:To me Okogie looked like the kid in high school who is the best athlete on the soccer team and gets invited to try out for basketball. He doesn't really know what he's doing but he's doing it at a rate twice as fast and hard as anyone else. He was kind of fun to watch but any description of him has to begin with the word raw.

KBD was too passive and never really showed what he can do. But game one just allows you to get to game 2. That's good because I'm not even sure if what we saw last night qualifies as basketball.

I mainly agree with you on both Okogie and KBD. I completely agree with you that last night's game probably doesn't qualify as basketball. :). My one quibble with you on Okogie is that he actually showed a pretty decent level of floor-awareness and made some nice passes as result. Otherwise, he's definitely raw as said. Accordingly, as I mentioned in my post, he's going to take longer than some of us thought to develop an NBA-level offensive game. But he has some basketball IQ in his game. Sadly, he showed much better cout-awareness than Terrell, a guy who played 4 years in college and was already given a 2-way contract. I worry about his ball-handling and lack of any change f speed or direction in his dribble-drive game. That can work in college the way a 98 mph fastball can work in the minors. But he has to improve substantially on his ballhandling and change of speeds/direction the way a pitcher has to develop a changeup and breaking ball to because a really good major league pitcher.

I think you'd like KDB's game last night a bit better if you saw him in person, but otherwise he did seem a bit passive. He's a good defender and showed the ability to recover quickly when his man initially beat him. I think I'd call him tentative last night more than passive. It will be interesting to see how both rookies perform tomorrow.

What did you think of Cooke? I liked his aggressiveness, size and athleticism.

I thought Okogie knew exactly what he was doing on defense. On offense I agree with pretty much all of what both of you said) his shot doesn't look broken and he isn't selfish and had his head up enough to make some passes at least.

You can't teach motor, so I love hearing about how JO is doing some work out there. I didn't see the game, but the highlights show that this dude is pretty tenacious. That one block that he controlled and then made the beautiful dime to the man ahead, that was gorgeous. Love it!

But OF COURSE he can't shoot or handle worth a damn, heaven forbid we draft a legit two-way player for once in our lifetimes! I know, I know....it's early.

That second unit is going to be VERY dependent on Rose creating shots. Jones-Rose-Okogie-Tolliver-Dieng. I would hope Butler, KAT or Teague are always in the game so that we don't see Rose basically go Jamaal Crawford on us.